How do you use your bivi and quilt to side sleep??

Hi Mike.
I turn inside the bivvy. The bivvy stays in the same place. I make sure any bivvy i buy is big enough for me to do this.
I use an Integral Designs all e-VENT bivvy bag with a micro tarp, and a TitaniumGoat bivvy bag with bigger tarps.

nm

Maybe it's how you use the set-up?
I keep the pad inside the bivvy-bag. I don't fasten the quilt straps under the pad either. When i turn, it's second nature to turn inside the quilt, just like you do at home. Wearing a seperate hood means it's simple to turn without dragging the whole quilt with you. As i said, i like a bivvy-bag big enough for turning in, but i also like a quilt that is wide enough to turn under. My Nunatak Arc Specialist quilt is 55" wide, and is just about perfect for me at 5'10" 175lbs. I think that smaller quilts are more suited to back sleepers, and those who stay in the one position all night.
The wide series of quilts from Jacks'r'Better are ones i would consider as well.

Mike,
I looked at the bivi you are talking about (the ID all event) and it basically has just a zip+hood. That would mean that when you turn to your side you are sleeping with your face towards the bivi wall and ears near the opening….hmm that doesnt sound so great. Do you manage to sleep through the night that way with comfort?

M

nm

The ID all e-Vent bivvy-bag has a drawstring closure, no zip.
I’ve never slept with my head in the bag. I like to sleep with my head in the open. This helps manage condensation as well, by not breathing into the bag. The tarp protects the head anyway.

It was David who recommended the ID bag to me a while ago. I'm glad i listened. :)

nm

mike what you are saying basically is that the tarp allows you to have head outside of bivi and thus this is less of an issue?

Would love to hear from other people who use bivi in a stand alonemode with quilts.
m

"mike what you are saying basically is that the tarp allows you to have head outside of bivi and thus this is less of an issue?"

You got it. Even a small micro-tarp can make a huge difference to your comfort, if you hike in an area with high rainfall. Not an issue in areas with stable weather patterns.

The bivy and quilt combo works well for me. I start on my back, but then turn to one side and then later to another. Also I pull my legs up sometimes when on my side. Occasionally I need to adjust a bit, but it's not been a problem.

Combinations that work for me…

Vapr Quantum Bivy Sack

AND

(

No Sniveller quilt

OR

MLD 2Thirds XP Quilt sometimes with Cocoon Hoody and/or pant

)

AND

(

GG pad

OR

Thermarest short

)

George,
i didint really understand – you are saying that you just turn INSIDE the quilt and keep the qult stationary with respecet to the pad and that would mean your face isnt pointing to the opening in the bivi but sideways?

off topic – im thinking about the MLD2/3 – what weight do you have (i assume 2.5oz/sqyd) and what temps did you manage to work with that?

Mike

The bivy shifts enough with my body. So does the pad. When I adjust the pad back fully underneath me, the bivy is turned enough. The quilt pretty much stays on top.

When I get the time – maybe this weekend – I will write down/get pics of the specifics of what is happening when I turn from side to side.

MLD 2/3 + sack is 9.6 oz
This past summer during upper 50 to 60 F mountain nights, I wore t-shirt. I was in the bivy under tarp. Occasionally when I felt cold, I put cocoons on and then was comfy.

Without a bivy sack but in a Contrail on warm night I just used the 2/3. Was adequate.

Have not used it on 40 F or lower nights. I plan to try the 2/3 plus my No Sniveller this winter sometime. Maybe around twenties. We'll see : )

It's easy to roll around and side sleep in a quilt / bivy set-up.

I'm a side sleeper, and I do fine. You need to adjust a little as you roll, but that comes naturally.

M!

nm

I think this is one of those things that are hard to understand conceptually, but work out immediately in practice. I usually have the pad in the bivy, turn without moving the quilt, the bivy stays fixed, but the fabric sort of squashes down so I'm not breathing into it. This is using the BMW equivalent of the Nunatak Arc Specialist, an Oware quantum/silnylon drawcord bivy, a GG nightlite pad, and a small tarp or a SMD Gatewood Cape. Condensation in the bivy has never been a problem.

nm

one reason i like my montbell alpine stretch with no zipper,
but with the quilt/bivy for me it only works like this:

bivy MUST be staked down
pad better inside but can be under (kinda tight if inside)
i have an arc ghost & have it pulled tight into virtual sleeping bag

obviously this is for temps on the colder end of the quilts range – else why bother w/ the bivy anyway?

the one time i forgot i had to stake down the bivy was horrible – the quilt & bivy got all twisted together & i woke up trapped inside a freakin straighjacket with no apparent exit (head opening was twisted away into effective non existence – i had become a blind mole buried in ultralight technology, while increasingly panicked and oxygen deprived (which form their own nice perpetual motion, in fact, i believe they generated a positive motion flux of carbon dioxide and panic)

but yeah, it's totally do-able if you do it right

David – RE hijack..feel free you are indeed restating what i meant

Mike – that wasnt quite informative ;) can you elaborate onhow you do it and what conditions?

