Safe UL Wind + Rain solution

On my next trek I plan to use my Marmot Mica jacket with a MB inner jacket combo. I would assume any rain jacket itself would also provide significant wind protection. But the MB would also provide wind protection as well. Rain/wind/insulation= 15oz-16oz roughly

Hmm.. I did see the Marmot Mica on a clearance rack in NYC for $75 – $90.. It's 7 oz apparently.

on the other hand, Montbell has 3.3 oz Windshell Parkas for $75 online.. (U.L. Wind Parka)

Could you tell me if either of these jackets do anything for warmth besides cut the wind? Is there any reason to choose one over the other, at the same price, besides the weight?

The Mica is a rain jacket. The Mont-bell is more of a wind shirt. This is my second summer using the Mica. IMO it is the best rain jacket I've ever owned. It breath well enough for me that I also use it as a wind shirt.

I wouldn't rely on a down jacket in some of the conditions I've experienced in the rockies. Even the most waterproof rain gear can't protect you from the moisture that will eventually build up in the down after multi-day blowing rain.

If you succeed in keeping the rain out, your perspiration/condensation will get you.
I would layer synthetics like fleece and save the down for evenings and cold mornings in camp.

Absolutely love my Marmot Essence jacket. I take it with me everywhere. I paid full price for mine, but here it is on deep discount:
http://www.sierratradingpost.com/p/208,44622_Marmot-Essence-Jacket-Waterproof-For-Men.html

It's waterproof and windproof, and has been completely awesome no matter the circumstances.

8oz and imo, full featured at that weight. I use this with a Patagonia nano puff pullover (9 oz) and in 10 degree weather with a stiff breeze, I can't wear the puff while hiking. However, around the campsite, the longsleeve midweight smartwool + nano puff + Essence jacket = warm and comfortable. This is with extremely little bulk and weight. Plus the nano puff can stay warm even when damp.

So, 8oz + 9oz + smartwool baselayer is all the clothing I have ever needed in four season hiking/camping/backpacking.

For Colorado in August the 14 oz down jacket is overkill.

I have been warm in the evenings with a lightweight baselayer and hat plus a Montbell UL synthetic jacket containing 1.8 oz/yd primaloft.

In August the overnight temperatures rarely drop to freezing, unless you're camped on top of a high peak (iffy due to the chance of a lightning strike). The lowest overnight temperature I can recall was about 25 F, and that was well above treeline, around 12,500 ft on a clear night. September is a different ballgame — much colder overnight but fewer thunderstorms.

My vote would be for the DriDucks jacket, paired with either a synthetic jacket like the Montbell or a 200 wt fleece jacket. (The fleece jacket will weigh a bit more than the Montbell). The DriDucks jacket can do double-duty as a windshell. I also take rainpants (Golite Reed), but most people don't. I'm also a fan of UL ankle gaiters. On some trips in August I've needed my rainjacket for about an hour a day, but on other trips I've only used it once a week.

On another thread you asked whether a Tarptent would be OK; the tarptent is ideal! If you happen to encounter high winds, simply camp below treeline. That's easy to do because the treeline is very high; between 11,300 and 12,000 ft.

My thru-hike of the Colorado Trail is planned for all of August.. so we'll be in the high San Juan Mtns at the end of August.

Steven,

I don't plan to ever wear the down jacket while hiking (even in the rain).. I'll have a mid-weight wool or synthetic baselayer for that.

I'll only wear the Down around camp and to supplement my flimsy 32 F Mountain Hardwear Ultralamina bag. Did you mean to say that the down would get wet even in such circumstances?

Zack,

That's a very appealing combo you've listed there.. I'll look around to see if I can get the Marmot Essence on discount some place (sold out at your link). Unfortunately, I'm not sure I can buy yet another piece of insulation (the Nano Puff) just now.. just ended up with 3 down jackets for (my girlfriend and I together).

Chris,

Thanks for telling me that my 14 oz FUGU jacket is an overkill.. I knew it was too good to be true. However, since the solution you and others mention is typically only 4 – 5 oz lighter and because my sleeping bag is 32 F rated, I am still thinking of taking this 14 oz jacket along..

