PNW: Do Bears Break into Cars????

[Billy Ray]

Okay… another question for you Pacific Northwest people:
Do bears break into cars/campers up there?

Reason for my question is… I would love to drive my camper van up to the PNW but… Here in CA I would not dare to take my VW Camper Van to the trailheads and leave it unattended while out backpacking. There is a kitchen, stove, and fridge and it has been used for cooking. Sure, I can remove all the food, but I suspect there would be residual smells being that there is a kitchen. In CA the bears would smell this and break into it and demolish a relatively rare camper van in primo condition. And it is particularly vulnerable due to the slider windows that could easily catch a claw or two. :(

So what would yall PNWers advise… leave the camper van at home? Or bring it?
(Mind you, the van would be at the trail head unattended for a week at a time when out backpacking).

thanks,
Billy

[Jerry Adams]

Bears will not get into your camper van in PNW

They are fearful of humans

But, I've never parked a camper van at trailhead so…

I have had mice get into my car and my pickup. They like to eat stuff and tear up paper. I now use my bear container to put anything a mouse would like. I set a snap trap and have caught one or two mice per year – very sad.

[Richard Scruggs]

Even if bears don't, people definitely break into vehicles at trailheads.

Sometime ago, upon returning to the parking lot at the Snow Lakes trailhead for the Enchantments, we found our car and every other vehicle (more than two dozen) had been broken into. This included smashed windows on many of the vehicles.

We stopped at Leavenworth ranger station after departing the carnage at the parking lot to let them know, and were told that break-ins had been happening at that parking lot all summer. Funny they didn't mention that fact when we had stopped at the same ranger station on the way to the trailhead to ask about bear activity.

Guess that's our fault since we should have asked about any problems with people ransacking cars at the trailhead, too.

Google the trailhead or area where you might consider leaving your vehicle — plus "car break-ins" — to perhaps learn if there have been any break-ins.

For example, a google search just now for vehicle break-ins in North Cascades National Park turned up this alert at that park's website:

"Be Aware of Break-ins along State Route 20

"Prevent smashed windows and theft. Break-ins are not uncommon at trailheads along State Route 20. Remove your valuables and electronics and take associated electronic cords."

http://www.nps.gov/noca/index.htm

[Steven Paris]

I don't remember ever hearing about a bear breaking into a car at a TH. It's possible but I'd be more worried about a break-in by people, something that is common in certain areas, especially the Columbia Gorge.

[Russell Lawson]

oh yeah man. I went toupper lena and came down talking to this older fellow, and when we got to the lot his ladder and cooler full of beer were gone, and someone bent my car mirror on a door that has a switch that looks open but is broken. Tons of methheads everywhere it seems.

I leave full meals in my car for when I return, probably not the greatest idea but no problems yet

[Richard Scruggs]

To the specific question about bears breaking into cars, apparently bears in the Northwest haven't learned the art of car-break-ins . . . yet.

North Cascades NP website even urges that folks at campgrounds store their food in their vehicles when they are away from their campsite —

"When you go to bed or away from your campsite, store all your food, toiletries, cooking gear, coolers, empty boxes that contained food, and stove in your vehicle with the windows up and doors locked. Remember to secure portable barbecue grills too. Your car trunk is best place to store these things. If your pickup has a fabric shell, store items in the cab."

http://www.nps.gov/noca/learn/nature/bear-safety.htm

The day will no doubt come, as more and more folks flood the NW outdoors to go camping, when bears get better educated by occurrences of stupidity:

"Food, Trash Left in Enchanted Valley Habituates Bears, Closes Area to Camping"

https://www.wta.org/signpost/food-trash-left-in-enchanted-valley-habituates-bears-closes-area-to-camping

[Dale Wambaugh]

Yeah, the bears havn't learned yet, but trailhead car prowls are too common. They have planted bait cars at Rainier with success, catching locals red handed.

http://blog.seattlepi.com/seattle911/2011/08/23/mount-rainier-‘bait-car’-sting-nets-two-suspected-thieves

Every campground we have been at in Washinton and Oregon asked to store our food and cooking gear in the car at night.

The offical word is at http://www.nps.gov/mora/planyourvisit/safety.htm

I would want something that has non-visable storage like a trunk and leave NOTHING of value in the front. A good technique is to do that before arriving at a trailhead, with your packs in the back seat. I've talked to kids who hid in the woods at the trailhead, watching people stash goodies out of sight. Most trunk locks have a valet mode to lock out the remote release.

[Billy Ray]

Do they just break into cars and steel things or do they steel cars too?

billy

[Jerry Adams]

Someone poked hole in gas line and took all my gas. It still held about 2 gallons, which was enough to get home.

Either that, or, the gas line just degraded with age. But other people have reported getting gas stolen at same TH. Herman Creek at Cascade Locks.

I see broken glass a lot. Someone breaks a window and does a quick grab. Don't leave anything of value visible.

Once in downtown Portland I left a carton of cigarettes visible. Someone broke in and stole it. Of course, it cost a lot more to fix window. Maybe a message to quit buying cigarettes?

