Shred This Part 2

Reply to CK King:

– example –
64 ounces for a backpack
59 oz for a sleeping bag (with a 36 oz under-quilt)

These three items alone total up to just an ounce under TEN pounds! Many of the users of this forum will go out with well UNDER ten pounds of gear in total.

See this gear-list:
http://www.backpackinglight.com/backpackinglight/forums/gear_lists/80a5cd1800fbac69c35fad3f320f5461.pdf

I would advise that you review some gear lists, this will give you a starting point for a much lighter camping experience. And believe me, I love the benefits of the lighter pack, and I love to help anyone who is eager to try something bold. This site also has a LOT of articles on going very light at a very minimal cost, so please don't be intimidated that it might be expensive.

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Also – It's unclear where you plan to hike. The where, when (and with teammates?) are essential info. Without this info, it's pretty hard to offer any insights. Is this the Yukon or the Mojave?

I started a thread titled:
Suggested GEAR LIST ETIQUETTE

– LINK –

http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/forums/thread_display.html?forum_thread_id=31018&skip_to_post=262364#262364

I started this thread because there are some key points that really help when you post a gear list.

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I had the same reaction as MikeC! when I looked at your first list last night–I didn't even know where to start. I'm definitely not an ultralight backpacker like MikeC! (my base weight is 12 lbs., considered heavy on this forum), but looking at your gear, almost everything I have weighs about half as much as what's on your list. Sometimes less than half.

For example, my "Big Four," a lot more "traditional" than Mike's!

Pack (has stays, lumbar pad, hip belt) 28 oz.
Sleeping bag (20*F): 25 oz.
Pad (insulated air pad, 3.5" thick): 13 oz.
Shelter (single wall tent with ample room for me and Labrador retriever): 28 oz (includes stakes)
Total "Big 4": 5.9 lbs.

Consider organizing your list in terms of systems, which makes it a lot easier to analyze–for you as well as for others. An example:
Clothing worn/clothing carried (a single system)
Sleeping/Shelter
Pack
Cooking/Hydration
Navigation (generally includes lighting)
First Aid/Repair
Other (for everything else}

Thanks just the same. Your big four alone show me I have a lot of work to do. Will look at other lists for ideas. Appreciate the help.

Reply to CK King:

–

No, you are missing the biggest secret about going light. It is VERY easy, hardly any work at all!

Simply get a few key peices of lightweight gear (mostly quite inexpensive compared to traditional gear). And then simply don't take any un-needed items.

Simple!

I really only have a few big items to get. The down UQ set me back 200 (KAQ) but after freezing my ass off on a subzero night I'll take it. A down winter sleeping bag is going to set me back next years tax return (well a good chunk of it anyway). Those are much more expensive than the gear they will replace… But then MUCH lighter and worth it. The sleeping bag is my biggest stumbling point (from a winter perspective). The rest of the items silk shirt and underwear will be more affordable and I can replace over them the space of a few weeks.

As I don't use things (in winter) I intend to loose them If I can get to half the volume that will knock the weight down too but will let me get a lighter pack too.

Or am I missing a point here?

BTW if you think this list is heavy…. you should have seen my first one. lol

If you're in a hammock, and you have an underquilt, why not get a top quilt instead of a sleeping bag?

What kind of temps are you planning on being in and where? Knowing this will really help. It's hard to give suggestions without that information.

You should be able to save at least 4 lbs just changing out your backpack and sleeping bag. Quilts are great and worth looking into. The underquilt seems heavy for a down underquilt.

Rain Jacket – definitely heavy at 16 oz. Even if you don't want to use something like driducks, you should be able to get this to 10 oz and likely less.

Fleece Jacket – heavy, replace with something lighter. Is this for at camp or for hiking in? Unless temps are really low, I get too hot on the move wearing fleece.

Light Wool slacks – seem heavy as well. Try replacing with something lighter.

If you add an email address to your account which will enable personal messaging, I can send you a winter-ish list I just created which has a hammock included. It may give you some ideas.

"What kind of temps are you planning on being in and where? Knowing this will really help. It's hard to give suggestions without that information."

The Gammot. From 80 plus in the summer to subzero ( or when I cry uncle) in the winter.

"You should be able to save at least 4 lbs just changing out your backpack and sleeping bag. Quilts are great and worth looking into. The underquilt seems heavy for a down underquilt."

The UQ I have now is an ENO Ember. The down is in the mail. This weekend I will experiment with the ENO and a bed sheet (summer only obviously) In two weeks I'll do the same with the KAQ Down. If it works I'll ditch my bag entirely until the temps drop again. Which brings me to my next questions.

How do quilts do with hammocks? Sorry but I am actually trying to eliminate tent/ground sleeping here. I like the feeling of being rocked to sleep (inner infant I guess), not having bumps in my back, and not having to even think about waking up in a puddle for leaving too much of the foot print out. I went hanging once with my daughter and have never looked back. ( Except at minus 5 when I cried uncle and bugged out. that was my own damned fault. No Underquilt. BRRRRR I froze my ass of on that one.lol)

Down Sleeping bags are expensive. How do Comparable quilts compare in price?

"Rain Jacket – definitely heavy at 16 oz. Even if you don't want to use something like driducks, you should be able to get this to 10 oz and likely less."

I'll look around. But its a lot better than the GI Issue gortex parka I was using.

