Professional Backpacking…..

[Sarah Kirkconnell]

If a person's long term health plan includes the concept of using low income clinics, pill handouts and the ER at the local charity hospital BUT they are an able bodied human WHO could work a real job, they deserve to be flogged.

Guess who pays for that "health plan"? Us people who pay taxes, who have real jobs.

Those clinics and charity driven hospitals are for people in true need – the ones who cannot work due to health or don't make enough due to circumstances (such as having been unemployed, etc). Just because a person doesn't want to work a real job or buy insurance doesn't cut it!

More so, if you believe that you will get equal care as a paying customer you are way off. They are only required to save your life, not make it better. If you get cancer you will find you cannot get proper care, if you fall off a cliff they will fix your bones but send you home asap – even though you might have internal issues that need more in depth care – such as expensive scans. I grew up poor and going to a Doctor meant getting substandard care in clinics where people hacked all over you, you waited 2 to 3 hours and got only the minimum in help. In college I had strep throat so bad that it took 3 runs of antibiotics to kill it and by the time we got done I also had bronchitis. A simple Dr. visit a month before would have stopped that!

About the only people who get stellar free care are pregnant women – due to there being two involved.

I cannot imagine not having health insurance currently – I have an extremely high risk pregnancy. For example I recently had to have an ultrasound that out of pocket would have cost over $2500. My current pregnancy will by end most likely run over $60K if I avoid premature birth – which most likely I won't. I cannot imagine asking tax payers to foot a $100K+ bill for my baby to be born healthy. So my husband works a job that has stellar insurance benefits to provide for us.

Call me what you want, but I believe in personal responsibility! One can have pleasure in life but it has to be tempered with reality. That means knowing that you can provide for yourself for the 'what-ifs'. People who choose to save for rainy days and for retirement should not be penalized and forced to pay higher taxes for those who want to be lazy little ants.

(And frankly, we still get outside more than most even with dollars in our eyes.)

[Kendall Clement]

I would love to be paid to backpack. That would be a dream job, wouldn't it.

As for health care, I have a real job and tax payers pay for my health care. I think it's ridiculous that in the richest country in the world we have 46 million people without health care. I spent 4 years in the US Navy and I'm in the VA system; which, even with all my complaining is still one of the best health care systems in the world. It's not entirely free. It's income based. But, tax payers pay for it. I also know what it's like to be without health care because even though you have a real job, you still can't afford a private plan. I lived for many years like that. It is extremely difficult. The insurance companies make it completely unaffordable for people at certain income levels. And, I went to college too.

[Jack H.]

How about this thread doesn't degenerate into an argument over responsibility and health insurance?

[Art Sandt]

@ Sarah,
Woooooooooaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhhh!

The topic of professional backpacking is a good one. No need to "invigorate" it by side-tracking into something that looks like politics. Please let's give the original topic a chance to run its course before getting into that can of worms.

[Ken Ross]

The best plan is to do something stupid or careless that almost gets you killed, then write a book about it and give motivational speeches.

Another idea: equipment companies that print gaudy logos in conspicuous places on their equipment should pay an advertising fee for every trail mile hiked!

[David Lutz]

"The best plan is to do something stupid or careless that almost gets you killed, then write a book about it and give motivational speeches."

Well played…..and true!!

[BlackHatGuy]

"Woooooooooaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhhh!

The topic of professional backpacking is a good one. No need to "invigorate" it by side-tracking into something that looks like politics. Please let's give the original topic a chance to run its course before getting into that can of worms."

Agreed. BUT Sarah didn't get there by herself. She's not even the first person to open that can in this thread….

[Kendall Clement]

My apologies to everyone for my part. I've been in these forums long enough to know better.

[BlackHatGuy]

Ah Kendall, it's just good to see you around again!

[Chris Townsend]

As I've been mentioned I thought I'd point that professionally I'm a writer and photographer. I don't get paid to go backpacking, I do get paid for my words and photographs about backpacking, day hiking, outdoor gear and more. I also give talks and in the past I've done a fair amount of instructing and guiding.

I've been self-employed in this field for nearly 28 years. I've never made much money (not that I expected to) but I have been able to spend long periods in wild places, which was my aim. I also spend even longer periods of time sitting in front of the computer! Which wasn't my aim but books have to be written and photographs sorted and edited.

To anyone wanting to do this I would say do it because you love it and because you feel you have something to offer. Don't do it if you want to be financially rich. And be prepared to work hard – good writing and good photography require learning the skills and always trying to improve.

I'm finishing a book at present and spending more time at the computer than I would like!

[Art Sandt]

@ Douglas,
That's true. Apologies, Sarah, to single you out.

