New Six Moon Designs “Refuge”

Oooooooooooooo!
Would I give up the square footage and dual vestibules of my lunar duo to save 12 oz.? Probably not. To save 21 oz.?! Hmmmmm…………..probably.

Another variation of the A frame. Dancing Light had the Arapaho which is similar. The wings will catch wind though huh?

Ron's been talking about this tent for a while (although not very loudly): http://tinyurl.com/ywj9m6. The Cuben version is sure tempting. I have only a couple concerns. One, the size seems to be a 1 1/2. I would prefer a little bigger version (for two people) or a little smaller (for one). On the other hand, maybe a smaller version wouldn't save much weight and reduce stability. I would still like a version that is bit bigger (which would make it easier to convince my wife that we need a new tent :)). My other concern is storm worthiness. Ron wrote a great comment about that subject in the other thread. Essentially, you need to pick your location properly if you expect rough weather.

I'm excited! This baby has a name. I can't wait.

nm

There's just something about the look of Cuben Fiber that I really, really like.

David:

I too thought immediately of the Rajd – but lighter.

I went to http://www.sixmoondesigns.com/default.asp and I can not find a product called "Refuge". Can you please provide the link? Their web site has links to their products named:
Products
Shelters
Lunar Duo
Lunar Soloe
Wild Oasis
Gatewood Cape

Packs
Starlite
Comet
Essence

But nothing named "Refuge".

Ben had a link in the original post. To get there from the SMD homepage click on the Community link and then go to the forums. The item is posted in the forums under New Products.
It is a new product that Ron is giving us a sneak peek at, not something that is currently being sold.
Hope that helps.

Adam

It is hard to spot the link, as it is one word (hover over the word "this").

Roleigh:

See my original post. As Ross mentioned, I provided a link in there — I guess it was hard to see. I just changed it to ALL CAPS now. Hope this helps.

With the Lunar Solo having a 27.5 sq ft floor area plus a 10 sq ft vestibule, how can Ron claim the Refuge (with only 30 sq ft floor) to be a "two man shelter"?
And in the first photo it appears that you can see the sleeping pad right through the rear wall of the tent. Is Cuben a see-through material?

Cuben is a fairly ‘see-through’ material. Ron Bell has some good pictures on his site: MLD
He has a number of pictures of Cuben tarps that display its ‘see-throughiness'(technical term :)) quite well.

Adam

A queen size mattress is 33.33 sq ft (5'x 6'8") so the Refuge isn't that much smaller.

Yes, sort of. If I remember the last time I visited their web site (they sell mostly to sail boat owners) it's made from fairly clear plastic sheets with strands of Spectra imbeded in it.

Bob: That is why I call it a 1.5 man tent. Ron is not alone in making a small two man tent though. There are a number of tent makers who make similarly tight tents. I used to have a Eureka Zeus2, that had about the same amount of room. It worked (for my wife and I) but we both really liked the extra room we got when we upgraded to a Shires Squall 2.

The convention is that the number of persons is simply the number of standard (72" x 20") sleeping pads that can fit on the floor, without overlapping.

I need my personal space and I would NEVER share my BA Seedhouse 2 SL tent with anyone (unless it's a dire, dire emergency). Nevertheless, my 28 sq. ft. tent can objectively fit two pads anytime, so it qualifies as a two-person tent and is marketed as such. The SMD Refuge is even bigger — so no technical violations there at all.

I'd share a 1.5 with hilary swank any day of the week…and weekends too (opening myself up to more hazing me thinks)

My girlfriend and I slept in my 1.5 man while we were driving cross-country this summer. In cold places it was nice to cuddle, but in hot and humid weather I had a tendency to push her into the vestibule. Even our 2 Nightlite pads overlapped. She still loves me though and is thrilled I got a Seedhouse SL2. Yes, thats right, my old 1.5 was smaller than the SL2. Scary isnt it?

So I guess theres no lovin in your tent, Benjamin?

How are you enjoying your Seedhouse Margaret? I saw your thread earlier about being excited for getting it and wanting to make sure it was a good choice..Do you think it was?

I'm browsing tents at the moment.. I wonder if you ever looked at any Tarptents. What exactly made you settle on the SL2?

"So I guess there's no lovin in your tent, Benjamin?"

Yeesh!

BTW, did you get your Seedhouse fly / zipper "kinks" worked out?

Maybe. My girlfriend tried to convinced me that it was supposed to be like that but I am still doubtful.

It was a toss up btw the SL2 and the TT Squall 2. I wanted something that was incredibly versatile, an all around good tent. This is now my everyday tent. In the future I may pick up a Contrail for soloing.

-I live in AZ right now (it never rains!), so I can go out with just the body for critter protection.
-I'm from NY and do a lot of hiking there so I wanted a double wall for when it rains for 4 days straight.
-I may move to Hawaii after I get done with grad school, so I wanted something that could stand up to humidity.
-I plan to hike the AT after grad school (before Hawaii, I guess)with my girlfriend, so I needed a 2ish person.
-I stumbled across the SL2 on sale at EMS for $250.
-I like the fast fly option, but not the $40 footprint.

Hope my rationale helps.

Bob,

With the Lunar Solo having a 27.5 sq ft floor area plus a 10 sq ft vestibule, how can Ron claim the Refuge (with only 30 sq ft floor) to be a "two man shelter"?

Exactly what constitutes a 2 person shelter is anyone’s guess. The Refuge’s 90” X 48” floor is 6” narrower than the Duo’s 54” width. With respect to many popular 2 person tents on the market it’s about 3” to 4” narrower. Since someone mentioned that it’s similar to the Rajd, The floor size on the Rajd is 47” wide and 80” long.

One should also take into consideration that the floor size listed on the Refuge is only the actual Silnylon floor. There is a mesh perimeter around the floor. On both ends of the floor the mesh extends another 9” extending the overall length from 90” to 108”. There is also a mesh panel on the long side that extents out up to 12 inches from the side of the floor. So the interior width at the center from door to wall is 60”.

When I look a two person tents, I also take into consideration the overall internal volume. Can two people comfortably sit up without banging into each other or the side of the tent. The Refuge has internal room to spare, especially if you guy out the front and rear walls. With the canopy guyed out, it’s large enough for 4 adults to sit up facing each other without hitting the ceiling or sidewalls. I’d like to see if you can find any other sub 5 pound tent on the market that can make that claim. Now take into consideration that the Refuge weighs 18 or 27 ounces depending upon its canopy style.

The width restriction on the Refuge is due primarily to the maximum 48” width of Cuben Fiber material. We wanted to develop the tent based on the unique properties of this material. There are no seams in the canopy from head to foot. This eliminates any potential weakness caused by seams.

And in the first photo it appears that you can see the sleeping pad right through the rear wall of the tent. Is Cuben a see-through material?

The current crop of Cuben Fiber is fairly translucent. Though it’s not that bad. It’s kind of like looking through the windows in your bathroom. When I last spoke to the people who make the fabric, they were planning on producing it in different colors. Which is pretty simple since you just need to use different color Mylar sheets. I don’t know if different colors will be available when we start our production run.

Ron,
Nice comments. I agree with you. Much of what makes a tent roomy or not depends on the design. The tent is plenty long enough, but a bit narrow. This goes well with the overall design of the tent. The side walls stick out and go up steeply, thus giving you extra elbow room to the outside. I would buy it as is (I no longer think of this as a 1 1/2 man tent).

Do you have any plans for a one-man refuge tent?

Thanks,
Ross