Trail runner with approach shoe grip?

Nobody's made a GREAT crossover trailrunner / scrambling shoe that I know of. Approach shoes are sticky but they tend to have very narrow toe box & be quite stiff for running. The La Sportiva Ultra Raptor is a very good (though somewhat heavy) trail shoe with quite grippy rubber. The LS Helios SR ("sticky rubber") is a lighter option that sports good rubber and a 2mm heel drop. Sportiva has a couple of models for Spring 2016 that nicely fill this niche, using approach shoe rubber with more of a trail shoe fit. Out here in Boulder, where there's TONS of great scrambling in the Flatirons accessible by terrific running trails, it's popular to take one's favorite trail shoe to Rock & Resole and have them replace the outsole with Stealth C4. That stuff rocks (on rocks)! A popular shoe for this has been the old NB MT110s – makes a fantastic crossover running & scrambling shoe. HOWEVER, this rubber has basically no tread and stinks on surfaces like mud, grass, pine needles or snow!

We (my wife and I) run on rough trails in New Balance Leadville 1210s. Vibram sole, excellent traction. And WIDE fittings!

Cheers

La Sportiva and Inov-8 offer some running shoes with sticky climbing rubber.

Outside of those brands, you're probably looking at actual approach shoes which would be a bad idea. And the resole option with stealth rubber would be a bad idea for a running race too.

Peter- I ordered a pair of Helios last year and had to send them back, too narrow in the toe box (even upsized); I won an auction this past spring for a pair of LaSportivas (and an entry into a local race)- ordered a pair of Ultra Raptors (upsized) and sadly they were too narrow in the toe box as well. Both shoes looked very nice, they simply don't fit me :(

Stealth C4 sounds like a good option if everything was on rock, but none of the runs/races I do are solely on rock

Somebody should come up w/ a sticky outsole that has some knobbys on it!

Roger- I'll check out the NB's; my foot isn't overly wide (heel, midfoot)- I just need a lot of toe room, odd toes they're all pretty long except the little one- my Mom called them Irish toes :)

Nathan- I'll check into Inov8, my wife has a pair she really likes

Mike

The Adidas Terrex Boost look interesting. No personal experience, but my friend uses a similar shoe that I believe features the same Continental rubber that he's been very impressed with for scrambling in the Sierra and deep river canyon (American River) trips.

Engineered for fast, competitive mountain running, these men's outdoor shoes are built with a lightweight boost™ midsole that provides endless energy return. PRO MODERATOR™ support stabilizes your stride, and a rugged Continental™ Rubber outsole penetrates the ground and holds onto slick, slippery surfaces. The shoes feature a stretchy mesh upper, stable heel, speed lacing and EVA tongue top to ensure a snug, comfortable fit.

Weight: 11.5 ounces (size 9)
boost™'s energy-returning properties keep every step charged with an endless supply of light, fast energy
Stretch mesh upper with synthetic overlays for added durability and support; EVA tongue top and collar for perfect fit
Speed lacing construction for fast and snug lacing; Sock-like feel; Welded seamless construction; EVA frame with extended side wings for added stability
PRO-MODERATOR™ medial support device prevents overpronation
Continental™ Rubber for optimal grip in wet conditions
Imported

thanks- those look like they might fit the bill; my luck with fitment hasn't been stellar, but definitely worth a shot :)

Mike,
I have done some running/scrambling in the 5-10 Guide Tennie and also their Ascent.
I'm thinking that you will find them too narrow and probably too stiff for an ultra distance.
Devils Backbone coming up?

Ed that's kind of what I thought on approach shoes. Ran the Beaverhead last weekend, killer course (almost literally:) ). Yup, running the Devils Backbone this weekend

Mike

Vasque Mindbender. I don't even take my rock climbing approach shoes anymore.

Not sure it's still being made, but the patagonia rover might also fit into this category.

How's the fit on these, if they are on the narrow side they won't work.

I just looked at some reviews for the Adidas Terrex and several reviewers said they run narrow :(

For scree and dirt, you still want some decent tread which some approach shoes lack

The old terroc and trailroc inovs work great with pretty sticky rubber IME, no idea on the new versions

The old guide tennie were great on rock, but on loose scree and dirt werent the best … The new ones however may be better with an updated tread

;)

I immediately thought about the Ultra Raptors. Funny because they are too wide for me.