[Kendall Clement]

Douglas – Thank you. It's good to be back. :)

Chris,

I think what you're saying is that it would better for us to find something specifically related to backpacking or 1 or 2 things specifically related to the outdoors; and, get paid to do those things which would require us to go backpacking. Is that right?

[Chris Townsend]

Kendall, that's exactly it. That's what I've done. The only other way would be to find sponsors who will pay you to go backpacking – which means every trip has to have something newsworthy about it – longer, tougher, faster, never been done before. And you are beholden to sponsors and have to satisfy their needs. I've had sponsorship in terms of gear and some cash from gear companies for some of my longest walks but these have never covered the full costs. I wouldn't want to do high profile trips all the time to maintain sponsorship either.

[Lynn Tramper]

"Or as my husband puts it – he would rather work a stress filled IT job that pays extremely well and spend his days off out having fun – knowing that we can do that and plan for our early retirement – where we won't have to worry."

That's really sad. For me the balance in life is to have, as others have said, a job I love and that I can do for the rest of my life. Add to that a job that gives me six weeks paid leave each year, plus annual holidays, and only asks a 37.5 hour week of me, and a job that I can walk or bike to, and living in a country with mostly socialised medicine, and living frugally so we own our home without busting a gut or having stressful work situations, and I can honestly say I would take my lifestyle any day over being a 'professional' backpacker.

[Sarah Kirkconnell]

Why is it sad? He doesn't think it is sad by any means to have the ability to provide for his family and still have time left to enjoy. He enjoys his stressful IT job frankly – it encourages his thinking and he gets to travel a lot out of it. He gets bored when not using his brain to solve problems.

The point being is that we don't want to be doing a "job the rest of our life". So we are making money while young and preparing for our retirement – all while still having a fun time on our days off. You all can work till your 95, us…no thanks.

Not everyone wants to live a UL lifestyle off the trail either. I sure don't. Neither does my husband. Simply being a light hiker doesn't equate the other.

But back to the whole 'pro hiker' thing – yes, a person can do it with enough planning and that was my point: you can do it but don't make yourself a burden on society by thinking hiker trash instead of able bodied adult. If a person wants to give up on a lot of things, yes you can do it. You won't make much more than food and a place to sleep – after all, to earn that money you have to keep moving and being better than everyone else.

Frankly, at the end of S.W.'s most recent yo-yo his lady had a fund online to help raise money for his trip so he could EAT.

There are only a tiny few out there that stand out so much that they will get sponsored enough to even pay for food and if you do get lucky and get more, well you will have to sell out as well.

Don't let it stop someone from trying – for example writing books is very rewarding emotionally. SO is blogging or doing a website. Or movies. But here is my advice: start slow, build yourself up, build a following. You can make money this way – but realize that leaving the corporate world isn't going to be easy if you want to be self sufficient and not a burden. The 10 year plan to freedom on the other hand allows one to build that part of them selves and all the while save money, buy that cabin in the woods, etc and be prepared.

Frankly, I see it like starting a business. Would you start a business with no money?

[Lynn Tramper]

" He enjoys his stressful IT job frankly – it encourages his thinking and he gets to travel a lot out of it. He gets bored when not using his brain to solve problems."

OK, although I would personally not use the words stressful and enjoy in the same sentence, it's good to know he enjoys his job.

Retirement makes no sense to me in this day and age, and it may even be socially irresponsible to stop contributing intellectually and financially to society. Although I am down to a four day work week, I wouldn't really want to spend much less time at my job, nor do I have a burning desire to do more hiking than I already do. Thats' what I mean by balance…but maybe we're talking about two different things we we mention "jobs" and "work"??? Being a mother is a big job and a lot of work (retirement's a long way away!), but not financially very satisfying.

Heath Insurance!@#$%^&

I'd be surprised if you and your husband have contributed the $100,000 to the insurance company that your pregnancy may cost. How is that any different to someone sponging off a free clinic? You just shrug your shoulders and say "heck, it's not my problem, my employer is paying for it". Substitute "my employer" with "the tax payer" and you have the same deal. Someone has to pay if you can't.

[Jeff Antig]

Sarah, my friend, with utmost respect, do you have any idea how the rest of the world operates? Non-Americans will be reading your whole health care argument with their jaws dropped. Please don't consider this a personal attack because it is definitely not. See through the looking-glass in a holistic standpoint rather than one consisting of personal experiences. Even if you think you are well-versed on how the American society operates, you're making some very apparent contradictions as Lynn pointed out. In the end, this system we live in is what it is. You can't go about imposing your will upon others just for the sake of hoping for their conformity. If you seriously think that all or even most low-income families desperately NEED health care then you will open your eyes to a world of deception.