"Fleece Jacket – heavy, replace with something lighter. Is this for at camp or for hiking in? Unless temps are really low, I get too hot on the move wearing fleece."

This is for camp. I do have a 550-600 FP down liner for the forementioned parka but thats heavier than the fleece. Considering replacement with a 800 FP Down jacket.

"Light Wool slacks – seem heavy as well. Try replacing with something lighter."

This I am willing to take inspite of the weight. I am getting tired of buying nylon pants because an ember popped out of the fire and attatched to my legs. Wool won't hold an ember. I am also still looking around good will for a silk shirt in my size to replace the rayon. Should save a couple ounces.

Thanks for the input. I just pulled my pack apart and repacked it according to the new list Saved ounces this time not pounds so it looks like I am officially down to pull and replace with lighter items. Because I have bottomed out on functionality.

Quilts are GREAT for hammocks. Easier than using on the ground in my opinion because its much easier to tuck and avoid drafts. For prices, check out:

http://www.hammockgear.com
http://www.tewaunderquilts.webs.com
http://www.leighlounderquilts.webs.com
http://www.jacksrbetter.com
http://warbonnetoutdoors.com
http://www.wildernesslogics.com
http://arrowheadequipment.webs.com

There are others but that will give you a start. You're probably already aware, but http://www.hammockforums.net is a great resource. I have a te-wa quilt and love it.

"From 80 plus in the summer to subzero ( or when I cry uncle) in the winter."

For summer hangs (90s during the day) I've used the JacksRBetter Weather Shield as my UQ. Worked great and weighs around 7 oz. Not sure if they sell it anymore, but worth asking.

If you are truly trying to go lighter, NIX the hammock and just sleep on the ground. This will save a lot, including set up time and camping locations.

The hammock is NOT required for comfortable and safe camping, and it certainly makes your pack heavier. If your goal is to lighten your load I would advocate liberating yourself from the hammock.

You can still be UL with a hammock. And sleeping above ground rocks!
Have you ever tried one Mike?

I agree with Ken–hammocks rock even if you don't sleep in it every night. Consider a Nano-7 or a lightweight homemade version. Having one greatly increases the number of campsite options–no matter how steep the terrain. They also are great as a chair or a quick noontime nap when traveling.

nm. I was just being mean. Oh well.

Yikes – I wasn't trying to be mean. Somebody creates a post titled "SHREAD THIS LIST" and he was encouraging us to be bold. He asked how to reduce his pack weight, and I offered some insights.

He wrote: "please DON'T BE KIND. Shred this to help me break the 20# barrier"

Sorry if I come across as a zealot, but I take weight-saving seriously. It's helped me get reinvigorated about backpacking again after ignoring it for years. I've re-found something I love.

Honestly, Mike, I think you responded thoughtfully to what the OP wanted. He wanted to shed weight, and your suggestions were in line with that. He doesn't have to take the advice offered.

The recommendations were inline w/what many use on BPL.

And the OP did ask for the "down & dirty", IMO.

Keep on keepin' on!

Zealot? Defender of the Faith indeed! You *do* need to get out more :)

It is difficult to get someone to change paradigms. We do cling to our perceptions and get stuck, even when we want to change. Other than taking too many toys and items that aren't used, I find people get stuck on trying to cover the "what ifs," having an underlying fear of nature and the outdoors, and lack a grasp of what is really needed to stay warm and dry. Those issues add up to too much stuff and too much weight. And then there are some who think a big heavy pack is "compensation" I guess– a 60 pound pack does zip for my masculinity!

Keep going Mike C. If it wasn't for your consistent 'shredding' of gear lists, I wouldn't have been able to get sub 10 for 3 seasons in the Rockies.

Hey Doug – Mike's new book is not required reading, but hot darn if I didn't learn a bunch of new stuff.

There is also this misconception that hammocks need to be a much heavier alternative than sleeping on the ground.

"There is also this misconception that hammocks need to be a much heavier alternative than sleeping on the ground."

+1. Not a ton of difference in weight between my hammock and non-hammock 3 season list.

No need to appologize. I asked the question. Who am I to bash the response? I brought my questions here from Backpacker Mag form because I wasn't getting anywhere there.

I have no problems pulling a sleeping bag out of the tent, taking a four point leak and sleeping under the stars. I even did it once on a Ledge in the GA AT at -5 after conceding that the rightful owner of the shelter was the skunk who made it home.

That being said, after my daughter chose to hang instead of sleeping on the "buggy ground" I was hooked. So the hammock stays. I'll look for something feather weight like a hammock made of parachute silk but I am officially a 3 season hanger. (I'll try the fourth this year and decide whether to ditch my tent entirely.)

On another note, I learned quite a bit this weekend and have now exiled my sleeping bag from the 60 plus gear in my pack. Just the hammock and the ENO underquilt were more than sufficient for that temperature range. (I had to take of my BL shirt because I was too warm and I didn't evn bring a sheet.) Not sure how far I can take this below 60 even if I combined the ENO and KAQ but I am sure to find out. So, losing that will have my gear weight just south of sixteen pounds for the summer.

How much more would I add back in if I went to a quilt?

Thanks for the shred.

PS… when did P#SS become profanity lmao.

This will depend on how warm you want it. Mine has taken me down to around 25 degrees and weighs about 22 oz.

Lookes like a jrb quilt was just added to gear swap for$ 165. Not a bad price.

How compressible are the 0* top quilts?