Rab Flashpoint: 6oz 3-layer rain jacket

Hopefully they come out with a women's version by the time my neoshell bites the dust…

"…and I got a rather detailed response. All you fabric geeks can figure this out…."

I'm no gear geek, but that seemed to me to be a pretty clear, refreshingly honest explanation of the jacket's characteristics and plusses/minuses. I'm sure others more knowledgeable that I will weigh in, but if it were me I'd feel like I had enough information to make a decision at this point. It seems like a very good fit for 3 season Sierra hiking, unless you're going to be doing a lot of bushwhacking or talus scrambling. Now if it were just a little cheaper……

I wonder about the durability when used under backpack shoulder straps and waist belt.
If I had to guess, I'd guess it wouldn't be long until the shoulder area leaks… the point of failure with 2 layer jackets. Like Rab says in the quote above, "slightly" more durable… slightly. It does not sound like this jacket meets the 3 layer jacket standard of durability (and therefore leak proofness under backpack straps) that we are all used to.

Billy

I think shane is after our techy hearts here at bpl. Seems like a pretty cool fabric solution they came up with too. Pretty happy with the new marmot essence though, which I've been hiking with in consistent rain over the last couple weeks in boulder. I like the lining on my 3 layer event shell, but I typically wear a long sleeve shirt in the mountains anyway, so the extra layer is less important.

@Serge – can you add some comments on the Essence and how you like it in terms of fit, downpours, pack size, claminess… Is yours the new one with stretch? Any pics?

Yes Ken and Doug, you all know I am the hot babe of BPL.

I'll be putting out my calendar in time for the holiday season….

You'll be wearing a different pack every month?

"You'll be wearing a different pack every month?"

what a great idea!!!!

And all my shelters in the background……

But I think I may want to wear those Bill Rogers clothes. Now THOSE are hiking clothes!

Hike as in wedgie?

I bit on this one. Course, will be a long time before I see any rain here in socal…

Steve

So how come mine's so heavy at 6.3 oz for a size Medium?

Okay, so I'm burdened with only a few extra fractional ounces.

Otherwise, seems very nice — relatively generously cut for a size Medium, which is good since I want to use it as an emergency winter hardshell (i.e., over softshell jacket + Mtn Hardwear Ghost Whisperer down vest + Brooks-Range down hooded parka + mountaineering helmet).

Were I to instead plan to use it exclusively as just a summer rain jacket, then I suspect that I probably could have gone down a size Small.
(I'm 5'8", 145 lb, 37" chest, 32" waist, 33" sleeve, although the Rab MeCo 165 long-sleeve shirt fits me perfectly although generously in a size Medium, which is why I ordered the same size in the Flashpoint.)

Jen, do you think the price increase over the Marmot Essence is worth it? Considering both of these jackets. Thanks. John

hmmm…i had both. I would not pay full price for it – but i wouldn't pay that much for a jacket anyway (why i never went for the patagonia M10 which I really wanted…just never saw it for much of a discount). The difference is that SUPPOSEDLY the flashpoint, as a 3-layer jacket, will not delaminate, whereas the 2-layer essence will. The inside of the flashpoint feels great on bare skin, and it doesn't have that tacky feel that the 2.5 layers have. from having both, it APPEARS that the flashpoint would last longer, but i have absolutely NO evidence to back that up. I used mine literally every single day on the CT this summer (36 days) and it looks exactly the same as the day I bought it. I prefer the flashpoint quite a bit over the essence. but whether or not I'd pay double for it is another story…..

The Patagonia M10 is my standard hard-shell (which I did get on discount, I also wouldn't pay full price for it). It weighs a couple of ounces more. Anybody have any experience of how it compares with the Rab flashpoint?