[Lynn Tramper]

Methinks healthcare is a topic best moved to chaff if we wish to continue the discussion. As far as professional backpacking and healthcare is concerned, well each country will be different. In NZ, any injury would be covered by our accident compensation system. It is a no blame payout to anyone in NZ (even visitors from abroad) who suffers accidental injury. It is designed to prevent litigation. If you got sick (as opposed to injured), then major emergency care is also provided via publicly owned hospitals. Taxpayers foot the bill either way. I pay taxes and still have plenty to live and play on, so to me it's a non-issue (the exception being folks who intentionally rip off the system by pretending to be sick or injured and drawing a living allowance as well as free health care).

At least a professional backpacker isn't likely to cost our health system for diseases such as obesity, heart disease, diabetes or lung cancer….

[Ken Thompson]

Mark S,. Does she have a sister?

[Diane “Piper” Soini]

Not all seasonal jobs are outdoors in the wilderness. If you want a seasonal job, there are lots of things you can do. I have been working for a company that records the bowhead whale migration. I had no idea such a job even existed. There must be other jobs like this somewhere. Or there is temporary work of all kinds.

Not all able-bodied people have full-time jobs with insurance. I have not always had that. So free-clinics and sliding scale worked for me during those times. With sliding scale, sometimes I paid more and sometimes not at all. Sometimes I even got health care for free, too, out of the goodness of the doctor's heart. No paperwork, no compensation, no taxpayers involved.

People do what they can to survive.

[BlackHatGuy]

How about being a smokejumper! I used to dream about this when i was little. You'll spend plenty of time in the woods! As long as you're willing to jump out of planes….

[john flanagan]

"How does one become a "professional backpacker"? I know there are many out there that are actually getting paid to walk around in the wilderness."

Hi Rich. Having done something like that for about 12 years, but not having read all of the other replies (tho enough to get the flavor of things), I can offer this:

– No one gets paid to backpack. They get paid to add value by doing work that requires backpacking. This may be to educate others (NOLS or Outward Bound), to do social work (outdoor programs for youth at risk), evoke the experience for others (writers / photographers), provide geographic info (guide book writers), protect or manage resources (backcountry rangers), collect data (scientists)…you get the point. Reframe the question to center on how you can contribute to something that you care about. The most jobs are in instruction (guide/OB/NOLS) or social work.

– "Paid" is a relative term. Let's just say you're not likely to turn down free anything… I may have made $10K during a good year as an OB instructor. You do other jobs (nearly any other job that is short term) to survive the time you're not in the field. I did a lot of construction labor, potted seedlings in a green house, kept an inn for a winter… you get the point. At least at first, you'll be living on the margins.

– To the flak re insurance, not much to add except that 1-there are options that provide it, 2- the social system is there for a reason, 3- if you take my first bit to heart you will contribute to society so turn about is fair play in my book. Assuming that you have integrity, use it to guide you.

– Many reputable schools provide insurance for full time instructors; OB for example makes it as available as possible for part timers as well. It takes quite a while and you need to be good at your craft to make it to the full time ranks. Your craft includes both outdoor and other skills. Again, using OB as an example, you must be a good educator as well and demonstrate strong commitment and ability to fostering the growth of others through outdoor experience.

– Best have a plan B; it's not generally the kind of work that carries you into your golden years. Commit to a bigger goal (educator, scientist, writer, etc.) and work it hard. That means developing strong people, business, and professional skills… the thing that got me out of it was interacting with few sad (their emotional state – not a value judgement on my part) middle aged guys with lots of orthopedic issues (backs, knees and shoulders – I consort with paddlers :P) and no real options. Having said that, it can be GREAT and unique background to take in other directions. Many of my OB pals are now…educators, business consultants, corporate trainers, ER nurses. A very few have made a career at OB.

– Best think about implications for having a family; again that for many (not all) is what gets them out of it.

– Best develop as many outdoor skills as possible (add canoeing, kayaking, rafting, climbing, winter travel – the more you can do the more employable you are.

Best of luck!

[Pepe LP]

"How about being a smokejumper! I used to dream about this when i was little. You'll spend plenty of time in the woods! As long as you're willing to jump out of planes…."

Don't forget, you're jumping out of a plane and INTO A FIRE!!!

[Mark Stalbird]

Yes indeed….but she is an outdoor enthusiast and would be clingy,I'll take ambitious and travels a lot hands down.

[Lynn Tramper]

Just to add to Joe's thoughtful post, there are jobs like OB that, on the surface, only pay a few bucks an hour if you total it all up. But in the larger picture, places like OB also provide food, accommodation, insurance and social support. You really have to factor all that in before you can say that it pays poorly. Not to mention you get lots of big blocks of time off at the end of each course, and many memorable experiences along the way.

Of course, OB is not a career. They have a maximum cap on employment of 30 months in most cases.

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