Help with Bearpaw website!

Can't make the google cache link clickable, here it is in full http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:7aeEwLx9YDcJ:www.bearpawwd.com/floors/bathtub_sq_rect.php+&cd=6&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=uk

Bear Paw is lying to you. On the cached site, it says "When the floor is made for 2 or more people, we can add the thru-floor-pole seal to the floor free of charge". And at the bottom, it even has a picture that says "Optional Floor Seal". Saying "We can add something for free" makes it pretty clear that the thru-floor pole seal is NOT standard. I would demand Bear Paw pay for return shipping and refund your purchase.

My one experience with Bearpaw via some email exchanges left me not impressed. I was disappointed to say the least. I also feel like it is the only negative interaction I have had with any of the cottage companies. Gossamer Gear, MLD, Katabatic, WB, Nunatak, Tarptent, etc… Ironically the email exchange issue stemmed from wording issue one the website.

Stay away from Bearpaw. In my experience, the quality is not great as compared to other cottage manufacturers and the two products that I received were very overspec on weight. Just my perspective.

I hate talking bad about any company or person for whatever reason, but I ordered an 8×10 tarp from BPWD about a year and a half ago. I received it only two days later, which is great, but it looked as if it was sewn by a blind man. The ridgeline tie out isn't centered on one end, the ridgeline itself is crooked, other seams are crooked and sloppy, tie outs weren't adequately reinforced, and it just looks messy. It did come (kind of) seam sealed however. It also weighs 17(!)oz. So, it seems like BPWD is just hit or miss. Some people get an amazing product, others don't. It almost seems as if the quality of you're product depends on how much you pay for it. Sorry to hear about what happened to you. Hopefully it gets resolved fully in an appropriate amount of time and with little effort on your part.

"I received it only two days later, which is great, but it looked as if it was sewn by a blind man." Sadly, not uncommon in my experience. I've seen quite a number of his products over the years at the GGGs. Saw mid one time that looked like they sewed the mid panel tie outs outside in. Sorry you got burned on your floor.

Oh thanks guys I feel much better now, I hated the whole situation and was inclined to blame myself. I've turned to paypal now, hopefully they'll be able to sort this. Still can't believe a company would go to such lengths as modifying website etc, all over a $69 floor.

Sole trader companies like BPWD have to walk a fine line: without additional resources on tap it's not possible to quickly respond to spikes in demand. Do you let your lead times build, do you streamline your production runs by reducing your peak season product line, or do you rush product out the door? Something has to give. I am astonished at how many variants John offers, and how quickly he turns around orders. Sadly the tradeoff seems to be consistent quality. I've owned one of his inners. It was merely OK. I learned, you get what you pay for. It begs the question though, why try to cover your tracks like this, or be abrasive when dealing with an unhappy customer? Ron Bell seems to get the balance right. He sets expectations up front on lead times, and usually beats them, If there's a mistake, he's on it and a replacement is in the mail the very next day. He's figured out over the years that he cannot do everything, keeps a staff year round and ramps up the numbers in anticipation of peak season. Managing employees isn't everyone's cup of tea, but his business model works much better to meet market demands.

A few years ago I ordered a tarp from Bearpaw. The overall quality was borderline OK and delivery was quick, but the tieouts were sewn poorly and at weird angles to the typical direction of pull on a flat tarp. I emailed my concerns and the response was callous and snippy, as if I was in the wrong for expecting reasonable quality in a simple rectangular tarp. The product quality I saw was definitely the poorest of any cottage manufacturer I've worked with (MLD, SMD, ZPacks, O'Ware). I never shopped with Bearpaw again. I am not surprised at all that they edited the site's language then lied about their clear intent. The internet is forever.

Thanks for posting this (all of you). I've been considering ordering a CF flat tarp and a net tent, and have been plotting the numbers out from all the cottage manufacturers I know of (MLD, ZPacks, BearPaw, HMG, YAMA, etc.). I remember reading not-so-great experiences from BP before, but was starting to convince myself that maybe the [actually not so great] price difference might be worth it. This was a good wake up call.

I've had one interaction with this business via email, and it was enough for me to never visit their website again. Not overtly rude but pretty short with me when I had a question about one of his inners and I was moments away from making a purchase from him. That money went to Zpacks instead and I've never looked back. I don't expect any of them to kiss my butt, but it's going to be tough for him to compete with companies like MLD and Zpacks who not only deliver exceptional customer service, but deliver an exceptional product as well.

I've ordered a number of items from Bearpaw. Yes, the quality is not as good as many of the other manufacturers, but it also cost much less. You get what you pay for. Don't expect the quality to be as good as others when it costs 30% less, that is a no-brainer. John may not have a vibrant personality, but he has always been straight with me and I have never had any issues. I don't currently have anything of his creation, but am looking at getting a pyranet of a specific size as he is the only one that I know of that will do custom work for pretty much anything you want.

I'd like some custom work done; can you suggest another vendor besides Bearpaw? Experiences positive or negative? Sorry for derailing the thread! I figure we've dumped enough on Bearpaw….

I also had heard reports about Bearpaw poor quality, and the only reason I ordered was that noone else seemed to offer bathtubs in 70D silnylon. With hindsight I should have searched better, or else asked Ron at MLD if he could make a custom one for me (he currently uses 30D for his bathtubs, but he works with 70D for his packs). Obviously I knew nothing about Bearpaw deceptive practices or I'd have stayed well away.

I have examined 4 or 5 Bearpaw inners and groundsheets (but not outers) And they are of ok quality, some better than others. They are cheap and cheerful :-)

I ordered a 10X10 gold silnylon tarp for that inner child who always wanted a gold tarp. The perimeter tie-outs are solid and it came seam-sealed (I was expecting to do that myself). Basic tarp & did I mention "GOLD" – such a happy color. Will be ordering a few more, maybe smaller though, for the scout troop to give to incoming Webelos. This product looks like it be fairly long-lived even if it is abused by 11 to 14 yrs old boys with no camping experience.