Trail runner with approach shoe grip?

I love my Leadville 1210s, for serious traction the Salomon Speedcross 3 is hard to beat. I don't know if I'd call either an approach really..

I recently restored a pair of Lowa Renegade II GTX Mid's (managed to catch on fire on a trip last year…). Straight up hiking boot with Vibram and Gore-Tex but wow they are flexible and light for a serious boot.

Now I'm gonna feel bad if they completely don't fit – or real good if they do of course.

The Salomons that I have had were all good with their traction and lasted forever. They were not great on wet rock but ok, and the fit was more narrow than La Sportiva.

Ito- fingers crossed :)

Salomons would definitely not work if they are narrower than the Sportivas

I did not find my URs to be sticky at all. I took a bad fall two weeks ago because of the lack of grip. They've since been demoted to trail jogging on relatively flat and grassy surfaces.

I had a paid of 5-10s many moons ago and they were very sticky. I haven't owned one since so I can't comment on the new models.

I have been totally pleased with the INOV-8 line, of which I have three, where you can select models that have a sticky bottom. If I had to bet the farm, I'd get INOV-8.

if the Mutants don't work out, I'll probably give the Roclite 280's a go

My free Mutants arrived yesterday, holy crap what an outsole! Very aggressive and according to the attached tags, their stickiest compound. I ordered 10.5+ and the length seems to be just right. The heel and midfoot fit snugly, just right. Definitely more roomy toebox than either the Helios or Ultra Raptors, not quite as roomy as my N2s, but possibly enough- a few runs and I'll know. If the fit is there. I know a perfect place to test the compound out. :)

The inovs work just fine on this type of terrain

;)

Nice to hear that the fit at least has potential. I was worried the mid section might be too narrow on you? And yeah, that outer sole is no joke. Never seen something so aggressive and so sticky at the same time.

I think I'm about to order pair of Wildcats from Europe, no size here in Japan..

eric- yes that's exactly the stuff I'm talking about!

Ito- my foot isn't overly wide (maybe not at all????), I've just been blessed with longer than average toes :), so the toe box is always what makes or breaks the deal on shoes and I can tell you it breaks it far more often than not

it would be great if the Mutants work out in the fit department, a couple of runs and I'll know- if not I'm going to give one of the beefier Inov shoes a go

The Terrex seems to be among the best approach shoes, the soles are amazing. I don't own them yet but I know many people that do and tested them myself.

I currently use Inov-8 as well, my problem with them is the very soft soles – or shoes in general. If you're running on rocky terrain you have to be careful otherwise it's really annoying because you feel every stone. It also seems to be that the softness of Inov-8 causes my foot to "swim" in the shoe, especially if you're on uneven, steep terrain (sideways) it sometimes feels as if you're standing not on the sole but on the wall.

La Sportiva has some great trail runners, but the price for this seems to be the higher weight of course.

To be specific i use the old inov roclite 295s on that type of terrain … Ive also used the terroc 330

I cant speak to the newer stuff

That type of terrain is really approach shoe territory … What the poster described as "swimming" is basically the lack of support on the uppers when the foot is in awkward positions

Note that this doesnt mean that you need boots or hi tops … But rather the upper deforms when sidehilling or other such positions and feels like its sliding im the shoe

The inovs i used seem to be less suceptible to the issue, but then they werent the most minimal inovs

Also minimalist shoes with soft soles arent the best for stepping on pointy rocks, which in the photo i posted might not be too avoidable … The inovs i used handles this fine

Approach shoes handle this rather easily … Our dear leader mistah jordan has an excellent article about it on BPL

The downside with approach shoes is the lack of tread on some models …. And that they may be stiffer or have more underfoot padding to handle said pointy rocks

Note my guide tennies are as light as my terrocs

;)

an approach shoe would definitely be the shoe of choice for that terrain; but this usually only represents a smaller portion of what I'm traveling and the fact that I'm running (at least when it's not so steep that I can run! :) ) also tends to rule out normal approach shoes

linky for article? I don't remember seeing that one

I do need a sticky sole, I do need rather aggressive tread, I do need them to be pretty stout, I need to be able to run in them and they need to fit my misfit toes; I might as well add that I want them relatively light- now that's certainly not too much to ask for :)

http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/techniques-for-talus-jordan.html

;)

@eric, that's interesting, because I was talking about the roclite 295.
In my opinion they are way too soft when walking/running on rocky ground..
And they also deform when sidehilling, slightly, as they don't really have a stiff shape.

I personally had no problem with the 295s in the terrain i posted as well as the photo below

Note that this section is pure rock steps, not dirt

They arent as stiff as approach shoes but i had no issues … My partner used merrel trail gloves and on the rock sections he was also fine … On the loose dirt and gravel he slipped a few times though

But like i said the photos i posted are really made for approach shoes

;)

eric thanks for the link! geez I wonder how many other gems I've missed

The La Sportiva Bushido would be my first choice for those types of conditions.
I like the Mutants too but prefer them for wet and muddy terrain. I feel that the Bushidos are a bit more nimble over rocks.

The Bushido's are indeed very (rock?) solid. Definitely no side deformation either. Personally they feel quite narrow even for La Sportiva, with not a very spacious toe box though – for my very narrow feet this is great, but I don't think it is something that would fit the OP with his need for room in the front.

looking at La Sportiva's site the Bushido is a little lighter (10.5 vs 10.7 oz, size 9), it also it uses a different compound

looks like they have three "sticky" compounds Frixion XT Red, XF Green and AT Blue- the XF Green is supposedly the stickiest which is on the Mutant, the Bushido uses XT Red which is the next stickiest

actually for sportiva (with the exception of actual climbing shoes) their stickiest compound is the vibram indro which they use on their approach shoes

unless yr doing slab though you shouldnt massive amounts of stickiness … just enough

generally "sticker" rubber wears down faster

;)

Personally I find the Bushidos have quite a wide toebox. Definitely not narrower than the Mutants. The Bushidos definitely have a narrow heel (which I love for the security it gives) and a snug midfoot but I've always had plenty of wiggle room for my toes (even when I had a damaged toenail which made it very sensitive the Bushidos were fine). I have slightly wider than "average" feet and wear Sportivas half a size larger than normal.

The Frixion XT (red) means that the sole uses both the Blue and Green Frixion compounds in the outsole.

^ ahhh- good to know to on the compounds; their site is a little lacking on what's what

good to know on the toe box, Mutants have the snug heel/mid-foot as well, which I also like- don't need/want a sloppy shoe, just lots of room to wiggle toes :)

Bushidos are nice but fit too small for my size 11 feet and REI only had sizes to 45 in store.

Slightly hijacking this thread because the answer to my question is probably pretty much identical to the what's been said already. I am NOT a runner (the only difference to the thread above), and only really go hiking. A typical multiday trip would be ~70% on trail, but then there is the odd day where I might be scrambling up some class 3 terrain. I'm looking for a good comfortable and lightweight shoe (so probably a trail runner) for this type of use, and will definitely seek out some of the suggestions above. The main criteria is comfort for hiking long hours, and not slipping on a variety of surfaces, especially rock – but loose or muddy ground also cannot be excluded. So if somebody wants to throw in any hiking rather than running-oriented options, I'm all ears. (But it's probably all been said already – good thread by the way).

the Mutants have deep lugs in addition to a grippy compounds and handle loose surfaces well I've got a 4-5 shorter (5-6 miles) runs under my belt with the Mutants and so far so good, will bump the mileage up this week with