James – i see you have the pad inside. is that the thin night light? do you use some other form of ground protection on the outside in conjunction? have you ever slept like this w/o tarp when you had to close down the bivi?

Cary – what bivi are you using? is it under tarp? BTW you r experience with suffocating reminds me of the first night i tried the bivi in the house with my 10F nunatak bag and closed everything tight. all was ok for about 60 seconds then temp began to rise and blood rushed to the head and i paniked and was really hard to get out…;)

i realize that people manage to do this but its one thing doing it in 50F temps and under a tarp than say 20F/ in the rain w/o tarp. Does anybody have experience with bivi alone and cold/precip?

my thoughts were maybe to use a two pad system: take a GGthinlight 1/8" INSIDE bivi to seal the back of quilt and take say a GGtorsolight outside for the interface with the ground (i would probabaly also add a GGpolycryo just to keep things clean and protect bivi.
has anyone tried this?

Mike

> my thoughts were maybe to use a two pad system: take a GGthinlight 1/8" INSIDE bivi
> to seal the back of quilt and take say a GGtorsolight outside for the interface
> with the ground (i would probabaly also add a GGpolycryo just to keep things clean
> and protect bivi.

At some stage in bad weather a tarp-tent becomes a more sensible, lighter and more comfortable alternative.

Cheers

Roger,
although there might be truth in your statement we need to compare apples to apples:
Tarptent scenario:
tarptent sublitesil – the lightest waterproof tarptent- 615g
two poles (if i dont use trekking poles – optional ones that henry sells are 140gx2=280g
some guy+tentioners – say we go reasonable UL its 50g
minimum 4 stakes say you take 4UL ones and 2 stronger ones just in case 50g
your favorite pad – whatever you want.

the result – 995g, lots of room, no bugs, dry, fun and games – non bombproof

bivi scenario:
MLD alpine bivi – 350g ( and this is a bonafide bivi)
extra thinlight1/8" pad – 55g
extra polycryo 40g if i take the whole thing (and one could argue that if you can afford to place your tentfloor on the ground firectly so could the bivi user)
your same favorite pad

the result: 445g, totally windproof, water and snow proof, sleep anywhere (like above treeline), no room, no games, probably get wet in trasition if raining while getting in, 550g=19oz less!!

So i think its fair to say that for a short (2~3 night) trip tarptents are more spacious, fun&games, no bugs, less wet but more sensitive to wind/snow and a bivi is bombproof but not comfy and lighter

M

I use the bivi mostly for added warmth/wind protection, but it also works very well to provided the extra layer for moisture pushing out to accumulate on (instead of the bag itself) – this last is huge with a down bag

i bring a nano tarp 0 or a ponchotarp in case of rain, but haven't had to use it yet

the bivi is the older one titanium goat used to make – very light (about 4.5 oz), waterproof bottom, the top is dwr, good for spray/condensation protection only

i don't think i'd ever want to try to ride out any real precip with just a bivi

A couple things:

If it is 20 degrees Fahrenheit any precipitation you are likely to see is snow.

If you think that just having a non-hooped bivy over your face is claustrophobic, try it with snow piling on. I suspect you would be in danger of suffocation.

To say a bivi is bombproof may be true in the sense that it won't blow away in a storm, but believe me, having weathered a night or two in a bivi in cold rain, all those things that are being suggested, i.e. small tarps, poncho tarps and just using a tarptent would be worth the weight penalty. As far as I am concerned, a WPB bivi is a standalone shelter either only if you are expecting good weather, or in an alpine climbing scenario where you are willing to suffer a good deal to reach a goal.

Michael–That's with the GG NightLight, torso length, which is 3/4" thick. They also make the ThinLight, which comes in 1/8, 1/4, & 3/8 inch thicknesses. I don't usually think to bring another ground sheet, as I can usually sleep on duff (Sierras). I just got a Stephenson Down Air Mattress, with which I will use another layer of ground pro (thin plastic), have the bivy on the pad, strapped to it, using the MLD Soul Bivy, and sleep on granite with impunity (assuming she's available).

I have in the past closed the bivy down as far as possible, in no tarp situations, because of extreme cold, when I had a less warm sleeping bag. Even then, condensation wasn't a problem, but the air was very dry. (So presumably the air coming out of me was less wet, and what moisture it did have dissipated in the surrounding air.)

But to put this in perspective, I hike primarily in the Sierras, which are pretty dry, and, in the summer, if there is any rain, it's often in the afternoon, usually clearing by night. So you're mostly defending yourself, in order of importance and depending on the time of year, against cold or bugs, then wind, then rain, and finally, at the boundaries of the shoulder seasons, snow.

Great image, Cary!!