Does bear spray work with black bears and what brand?

Hi Russell

Having worked with a book publisher for many years and having published a few myself, perhaps I could correct what seems to be a small misunderstanding on your part.

Authors do not design the front and back cover of their books, nor are they responsible for the blurb on the back. (OK, a few exceptions exist.) The design work is done by the publisher who is trying to maximise his sales.

So it can actually be very hard to judge the contents of a book by the cover. Perhaps Gary Shelton cringes when he sees the cover of his book too?

Cheers

I regularly hike in the SNP on the At and off along loops within the park and can say that each time, I see bears in their natural habitat. Last weekend I heard quite a bit of rustling in the brush not far from me and saw a cub up in a tree, I'm sure another on the ground. The bear in the tree saw me first, and couldn't get down fast enough to run from me. I hit my hiking poles together and yelled several times and off they went. Don't think for a moment I didn't keep looking behind me. My only weapon on me was my fixed blade Buck that I wore on my belt.

I don't know if that knife would do any good against a bear, especially if it knocks me in the head. I hope I never find out.

…

I need to read that book. Now I'm getting wigged out. One thing that occurred to me is folks talk about using the spray but no one says what to do after you spray the beast. Run like the devil? How far?

I've used pepper spray on dogs while biking and they go down fast. It's the owners that come chasing after me because precious Killer was set loose on me on purpose and didn't live up to his name.

I think a lot depends on where you are.

Back in the mid-1970's, I went on a vacation to the Canadian Rockies with the then husband and three of our 4 kids (the youngest turned 8 during the trip). We spent several days in Wells-Gray Provincial Park (beautiful and wild place!) and one day hiked up a trail. I kept noticing fresh bear sign (ripped-open logs, overturned rocks and clawed trees) and finally persuaded hubby (far less familiar with such things) that we should retreat. I have no idea if the bears who left the signs were black or grizzly, and I wasn't about to stay around and find out! While black bears in the Pacific NW are extremely shy of people, I'm quite willing to believe that BC bears (just north of us, actually) are less so. Would this have something to do with less hunting pressure on the bear population of BC?

The husband, by the way, later (while we were in Banff) distinguished himself by climbing on top of a dumpster in which a black bear was seeking garbage, closing the lid and quickly jumping off. This was really stupid for two reasons–first because of the bear (yikes) and second because it was only 10 days after the cast had been removed from his broken leg.

All animals can be unpredictable, especially when confronted suddenly. One of my most heart-pounding moments was in the Tetons when we suddenly came upon a cow moose with a young calf. Fortunately, mamma and baby decided to leave! From long experience with domestic animals, I know they can be unpredictable. A rancher friend was gored seriously by a cow (purebred and a show animal, which was why her horns hadn't been removed) with a newborn calf. Another was dragged to death by a horse. And we all know about the sweet and lovable dogs that decide to turn nasty (which is why I keep a really close watch on my sweet, lovable, wimpy Labrador when my 4-year-old grandson is around–any dog will bite if sufficiently provoked, and a 4-year-old can be quite provoking).

Don't take any animal, wild or domesticated, for granted!

I've read that the proper behavior when meeting a bear is not to appear threatening or yell or wave your arms (that's what you do with cougars, not bears) but to speak quietly and slowly back off, giving the bear his space. You don't make eye contact, either (eye contact, again, is for cougars, not bears)–bears find this threatening. It sounds as though some people posting here have confused the different behaviors recommended when confronting these two very different animals. I suspect I need to read the book about BC bears, too.

My personal experience (discounting roadside bears in Yellowstone, fortunately much less common than when I was younger) is of seeing the rear ends of black bears leaving the area. The one cougar I ever saw in the wild was a tawny streak disappearing into the forest (good thing, because my companion had her rifle ready). In other words, no real experience. Of course, while growing up in Wyoming, I heard lots of bear stories, some of them funny, others horrifying.

Interesting, but had the commenter read the entry carefully, it said nothing about wind not affecting the effectiveness or range of bear spray, it simply said that wind is often not a factor.

However, if one encounters a hostile bear in truly unfavorable wind conditions, he/she may then wish to use a more powerful but less bear friendly weapon.

Regarding firing from the holster: I have test fired every bear spray I've ever owned from the hip. So I can say from personal experience that it can easily and accurately be directed from that position and that the only way you can hit yourself in the face with it is if that is where you are aiming.

Perhaps the commenter could relate his personal experience that counters mine, or lacking that, peer reviewed scientific literature.

Donna please don't get whigged out I don't think anyone here considers animals an iminant threat to you if you're backpacking. Its just one of several things that can go wrong and there are various ways to minimize the risk if you're worried. There seems to be some agreement that BC is more of a problem area than say Tennessee, I wonder why. I remember for a while it seemed like a lot of black bear attacks came out of the upper midwest but that seems to have stopped. Probably because they shut down the dumps.
I have seen a couple of detailed lists of all known bear attacks that included things like whether it was fatal, and the date and location. I would like to see someone really go through those and see what the implications are. I'm going to enjoy my camping one way or the other but I think knewing a few more facts might make the discussion more intelligent.
If we know more we can be smart but also rest easy knowing that we've minimized whatever small risk is there. When my food is sealed up in a oderproof bag way up in a tree and I'm not camped on a bear trail I know that I'm proabley safer than back home in bed. I already know the risk is small but I've virtually eliminated it by taking the appropriate precautions.