Have you checked the Mutant's from La Sportiva? I'm hesitant to mention them, but they have an incredible outer sole.

They also have a tight heel, and secure midfoot area, but wide toe box. The mid section is fairly flexible as to how loose/tight you can set it and for me the toes were the most loose I have felt them to be. Not sure if I would order them over internet in your case, but if you can try them on, who knows. The outer sole makes it worth checking them out.

They have two sizes left in the Men’s sizing, more in the Women’s.

If they have your size, you have to get this shoe. It’s my favorite trail runner by far, I love scrambling and low-class climbing whenever I get a chance and these keep me solidly connected to the rock. Check out Dave Chenault’s review at ToeSalad for more details.

I’m just bummed that they’re out of my size and I didn’t buy a backup pair.

I've had good success with Saucony Xodus 3 trail runners in New Zealand on mixed tracks with loose rock or scree, mud and leaves and rivers.

The shoes have a rock plate, 4mm drop and have been remarkably robust.

looks like I'm out of luck w/ the Rover (need 10-10.5), I'll check out the Mutants- I like LS shoes, just not the fit thus far

I had a pair of Exodus, good shoe, but no more rock grip than the PI N2's I'm running now; I'm happy in every w/ my N2's- they simply lack that really sticky grip needed for lots of rock

Just went out for a short run up a small mountain in my area last night and grabbed my inov-8 f-lite 195's because some thunderstorms had just rolled through and I was going up and down some slabby rock and boulder trails.

I forgot how grippy those shoes are. I mostly run in salomon s-lab sense nowadays, so it had been a while since I ran in the inov-8's.

On rocks that I was slipping on in the dry with the salomons, I did not slip once in the wet with the f-lites. The rubber is that much stickier. Those shoes are also helped by having a very minimal tread pattern and being super flexible, so they really can contour pretty good around a rocks surface and maximize the contact patch. I've used other inov-8 shoes with the same rubber but more aggressive tread patterns (rocklite,x-talon) and been less than happy with the result on rocks. The flatter tread pattern of the f-lite was only really an issue for me trying to run on mud or wet leaves.

I've been using mind benders since the first model. I think they are slippery on lots of surfaces, but I use them because of the stiff sole, not the rubber. I don't think they offer the flexibility or stickiness desired.

The N2s have decently sticky rubber, better than most trail shoes. If you can't find a Sportiva shoe which works I think you're up a creek, though I'd love to be wrong about that.

So, what I'm reading in your OP is that you're looking for a shoe that performs well on loose and slippery scree. That's a different animal from slick/wet rock surfaces which is what I think approach shoes and "sticky" soles do well on. You do better on slick rock with maximum surface contact and soft rubber soles. You'll do better on loose scree with big deep lugs that are as close to cleats as reasonably possible.

I have LaSportiva Wildcats that do pretty well on smooth wet rocks but it doesn't dig into loose scree. I wear Salomon XA Comp 7's on loose scree trails. A little bulkier but nice wide toe box (in women's, at least) and solidly stable.

I've had good luck with Salomon Sense Ultra SG's. Nice lugs for the soft stuff and sticky rubber for the hard stuff. A little YMMV since I hike in the East with different terrain, but figured would throw it out there.

Ryan

Dave- the grip is pretty good with the N2’s, but definitely room for improvement, especially with wet rock- and yes very possible I’m sol :)

The stuff I was in last weekend was a combination of loose scree and smaller slabs, it was the slabs I was having the most difficulty with- the stuff was slick as is, but really nasty w/ the rain thrown on top, falling on rock hurts! :)

The Xodus 3.0's were mentioned earlier. I wear the 5.0's and have really loved them. I'm always surprised at how well they hold and grip surfaces. I'm always expecting to slip but don't. Plenty of room in the toe box too.

They have an aggressive vibram sole. 4mm drop if that matters to you. I'm only about 150 miles in my current pair but just bought another pair on REI's outlet. They were marked down to $82 and through July 18 you get another 25% off. $62 and free shipping. You can always return them since it's REI.

well as luck would have it, I won a pair of La Sportiva at the pre-case meeting for the Devil's Backbone- my choice of shoe :)

soooo I decided to try a pair of Mutants- I wear a size 10 in the N2's, the Helios I ordered previously were 43, the Ultra Raptors I believe were 43.5, this pair I'm going to try 44