Kooka Bay NeoAir equivalent as warm, durable for weight?

I've got a 2.5x60x20 rectangle pad with 6 ounces of down. If I remember correctly, that is. So far, I've used it in temps ranging from 24F on up, and have been comfortable so far. I do plan to test it to much lower temps this winter.

My sleep system is something I'm working on. Right now I use the KookaBay, either a Montbell Spiral Down Hugger #3 or a Marmot Pinnacle 15F depending on temps, and temperature-appropriate base layers to bed. I say that I'm "working on it" because I'm trying to find ways to combat the moisture that gets trapped in my down bags every morning.

The 30D material has been tough so far, but it is noticeably thinner than the 50- 70D material used by Big Agnes. If I ever make it back to the desert, I'll probably bring a GG 1/8 inch thinlight pad because of all the pricklies.

Oh yeah. It weighs exactly 16 ounces on my scale.

The ability to customize your sleeping pad with Kookabay is awesome since personal preferences varies and mainstream manufacturers never offer more than 2-4 variations.

Hopefully Bender gets his new site up soon that will let you custom build a quilt with a weight & price estimator. I'd be interested in playing around with that for sure.

Dan,
I know it's nice to simply do that on a website, but if you send your product requests, Bender will quote you on whatever you want.

I sent Bender a detailed email asking for his advice on which pads to get based on our specs and usage. I'm pretty sure it will wind up best to get 2 separate pads – one for winter and one for 3 season, so that we can carry a much lighter pad 3 season.

EJ,
I have considered getting a lighter 3 season pad. For me, the weight savings (about 3 ounces) wasn't justified by the cost. I've been very happy with my pad for 3 seasons. The fourth will undergo testing soon.

As a word of caution, if you get a DAM, the less down you get, the more it will shift around and leave you with cold spots. Bender has apparently developed a system of keeping his down from shifting between baffles, but I have the older version, so I cannot comment on that. Of course, synthetic insulation would be a non-issue as far as shifting goes.

EJ, I have read that some folks use their lungs to fill a down pad. I have also read that moisture in any pad is bad. I choose syn because of the weight, R value and I intend to use my lungs to fill the pad. I did not want the extra weight of a pump. From research here it seems there is a bit of a learning curve when using a pump. A email to Bender will give you many of these details. So far I have always used some thickness (1/8 up to 3/8") of CCF with the air pad. I have only used the KB once but I seemed to stay on it a bit better, not that there was much of a problem staying on the NA. I have used the NA 10-15 times. I plan to use the NA above 40 degrees.

For some reason I have sub 14oz in my head for a pad, same as a regular neoair, but with a solid R4 rating.

I'm definitely going synthetic, as I can't be bothered worrying about moisture in my pad, shifting down etc.

Being in the Pacific Northwest, and wanting to do more mild winter, shoulder season trips.. something tells me using too much down isn't prudent. From my limited experience, and talking with those more experienced, it seems moisture and trying to keep things dry is a constant struggle in the winter.

Extrapolating from all the threads and specs of KB pads, and a few emails with Bender, it seems that if I want a 66" X 20" mummy pad, and come in near 14 oz, I'm going to have to use the 30d fabric. However, since I'd like to have my cake and eat it too, I was wondering if I could have a 70d bottom and offset the heavier fabric by making the pad 2" high instead of 2.5".

I use a Big Agnes IAC that I like quite a bit (70d) and feel confident using it, but it's 21oz. Bender's pads should be pretty similar.

I'm only 155lbs and strictly a sidesleeper so the mummy shape is perfect for me, and at 2" high, I won't be touching the ground at my weight. Also, kinda stupid, but then I could enjoy more of a view out of my Hexamid.

Not even sure if my customization is a good idea, or even possible (durability 30d mated with 70d material), but I haven't been able to get a hold of Bender or I'd ask him.

or

I could just get a NeoAir.

I have been trying to reach him for a week now?

I heard from him on the 16th… He’s usually pretty darned responsive, at least in my experience. Never had cause to wonder whether he was being dodgy or truly on vacation. Considering the recent holiday and season, I’d cut him a bit of slack. *shrug*

@Scott
Probably from this thread in which Ronald Dillon said:
My new Kookabay is 14oz and 24in wide and 66in long. I have the synth insulation that Bender rates at r4 (no air pump needed).

I don’t have my Kooka Bay pad yet, but I have used a POE Ether Compact 6 quite a bit and had a very short stint with the NeoAir. The POE pad has a construction more or less identical to an uninsulated Kooka Bay pad. Both the POE and NeoAir are 20″ wide, but the POE pad felt wide enough for me whereas I really would have needed a 24″ wide NeoAir to be comfortable. The horizontal baffles of the NeoAir just didn’t work for me- effective width was more like 16″ because of the tendency for the sides to buckle and create a slope.

If you’re going with a vertical baffled Kooka Bay pad, the 20″ should be fine unless you’re really large, like to roll around, or sleep in a more fetal position. I’m a fatty *and* sleep on my side with a bit of fetal tint and 20″ has been fine. I opted for a 24″ wide Kooka Bay pad so that I could curl up even more.

Yes, that is likely where I got the figure.

I like my Big Agnes IAC so I figure I would like the vertical baffles. Good to know on the sizing, not a big guy at all.

The POE has slightly larger/taller outside baffles, no? Wonder if it would be easy for Bender to make something similiar. And if it would be problematic for a fetal position sleep?

I have this notion to run a lengths of spectra cord in between the grooves of the first and second baffle, and tying my quilt to it. Not sure if it would work.

Tentatively planning on going to Patagonia middle of January, so a half pound lighter pad would really come in handy. Of course, I realize Bender can easily be busy, no biggie, I'll have to fire off another email.

EDIT: Nevermind, the question I posted had already been answered. Shouldn't stay up this late.

Yup, the POE pads have slightly larger outside baffles. So does the Kooka Bay pads – when I asked for that when I ordered he said it was standard.

Is Bender on vacation? I tried him twice, once 3-4 days before Christmas and 2 days ago and haven't heard back.