newbie looking for advice, current gear, future gear?

Hi Claudio:

Want to hike light? First thing to do is to get yourself a digital scale — say something that goes from 0 to 30 lbs in ounce increments (or grams if you want even more precision). Anything over 30 lbs can be weighed on a bathroom scale.

You have existing gear. Jot them down on an Excel spreadsheet — with corresponding weight next to each. Then go through each piece and determine:

1. Is the piece really necessary? Or nice to have? You decide how light you want to be.
2. For all the pieces that truly are necessary — can something do double or triple duty to relief other pieces?
3. After #1 and #2, for the remaining pieces, are there any that can be substituted by newer, lighter options?

As you eliminate, consolidate and substitute, your spreadsheet will give you updated pack weights.

Some people like to focus on the Big 3 or 4 (pack, shelter, bag and pad) — but IMO, I recommend looking at everything. Also, be careful when you analyze to look at the pieces both individually and also together — to make sure the pieces work well together.

I recommend that you identify all your other gear pieces — then decide on the appropriate backpack to house them. Leave the backpack for last.

I have not created a excel sheet with all items with weight, but I actually already have cut down the equipment that I carry to the most necessary already… I could already save a lot of weight that way…

I also have already done minor replacements, ziplock bags, trashbags for storage… optimus crux for 3 season stove, tarp for 3 season, etc. ….

however, as I do most stuff in decent weather, the "main" gear still seems a bit heavy compared to the stuff that I am looking at here….

Primarily, I am looking at lightweight/multi-use & multi-season alternatives for:
– shelter
– pad
– stove

OK, given mostly decent weather, some things to look at:

1. Shelter:

For camping in areas of low to moderate humidity and temps not much below freezing — consider a single wall tent — such as Henry Shires Tarptent Moment or Six Moon Designs Lunar Solo.

For colder / windier climes or areas with high humidity — consider a double wall tent — such as the Big Agnes Fly Creek UL or MSR Carbon Reflex. Double wall tents are going to be heavier than most single wall's — but they are also more versatile in terms of multi-season and multi-location use.

2. Pad

For the young with strong bones and joints — get an el cheap and ultra light weight blue foam pad. Cheap, light and almost indestructible, available at Wally World, REI, etc. Not the most comfy, but hey, cheap and light.

For more comfort without much more additional weight, look at the Thermarest NeoAir sleeping pad.

3. Stove

For solo use where "cooking" entails boiling water to make tea, coffee and rehydrate meals — definitely look at buying or making your own alcohol stove.

For longer trips or stronger fire power, look at SnowPeak Gigapower stoves.

Consider a foam pad and a torso length inflatable like the Prolite XS (about 9 ounces). For me anyway a Prolite and a Ridgerest is pretty stinking comfortable (I had a small at about 11 ounces). But I didn't like the idea of carrying a pair of pads heavier than 8 ounces each on every trip just for comfort so I picked up a Neoair small. It's still a nice budget setup with a high R value though.

I find the foam pad in the newer Jams to be good under my feet to somewhere in the 20's (I just put the whole pack down there) so you can get away with just torso-ish length pads for the rest of your body. This means you can save money by buying the "short" versions of even the foam pads.

There are some specialty foam pads out there that can be used to supplement an inflatable in different situations.

The Ridgerest Solar is a little thicker than the standard Ridgerest and, IMO, to warm for anything much above 40F. A short section would be nice to have around when it's really cold.

Gossamer Gear offers a ton of different pad configurations. For comparitive pads I think they feel slightly more comfortable than a Ridgerest but that's probably HIGHLY subjective and I can't really sleep on just a foam pad anyway so it doesn't much matter to me. Their really thin pads are interesting in the role of a heavy duty groundcloth in some situations.

+1 to weight and figure things out.

Pack… there are a bunch of people here that like frameless packs. GoLite Jam, Zpacks, and MLD packs seem to be often mentioned. Personally, if I am carrying more than 16lbs / 7kg) I want at least a light frame. I would recommend looking at Gossamer Gear Gorilla and the packs from Six Moon Design since they can take optional shaped stays (I don’t like strait stays at all) and if not over=packed they are carry-on legal with most airlines.

Pad… If you don’t need comfort, a good closed cell foam pad is lighted (though more bulky) than your prolite. If you need comfort (I do) the NeoAir or one of the cottage insulated air matresses is the way to go, though they are pricy compared to a foam pad.

Bag… might look into pairing an quilt with your 0C bag. You could mix and match them depending on your need. There are numerous quilt options. If you want daily multi-use get a down quilt that opens up flat… you can use it on your bed at home as well as on the trail.