You're right. I usually am pretty comfortable out in the forest, even solo. The black bears here make so much noise in the brush, that I can identify if it's bear, deer, or 'other'. Generally, I've learned to just ignore the bears, but know where they are. Some folks here never see one when they hike, but I do. Maybe because I choose trails less traveled. When I saw the older cub up in the tree I wasn't afraid, just cautious. I will keep evaluating each encounter as to what action..or no action…to take.

As for hiking out west or in Canada, I won't go alone. Grizzlies scare the heck outta me. I would rather be with people who are familiar with the territory. I know…I'd love to hike Yellowstone some day. I like the raw and wild.

From my personal experience in Idaho hunting versus trail hiking is night and day. I rarely see any animals hiking the more heavily travelled trails yet when hunting off trails anything has been possible.

As a 'foreigner' I find the bear discussion rather exotic in that we don't have bears where I come from {New Zealand and Australia }
I am planning to walk the JMT next year so what to do about this bear thing?
A bear canister of course, and sensible precautions. Anything else? I guess the park authorities put out warnings if and when a problem bear is reported?
MountainMule

Bear spray is not needed on the JMT except as a personal comfort item. If it makes you feel more secure, carry the extra 16 oz.

You already know about and plan to use a bear canister. That will solve most of your problems, assuming you keep it locked unless you're sctively working in and out of it.

The next best thing you can do is to avoid camping in areas of historically high bear activity; Lower Vidette Meadow, Bubbs Creek, the Rae Lakes, LeConte Canyon, Thousand Island Lake, and Lyell Canyon. Plan your route so as to minimize the need to camp in these areas.

When you must camp in one of these areas, try to avoid the established campsites if possible, especially those with bear boxes. These are on every bear's nightly travel route. Fix dinner along the trail, then continue hiking for another couple of miles and set up a stealth camp where no one has been before. This does NOT mean alongside the trail; get 50 meters or more off to the side and out of site. Bears often walk the trail at night for the same reason you do – it's easier than bushwacking.

The only really troublesome (camper-acclimated) bears are found between Reds Meadow and Happy Isle. The one exception to my no campsite with bear boxes rule is the backpackers' campground at Tuolumne Meadows. It is almost impossible to avoid staying there, since you'll want the store, post office, and/or grill. Each tent site has its own bear box.

Thanks Bob for your advice. I get the picture. Your info is in my ever-growing file on the JMT. Cheers,
PeterR

Mr. Brown Bear at Thousand Island Lake. He Came right threw our camp at about 3:00 in the afternoon!!!

It seemed like he had "Ben there done that" many times. Bob makes a great point about stealth camping off the main trail…Parts of the JMT are a Bear HWY.

Bob, Thanks for the useful info on campsite selection on the JMT. How and when does bear activity change with fall and winter moving in. I'll be on the JMT starting on the 23rd and (hopefully) finishing on the 5th. Wondering if running into bears will be as much of a concern at higher elevations.

I did my trips in August each year, so I would only be guessing about the expected levels of bear activity in late Sept/early Oct on the JMT. We saw no bears or bear sign at all on this year's northbound trip (Aug 1 – 20) from Cottonwood Pass to Reds Meadow. As such, we avoided the area of greatest activity (Reds Mdw to Happy Isle).

That said, I'd expect fewer bears, but a higher activity as they try to bulk up before hibernation. However, Yosemite NP is a whole different ecosystem. You could always call the Tuolumne Meadows Wilderness Center and ask the ranger.

Roger- good point about the book publisher. I hadn't considered that. But it does go to reinforce my point- sensationalizing threats posed by animals does sell.

> I've used pepper spray on dogs while biking and they go down fast. It's the owners
> that come chasing after me because precious Killer was set loose on me on purpose and
> didn't live up to his name.

That's why you should never empty the can on the dog – save some for the owner.

Cheers

hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahhahahahahahahhahahahaha!

Just a thought: an old hiker once said that most bears prefer eating hikers seasoned with pepper spray.

Based on my personal experience with black bears in US East (so far I have not encountered bears when in US West including trips to Yosemite and Sequoia N.P) , you can not predict the outcome. Some flee immediately – you catch a glimpse of black streak and sound of cracking brush. One that my son and I saw just sat by fairly close and scratched its back. Some move away but keep turning and looking at you (a sow and three cubs).

My guess is that bears are like dogs and people. Most are good, but there a few mean ones out there. Fortunately the odds are in our favor when hiking. Most likely, you will not be a bear's meal.

Jay, thats not a brown bear its a black bear, thats brown. This is a brown bear. Cheers
Photo taken with canon g9 :)

Edit image

Sorry Ali-Your right a black bear who is brown. That is a cool picture of yours!!!! I once saw a black bear with a white stripe on his back in the Trinity Alps..

-Jay

Jay I just wanted to put up a picture so people here could see the difference. They are all big and scarry to me and best seen at a distance if at all. BTW I swear a brown bear came into my camp south east of Tahoe ca. I dont care what the rangers say I have seen them both up close and can tell the difference. Ali

Here's an excellent site to learn to tell apart a "black" bear (which can come in several colors, including cinnamon) and a grizzly (sometimes called "brown" although their colors can vary too). It was designed for Montana hunters. http://fwp.mt.gov/bearid/default.html

While all animals are unpredictable, grizzlies appear to be more so. They're bigger, too!

There are some bears that are active year round, according to the rangers.

Yosemite has an unfortunate long history of "friendly" bears. They encouraged feeding them for a good long while. (footage starts at 2:00)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3DixbB70B7s&feature=PlayList&p=6E9548190E9D209A&playnext=1&playnext_from=PL&index=4

And no, there are no elk in Yosemite. The footage was probably borrowed from a different park… Tule elk are smaller than that.

Wow, the power!