[Billy Ray]

"Maybe a message to quit buying cigarettes?"

Call it a favor… or divine intervention!

billy

[Billy Ray]

I suppose those car top 'rocket boxes' are targets for trail head thieves too?

billy

[Jeffs Eleven]

"Do they just break into cars and steel things or do they steel cars too?"

Where the eff is -B.G.-?!?

[Gary Dunckel]

Unrelated to the PNW, but this is a rather fun story of a bear in Colorado. In 2009 I was working for 2 weeks near Vail. The weekend between I did two nights of backpacking up Booth Creek. The trailhead parking area is right next to some condos in East Vail. When I came out on Sunday I saw the wildlife officers looking over a pretty messed up car. It turned out that a young lady had just gone to McDonald's and then stopped by to see her friend that lived in one of the condos. She left part of a burger and some fries on the passenger seat, and she didn't lock the car.

While she was gone, a black bear came by, smelled the goodies, and actually was able to lift the door latch and get in. But the car door snapped back closed, trapping the bear inside. It went totally berserk trying to get out of the car, and it tore the front and back upholstery, ripped the floor carpet, broke windows, and even set off the air bag–the whole 9 yards. Somebody called the wildlife people.

The wildlife guys said that they rigged up some sort of pulley thing where they could lift the door latch from a safe distance and get the door open. Their plan was to tranquilize the critter with a dart, but when the bear escaped from the car, it bolted so fast that they couldn't get a good, safe bead on it.

So yeah, I guess that a bear can get into a car.

[Richard Mock]

When I first saw the title of the post before reading that you were asking about a specific location my first thought was " Do they shit in the woods?"

[Steven Paris]

Just to make sure you don't get the wrong idea about the PNW, I've never had my car broken into, even in the Columbia Gorge. I do usually prepare everything before I leave or stop along the drive so that I can just get out, maybe change my shoes and grab my pack with nothing visible in any of the seats.

I think if you take reasonable precautions (maybe difficult to do with a camper) you'll be ok; you may get broken into or not, at probably the same rate as THs in other parts of the country, depending on how easy it is to get to, closeness to population centers, etc.

I absolutely wouldn't worry about bears here.

[Todd T]

Lest it didn't come through above:

We currently have very few problem bears in the PNW and want to keep it that way. Please don't leave food-filled vehicles at our remote trailheads.

[Ross Bleakney]

I wouldn't hesitate to leave food in my car. I've done it many times, usually for backpacking (it is nice to come back to food in the car). I think California is usual in this regard (I think Yellowstone, Glacier and the Canadian Rockies allow, if not encourage you to store food in your car). But in California the bears got very habituated and aggressive, and took advantage of the soft tops back in the day, and now assume every car is a potential container of food.

In the backcountry it is different. The bears are pretty common now (and a bit aggressive) in the Olympics. They aren't too bad in the North Cascades, but in most places in both parks you need to carry a canister. In Mount Rainier National Park they have bear wire, and you are required to use it. In every other place, you need to do a decent hang. Most people don't, of course, and get away with one that simply protects their food from mice or deer. So please master the art of a good food hang when backpacking, to prevent the bear problem from spreading.

The best online information about hiking is probably nwhikers.net. I think if you start a discussion there you will get much the same answer (roll up your windows, lock the doors and don't worry about it).

[Eric Blumensaadt]

If Yellowstone bears smell food in your car they have learned to put their claws into the seam between the door and the body and EASILY (for them) pull the door open.

Car doors can actually be sprung when open just by twisting them. Body shops do it to get a proper fit if there is a problem when installing door.

[Gary Dunckel]

Eric, would you please cite your sources on that (that's the -B.G.- in me)? Where in YNP, the Lake CG? Where?

[Eric Blumensaadt]

Gary,

Rangers told us that if we parked at Toulmene (sp?) Meadows bears there WILL absolutely tear car doors open to get a bag of Natchos.

[Franco Darioli]

[Gary Dunckel]

Eric, so that's not YNP, right? Different eco-system…

[David Chenault]

Eric, you are mistaken.

It is quite remarkable that (to my knowledge) there has never been a Yellowstone area bear which has busted into a car or camper to get food. They certainly could if they wanted to. Why? The only likely answer seems to be that when the NPS closed the dumps in the late 60s, it dealt with food conditioned bears harshly. Sources are vague, but between 100 and 200 Grizzlies were killed in the 70s, and it seems almost certain that weaning them off associating humans with food was the reason.

In any case, everywhere in Yellowstone you are not only encouraged but required to store food in your vehicle, either while in a campground or while backpacking.

California has it's issues, and I've heard of a few isolated bear/car break ins in both Colorado and the Smokies, but that is it. It's an interesting thought experiment to think of how many Sierra bears would have to be shot to re-educate the population.

[BlackHatGuy]

"It's an interesting thought experiment to think of how many Sierra bears would have to be shot to re-educate the population."

Or people….

[Warren Greer]

Good point Doug.

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