Shelter… any of those options would work. if money is no object then I would say cuben MLD duomid + innernet is the best do everything option (light enough for 1, useable by 2). If you are trying to keep the spend down (especially if you like ponchos… I don’t) and you are no more than 2m, the capewood is likely to be the best value you will find for one person.

stove… I haven’t use the sidewider, but I have been very happy with the UL Caldera and a MLD 850 mug/pot. I would expect that the sidewider would be a slightly larger / heavier package, but I would bet it will be more fuel efficient and you can burn wood. If you are doing the sidewinder, I would vote for the .9L evernew short pot. Great size. Not too huge for 1, works well for 2. Works well for melting snow. If you want more than boil (or simmer via cozy) then I would recommend the Snowpeak GS100 canister stove with the .9L short Evernew pot.

I have a more complete list of options on my recommended gear pages.

pack: either the jam or a gorilla pack, I have to say, I like the jam better…
stove: I will definitely get a titan pot to go along with optimus crux, or possibly make an alcohol stove, and will probably just create a windscreen out of tin foil…. maybe a sidewinder at a later stage for mulit-fuel use…
pad: I will check the neo-air more closely, though I think the thing looks delicate… how durable, resistant is it?
shelter: hmmm, this still makes me think….

golite shangrila 3 (hex) – this would cover everything, 4 season, with bug net would make an camping vacation tent, when I go surfing, travel with the motorbike, and girlfriend, etc…. at the same time, just the outer and trekking poles really make it light…
however, as a 1 night emergency, it seems an overkill

Has anyone seen this? http://www.terra-nova.co.uk/Product_Type/Tents/Superlite_Tents/Tarp_Shelter.html
any experiences? would this suffice as emergency shelter for good weather overnighters? would need to cover paragliding gear and me sleeping…. seems a bit small though…

thanks for the advice so far, really helping

As most of you recommended, I got a kitchen scale and weighed most of my gear… WOW, what an eye-opener…. some stuff I estimated just about right… whereas with others I was really wrong… I will continue weighing stuff and might be back with some more precise questions.

A few examples of stuff and their weight I was really surprised about:
– hiking boots 800g/shoe – thought they were way heavier, they sure feel as if
– runners 350g/shoe – thought those were lighter
– hiking poles at nearly 500g for the pair – those GOTTA go
– 3 season insulation jacket at 500g – this is my everyday jacket, way lighter than I thought…

Gotta say, the scaling does the job!

Glad you got the scale, Claudio. Just the process of weighing really helps one to focus on those gear weights! For hiking poles, take a look at Gossamer Gear LT4 poles and also Titanium Goat poles. I own / have owned both. They are insanely light — yet very dependable.

I now have scaled pretty much all gear I have.
my current shoe is a traditional hiking boot with ankle support weighing 786g each, so 1572g total

What I want:
– A lighter alternative for all activities (paragliding, 3-4 season hikes), light 4 season (-10C max!)
– Waterproof?!? (or work with Gore Tex socks)

are there any paragliders here in this forum that have found a lighter alternative that works for them?

Let ask differently… I have read a number of articles and forum discussions on here and do absolutely agree on boots being a total overkill for hiking with light loads… the discussion about the so called "ankle support" are very interesting…

My load is fairly light when purely hiking. The thing is when I go paragliding I have a 12-13kg load. I still wouldn't worry too much about hiking with that type of weight in trailrunners. However, during launching you run downhill through debris and mud sometimes very uneven ground, same goes for landing, plus impact.
I like the boots for these two situations, yet they take about 30 seconds altogether, for the rest of the time I would simply prefer trailrunners…. they would feel so much better on my feed in the air when you fly for hours these boots get heavy..

So here's my question: If you light-/ultralight backpackers were to go paragliding, what footwear would you choose? Would you vote for the "ankle support" here?

I don't paraglide but I noticed Inov-8 makes a boot (Roclite 390 GTX) for paragliding.

http://www.inov-8.com/Products-Detail.asp?PG=PG1&P=5050973132&L=

Claudio, my answer is going to come from the medical perspective. Boots provide poor proprioception (aka spacial perception) to your ankle at the price of being quite heavy. If I were you I would invest in some nice lace up or figure 8 wrap around ankle braces that are very light weight and you can pair them with just about any trail runner you can think of. Put them on when you need them and off when you don't.

Here's an example: http://www.muellersportsmed.com/Hg80_Ankle_with_Straps.htm

We used them for our football players I worked with and they generally liked them.

That Inov boot looks promising…. I'll check whether I can look at that one in a store somewhere….

