What is your willingness to pay for lighter gear?

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Gail,
I was just teasing you. My wife always tells me that people will take me seriously when I make comments like that. :)
Tom

I might have missed some, but here's what a quick check found for…

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The Fundamental Ratios of Gear Cost
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Brian's Vacuum:

Cost / weightReduction

Quoddy Time:

Cost / GearUseFrequency

Mike R's Work Value:

Cost / Earnings

Mike W's Bulkiness Test:

Cost / volumeReduction

Ben's Fringe Factor:

Cost / psychicRush

I do make the $/oz saved calculation when considering a purchase. For me, I won't go much above $10/oz, although I've made some purchases before implementing this calculation process. In the mean time, I had bought, not one but two, ti pots when a far cheaper aluminum grease pot would have costs far less and been only slightly heavier.

I also recognise a value in additional function and in bulk savings. So, it's not always a purely $/oz calculations but it is a huge factor and serves me well to prevent me from making an "emotional" purchase, simply because the item is the latest, lightest thing out there!

Possibly two more to add:

Cost / gear duration

Cost / mileage hiked

As mentioned, given the same dollars / weight saved, one may be able to justify plunking down the dollars for a gear piece that will last a long time.

As for the second ratio, spending hundreds to save a pound might not make sense if all one does is car camping. OTOH, if you habitually hike for miles and days on end, then it may be worth it to you…

It has been fascinating to learn what factors are important to folks when purchasing gear. Some I have also considered when making a purchase and others have been novel to me. George and Ben, thanks for providing the summary lists.

The original question was certainly simplistic (and designed to be so). Early in the thread I asked: in your past purchase decisions how much were you willing to pay to reduce your pack weight by one ounce. And as a follow up, at what point did the cost : ounces reduced ratio deter your purchase. Sure other factors influenced your decision, but if you look back on purchases you’ve already made (or didn’t make) were these other factors not also included in your decision?

I still remain convinced that if you look back at your decision to purchase or not purchase, the variables (which you individually consider important) are reflected in your decision to buy or not to buy. And that cost and weight of the gear in question remain highly influential regarding purchasing decisions (particularly given the “light” theme of this forum – and that most everyone considers finances). George’s point is well taken, that it is not just cost and weight but many other factors. I agree. Perhaps where we differ in opinion is the relative influence of the factors (which clearly vary between each of us).

This has been a great discussion! I’ve always been impressed by the depth of the discussions that occur here at BPL. I’m equally impressed by our ability to disagree without flaming and being unruly to each other. Today, I’ll work on averaging (and providing the range) of the cost : ounces reduced ratios that have been provided thus far for decisions to purchase or not. If anyone else cares to share their specific data, I (and several others who uses these calculations) would be very interested in them. To summarize again, I’m looking for the cost you incurred by purchasing new gear divided by the ounces the new piece of gear reduced your pack weight. If you sold the gear that was replaced then subtract it from the purchase price of the new gear. The weight reduction is simply the difference in weight between the old and new gear.

I think some of us would be less-than-honest if we act like our buying decisions were all made after careful and thoughtful analyses. How many times (let's be honest) did we buy something that totally filled a "need" that we didn't even know we had? :)

I've noticed that i seem to buy more if i can't 'get out there' as much as i want to for whatever reason. Anyone else notice that if you have a leg injury, for instance, and can't hike, then that latest bit of gear you've been looking at becomes even more desirable?

For me, a big factor missing in all of this discussion is "how much can I re-sell it for"? I do not hoard gear, so my purchases are as much about deciding if this is right for me, or if I should sell/give it on to someone else. The original question was pretty naive to the urges that motivate humans to purchase "stuff". Cost per unit is a very small part of the equation IMHO.

Here are the results thus far:
For those making a purchase (n=9), the descriptive statistics for the ratio of “cost incurred : ounces of pack weight reduced” are:
Mean = 9.5, standard deviation = 5.3
Median = 10, range = 2.5 to 20.83

For those deciding against making a purchase (n=5), the descriptive statistics for the ratio of “cost incurred : ounces of pack weight reduced” are:
Mean = 34.8, standard deviation = 16.5
Median = 27, range = 22.5 to 61

Using the statistical software SAS (verision 9.1.4) to conduct a nonparametric test (Wilxocon Rank Sum test) comparing the medians of these two groups, we find that the ratio is significantly lower (p < 0.05) in those who purchased the gear of interest compared to those who decided against making a purchase. The Wilcoxon Rank Sum test was chosen since two assumptions of the t-test were violated by this data (i.e. the data was not normally distributed due to a small sample size, and the variance between the two groups are unequal). Therefore we can conclude that the ratio of “cost incurred : ounces of pack weight reduced” is significantly associated with our decision to purchase gear. However, as we’ve discussed previously, other factors are undoubtedly important. It is noteworthy that the ranges of the reported ratios for each group do not overlap. It appears that around $21 : ounce saved is a threshold that this representative sample are unwilling to cross.

Brian,
No offense, but I think your data was tainted when you chose to ignore all the factors that lead to a purchasing approval/denial by others.
Spring is here. Turn off the computer and enjoy the great outdoors!
Chris

I think Christopher actually meant to say: "Spring is here. Click that stupid "Buy" button already! Now turn off the computer, and enjoy the great outdoors! :)

Haha! Nope. The only things I bought today were gas and worms. I didn't catch anything, but fishing is still nice with a Ti-Tri and a coffee press.

Chris and Ben – For me at least, part of the satisfaction I get from this recreational hobby is the research and analysis one can put into it. I think I’ve made that excruciatingly obvious. :) Flawed or not, I’m enjoying looking at this data and its trends.

If I did not have other commitments keeping me inside this weekend, I would be outside! I hope you have had better luck getting outside than I have…

Brian:

OK, I confess… gear research and analyses are fun. I should know too, since I spend way too much time doing just that — and surfing these fourms! :)

Yeah, like John Haley I'm retired and spent $100s upon $100s getting into reliable UL & lightweight gear. That $300.+ WM Megalite bag being the most expensive and the REI UL 60 Cruise pack being the best bargain for the design, quality and features. But slogging up the Tuolmne River trail in Yosemite or the Clear Creek trail in Grand Canyon made all those light weight purchases worth the money. I was tired at the end of the day but not exhausted.

I've really felt sorry for my companions carrying their heavier loads of "standard" backpacking gear. One woman finally began trying my gear out and is starting to make the switch to lightweight gear.

I know I'll have the equipment for years of steady use. That and the satisfaction I get from using really good quality gear keeps me from any "buyer's remorse".
("Buyer's Remorse": evidenced by the selling off new gear at fire sale prices.)

Eric
P.S. "Gear Research & Analysis"…you guys kill me with these terms. LOL! But it is true, I do a LOT of gear research & analysis. And boy is it ever fun. That's the main reason for this forum.

This discussion pushed me over the edge on a purchasing decision. I ordered it this morning. Based on past history with these issues, there was never any serious doubt about the ultimate decision to break down and buy it.

I went down the path of spending too much money to save ounces; then I hit bottom and realized that durability and other constraints were important also.
So, if anyone is interested, let's turn this thread question on its head.. what incrementally higher weight are you willing to carry to save money?

I choose the lightest gear which meets my functional requirements(what), design constraints(how), and performance requirements(how well). So I am willing to carry a Fenix Cree light (for example), which is heavier than a Photon Freedom, but brighter.

>>> over the edge

Only beyond the edge can we try to fly!

I'm seeing us all as a honking flock pushed or maybe pulled by each other over the edge : )

Congrats on the purchase