My only hesitation is the moisture/rain problem with down but at least sitting in my dry room here, I feel like I can keep it dry if I only use it during camp. Maybe I'll change my mind before my trip.

Thanks for the Tarptent tip! I'll probably order a Double Rainbow or the SMD Lunar Duo..

Would you know if freestanding ability is important in the Rockies? I've had one bad experience with non-freestanding but would still go with that by default..

Hi Dont,

I agree with your DriDuck/windshirt combo. Great windshirt reviews and articles here: http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/xdpy/ss/Clothing%20-%20Wind%20Shirts/index.html

A hooded windshirt is extremely versatile. In your combo, you can go for a shirt that is more on the breathable end of the spectrum rather than the water resistant end. Montbell is typically less breathable. Check out the hooded Golite windshirt. The Montane Featherlight is very breathable as well but no hood.

All windshirts have almost zero insulation value. However, you'd be amazed at what cutting the wind with no interior humidity can do for you. Brilliant pieces.

Have fun!

Oh- great reviews of those shelters on the site too. Check out the Articles-Gear tab and you'll find tons of info. This is useful too: http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/sotmr_single_wall_tents_2008.html

"I don't plan to ever wear the down jacket while hiking (even in the rain).. I'll have a mid-weight wool or synthetic baselayer for that."

Sounds like a plan. That's what I do. The down should stay dry then. Unless there is a leak in you drybag and you have a rough river crossing, a shelter failure in the rain, flash flood, …

Regarding "Freestanding ability". Lot's of opinions on that.
I have never used a freestanding shelter in the Rockies, but I'd never heard of freestanding when I backpacked the rockies:-)

You will always want to fasten your shelter to the ground so freestanding doesn't provide anything but extra weight.

There are plenty of stories of people who didn't stake down their freestanding shelters. One case I've seen was when tent, sleeping bag, clothing etc… all blew into a river and floated downstream.
We've all heard the stories of shelters being blown so far away that they were never found or were at least not reachable.

"I'll probably order a Double Rainbow or the SMD Lunar Duo"

And there are other options you may want to consider. Not only Tarptent and SMD, but Mountain Laurel, Gossamer Gear, …

We were considering the Lunar Duo until we compared it to his new 2 person shelter the "Haven". There are some advantages with the new design, eg. even better summer bug season ventilation, smaller footprint(which came in handy the first night we used it).

Since your sleeping bag is only 32 F, taking the warm down jacket makes sense. It should be easy to keep the down jacket dry, and if it gets a bit damp it will dry quickly on a sunny day.

There's no need for a freestanding tent in the Rockies. Oddly enough, the Rockies are not nearly as rocky as the Sierras, and hence it's easy to insert tent pegs. I think you'll be pleasantly surprised at how mild the weather is in August. You can even go lighter than the double-rainbow if you're so inclined.

thanks for the very helpful replies! given my weak sleeping bag, I think 14 oz of a down jacket that I already own is a good deal. buying a 'lighter' jacket would save 4 – 5 oz at most, cost another $100 and might turn out insufficient.

I've decided to try and find a Marmot Essence or Mica or a TNF Triumph Anorak.. all 3 are rain + wind jackets at about 6 – 7 oz. If I find one at a reasonable price, it'll replace my 6 oz DriDucks top.. same weight, more protection, more durable (but also more $$).

If I don't find those jackets reasonably priced, I'll go with a 3 – 4 oz windshirt + my DriDucks.. total 10 oz.

As for the tent, for now, I picked up a used Cloudburst (the original version, not the one on sale now). It should get here shortly.. about 38 oz.. I'd have prefer a Lunar Duo or Double Rainbow but a bargain is a bargain.. and the two of us doing the colorado trail are not very fussy about tent space.

thanks for the replies!

I have a Cabela's GTX PacLite parka (& seldom-carried pants) that costs $99. Very high quality & great features.

My size Large, Tall weighs 15 oz. Not UL but light and very durable as a rain parka & as a hardshell over insulation on cold mornings in the western mountains. Cabela's is the only vendor I know that carries Tall sizes. I'm 5' 10" (not tall) but I like the extra butt coverage and longer sleeves.