I definitely like that idea with the braces… simple and versatile approach… very nice idea! I will give this some further thinking, check weights on these laceup braces and maybe soon give it a try (I'd first need to buy some trailrunners too ;-)

BTW: I created my first cat alcohol stove yesterday out of some more heavy duty metal… it came out at 30g…. it boiled 0.5l of water in 12.30 min at room temperature… I added a windscreen out of tin foil for 7 g and a bic lighter for like 7g…. a very light stove which I am definitely gonna try when I go paragliding overnight…. just love how simple that is!

=> I think I am sort of addicted to the lightweight & simplicity already! I also removed a whole lot of equipment I dont need anymore. Gave most of the gear away, to friends/brothers/others for free, some I sold on e-bay…. feels great! I have less & less things in my flat.

another test with my new alk stove….

all, the water (0.5l), stove, alcohol, pot was out in the cold (below freezing) for about 1 hour…

then, I started the test:

lighting with the bic was not possible. I lit a small napkin and dropped it in the alc stove… then it started… about 25 min… to boiling if I remember well…

you may call it slow, very slow actually, but I built this stove on my own!! it's a crazy great feeling to see with how little you can actually get a pot of hot water! crazy! more & more lightweight thinking is coming into my mind….

congrats, always nice when you make something yourself (and it works=) eh?
as for the shoes, I think the ankle braces is a good idea… I've found that the thinner the sole on the shoe, the less likely you are to sprain an ankle, though it is easy to just tramp over anything with huge boots on, I prefer to have to watch where I'm going a bit and have less weight.

PS, I'm sure you can have lots of fun in the MYOG section=D

with my new alc stove… that I built for absolutely free… I think I am sold to alc stoves… I mean I will not ever be boiling water at 0C…. I am hardly outdoor anymore when it's that cold… just not that into it anymore…

I am gonna have to find some simmer options though for cooking pasta or frying something….

ok, first decisions have been made

I will keep bags and mats:
4 season: huge mammut bag (2778g) and exped down mat (957g)
3 season: TAR prolite (575g) and down bag (680g)

still thinking:
trekking poles: I need new ones (need to be really collapsible due to use when paragliding)
backpack (1850g): I am pretty sold on the jam (840g) => potential -1010g
boots (785g): I am gonna visit a trailrunning shop to look at trailrunners soon => potential -800g (400g/ea)
tarp 3x3m (618g): thinking of getting a SihlTwinn or a ID Sihltarp 2 => potential -200-400g
MSR steel potset (602g): I wanna get rid off the steel…, thinking of:
– evernew non-stick ECA-418 1300ml with 650ml frypan (this would probably cover everything, though expensive (pot. -370g)
– cheap 1l non-stick aluminium pot from trangia…. just one pot…

that would make a total of about 2.5kg weight reduction, nice!

I would be thankful for advice on:
– the tarp choice
– collapsible trekking poles
– pot choice

Thanks guys!

these look good for me…. thought I'd share it with you:

http://www.flugschule-hochries.de/shop/Travelprodukte/Mountain-King-Trail-Blaze-Bergstoecke-Trekkingstoecke::374.html

they collapse very nicely…

Tarp: MYOG I like a 9'6"x9'6" (2 pieces of silnylon at 5' with center seam, folded diagnally…dimensions are just what I can get out of the material and will varry.)

Pot: Check out http://www.antigravitygear.com/ The small 3cup pots go just under 4oz
A couple pieces of AL foil and your stove means a light weight kit: ~5oz total.

Trekking Poles: The new Black Diamond ones look pretty good. Avoid locks if at all possible.

Claudio,

I have no personal experience with these as a choice for
trekking poles but they are very interesting because of their design, weight and price.

Party On,

Newton

For a cookset I had decided to go with an Evernew Ultralight Ti 1.3 pot. I can cook for myself and others, use it at home, and still can cook a small steak on the bottom of it. I matched this with a hard plastic foon and a knife made by Victorinox made to clean and gut fish but will still cut most anything else. For a stove I decide to go with a Vargo Hexagon wood burning stove that packs down inside the pot and a the aluminum top of a 1L plastic flask for the alcohol burner that sits nicely inside. I also threw in a small scrubby pad and a P-38 can opener just incase. All of the stuff is easy and simple to use with no threat of it breaking or breaking down.

For trekking poles I would buy some cheap ones at a Wal-Mart that you can return after a few weeks to see if you like them or not.

hmm you cook a small steak on the bottom… is it a non-stick pot you have or how do you do that… you simmer your alcstove?

I usually use wood and flip it a bit. I only use alcohol as a backup

so are you saying that you manage to fry something without a non-stick coating? Do you have to use a lot of oil or not?