I had been planning on taking my 'heavy' 10oz Arc'teryx Tecto FL gore active jacket to the PCT next year figuring it was breathable enough to go sans windshirt… however, I've recently been second guessing that logic because a) I love my 2012 Houdini and know I'll miss it and b) would prefer to save my jackets DWR for when it's actually raining. A 6oz rain jacket lets me take both for the same weight. A local outdoor shop had the Essence on special and given the direction the Aussie dollar is going I knew this would be the best price I'd see on it between now and April, and 'cheap' enough that if I only got the through hike out of it I'd be OK with that (not that I think the durability is that lacking). I went this afternoon to buy and lo and behold they also had a Flashpoint on the same rack. Despite a a greater % discount the Flashpoint was still A$50 more than the Essence. The staff member I spoke to (rightly or wrongly) thought they'd both compete fairly well on breathability with my Gore jacket, and didn't seem to have any reasons to upsell me to the Rab. I tried both on and had the following conclusions: – Marmot fit me better in the shoulders, with the Rab being a bit narrow here. I do have broad shoulders though. Body fit on the Marmot is quite comparable to my Arc'teryx and just felt 'right' when I put it on – YMMV. – Body length on the Marmot seemed a hair longer, or maybe the Rab just wanted to ride up a bit due to fit… Either way, coverage felt better with the Marmot. – Sleeves a bit longer on the Rab, so better for me with very long 6'3" arms, but I imagine too long for some. Marmot length still good. Rab sleeves have a nice adjustment and can be set to a fully open breathable mode nicely, but I kind of like the simplicity of the stretchy cuffs on the Marmot… Felt good pushed up my forearms and I reckon I'll wear it like that a bit, not something I can ever get that comfy with non elastic adjustable cuffs like the Rab. -Hood adjustability goes to Rab and if you were climbing and needed to look around it would be better, but on raw coverage I think the Marmot fit my (big) head even a little better… I was expecting the Rab hood to kill it, so this was a surprise… Doesn't seem like the normal design made it onto this UL jacket. Both comfortably trumped by my Arc'teryx hood, but also both much better than others I've worn. -Marmot is definitely at the nicer end of 2.5 layer jackets on next to skin feel but still feels like 2.5 and I'd say the Rab is at the lower end of 3 layer and probably hardly an improvement. Certainly these are not jackets you buy to wear a lot, so I didn't see the tiny improvement in the Rab as meaningful. -Face fabric on the Rab is more crinkly and didn't seem to move that well with me, whereas the Marmot drapes nicely and possibly stretched a little better. The Marmot fabric *looks* a little more durable, but who knows. Overall, I'd be amazed the 3L construction of the Rab buys it much of a durability increase – it felt the more paper thin of the too. -Highly unscientific 'wear them in the store for 5 mins each' test indicates the breathability is a wash, maybe a tiny edge to the Marmot due to being able to lift arms and get some flow through vents. Both are probably a touch behind where my Arc'teryx is at, but not much. They definitely still reminded me why I want to be taking the Houdini… -Rab comes with a stuff sack which I like to keep the jacket clean, but it didn't seem all that UL so I'd probably keep using a cuben one I have for the purpose anyway, so no net benefit to the Rab. As you can probably guess, I didn't see the value in the Rab that made it A$50 more expensive, especially when this is for low likelihood of rain conditions… The Arc'teryx is still coming when I got to my usual haunts of Tasmania or New Zealand, but for the PCT and drier parts of Australia the Essence seems like a good buy.

Jen, thanks for the reply. Did your Flashpoint double as a wind shirt on the CT, or did you get that much rain? Curious if is breathable enough to use a windshirt.

Lachlyn, thanks for info. I hiked the JMT in 2012 and got really lucky on weather. I went in Sept. I had a 2011 Houdini that worked marvelous as a wind shirt. I don't think that Gortex jacket will be breathable enough to use a wind shirt in the sierras. The air is really dry in the sierras and there is quite a bit of elevation gain and loss on the trail. I have not hiked the PCT, but I plan to. I would think that maybe mailing the Goretex jacket to yourself for the Washington/Canada portion of the hike and using the houdini and a light rain jacket for California/Oregon. Have fun on your hike. I'm jealous.

John, we got that much rain. It rained 32 out of 36 days. And I mean RAIN, not little baby drizzle stuff…… Check out my pix https://backpackerpt.smugmug.com/browse