Katabatic Gear Quilt advice

I am now starting to believe the old designs are best. Forget the over the top expensive quilt from Katabatic and go with something vintage. What do I mean by vintage? Well let me show you how you can save money and still have that quilt feeling.

Over on ebay they have a sleeping bag for sale from REI called "The McKinley" It is what I call the canoe design. The zipper runs down through the middle of the bag and completely through the foot section as well. The foot section looks like the end of a canoe, hence the "Canoe Design". However, do not attempt to float it in water because it does not work well.

Check the design out
a href="http://www.ebay.com/itm/vtg-70S-REI-CO-OP-GOOSE-DOWN-COLD-WEATHER-MOUNTAINEERING-MUMMY-SLEEPING-BAG-REG-/151637452155?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item234e4be57b">McKinley

Look at the picture of this beauty fully unzipped. A quilt that does not need lash straps to keep it on you because it is wide enough to do the job.

If somebody here complains about the weight, merely ship it to Rainy Pass gear, they will remove the old down and put in 800 fill down to lighten the load and it will still be cheaper than paying an outlandish price for a quilt that needs lash straps to keep it attached to you. Sometimes comfort is not a big weight penalty.

Just a thought.

I've used katabatic quilts (reg) for the last few years and from the sounds of it, you probably want a wide. The attachment system is effective, but the reg size doesn't leave a lot of room for thrashing.

Active sleeper here. Bought a hoodless bag. No regrets, I have this one.

MityLite

Had it overfilled. I’m good to freezing in it.

I have purchased five quilts from Katabatic (Sawatch reg, Palisade reg, Chisos reg, Chisos wide, and Alsek wide) and much prefer the wide versions. I am 5'9" and 170lbs and a very active sleeper and find the wide to be much more conducive to a comfortable nights sleep. I have also found that a wider pad helps as well and the wide quilt plus wide pad eliminates drafts without even using the pad attachment system. For me the extra few ounces is well worth the weight.

Thanks for the quick answers!

@Scott: A bag with a hood is no option for me, unfortunately. Also, I haven't been to fond with center zips on the sleeping bags I have. They only seem to allow "all or nothing" ventilation, whereas sidezips allow for more gradual venting options.

@Serge: Thanks for the insight. So would you describe the regular quilt as too tight to move in? I don't need tons of space as long as I can turn in a reasonably comfortable manner. Does movement leads to openings/drafts due to the tightness of the quilt?

@Ken: Hoodless traditional bag might be an option, too. The Mitylite looks kind of heavy for its rating, though. Do you turn inside the bag or with the bag?

Thanks for your help so far!

umm,,, you say that the Spirit Quilt is awesome except one thing,,, it only has one pad attachment strap,,, why dont you just get more straps sewn on to keep it in place better

I have two Katabatic quilts. I got the wides and don't use the straps. The strap system is pretty significant though and based on your questions I believe it would help.

My big problem is size 15 feet. Most foot boxes are too small, cold feet. I turn in the bag a bit. Could I go lighter, sure, but this works fine for me. The overfill makes it a bit more versatile, for me. YMMV and all that.

I also have 2 Katabatic quilts (Palisade and Sawatch), both regular/regular – I'm pretty slim and the regular width seems fine to me, but going with a wide may make sense in your case. I LOVE them (haven't tried any other quilts but I have used a number of mummy bags including FF Hummingbird, MHW phantom 32, Phantom 0, etc. I mostly sleep on my side and roll over a number of times each night and I find the pad attachment system works very well. On a warm night especially in a tent I sometimes don't even use the attachment system. With the straps and clips in use it is still much roomier than a narrow cut lightweight mummy bag, and lighter as well. On cold nights I either wear a down jacket with a hood, or the Zpacks down hood, and using both clips to keep it secured it is snug as a bug. It is great to be able to turn in it rather than with it. And it is great to have room for your arms to move around – I have long arms and they always felt constricted in a mummy bag.

I am pretty sure I sleep better in these quilts than in a traditional mummy bag. It does help to have a wider pad when weight is not a huge issue, but I use a regular size Neoair on my lightweight trips and it works fine.

I like the Katabatic attachment system, you can run the clip onto a shock cord and let it move or it can be locked in, so it doesn't

if you're a tosser/turner, go with the wide

"umm,,, you say that the Spirit Quilt is awesome except one thing,,, it only has one pad attachment strap,,, why dont you just get more straps sewn on to keep it in place better"
While I wouldn't trade my 6' Wide Palisade for any similar product on the market, I have to agree with this.
MLD might even add them for you, and Palisades run nearly $500.

@b willi jones & Owen: Actually, I dislike more about the Spirit quilt's straps than the fact that there's only one. I find the buckle (connecting strap and quilt) to be extremely hard to operate, especially with the strap already attached to the pad and the buckle close to my body, as I would have in cold temperatures.
That being said, of course you're totally right, I should consider "fixing" the spirit quilt. I just want to estimate how much better a Palisade might work for me (that's what this thread is about) and then debate if it's worth the extra money. Only then will I start looking for a used Palisade. I'm not sold on giving up my spirit quilt yet, just debating alternatives.

I have another question to the katabatic gear veterans: Does the closed (and pretty long) footbox work trouble you in terms of ventilation in warm weather?

I'm a side/back/side sleeper and really like my wide Katabatic Quilt. I only use the attachment clips when stretching the rating, and they work well then. Having a closed foot box is not an issue for me in warmer weather, as I merely slide one or both feet out for ventilation. Simplest is best, I believe.

Love my Katabatic Sawatch. Regular width. I flounce a lot. System works very well.

I actually second the idea of a hoodless bag – while I liked my Katabatic quilt, i found the lack of venting of the footbox really affected it's versatility (I sleep on the warm side). I picked up a FF Flicker and found it to be slightly better in most respects.

if choosing one of their quilts, their ratings are very conservative imo- look at the loft on their spec sheet, my 30 degree quilt is in all reality a 20 quilt

Thanks for the replies!

@Mike, it's good to know that the quilts are conservatively rated. Often, quilt manufacturers do the exact opposite. Would you say the palisade is a 20F quilt with additional layers or just baselayers?

People in this thread seem a little divided over the footbox question, though. Anybody else want to comment on that?

@Aaron, do you use your bag as a quilt a lot? Do you ever miss attachement straps? Or can you just zip the bag tight if you do and you're covered for all situations? Also, do you turn with or within the bag when it's zipped?

As to me, I will try to make the spirit quilt work for me at first – although I likely will look for a more optimal alternative in the long run. I already contacted Ron and unfortunately, adding another strap is quite a hassle (which b/c the seam is actually on the inside of the quilt). Maybe I can work out something else, though.

"Would you say the palisade is a 20F quilt with additional layers or just baselayers?"

That's going to vary by person and situation, so noone else can answer that question for you.

Loft per side hints at how it stacks up with some reputable sleeping bags, though:
-Western Mountaineering Megalite(30F): 2"
-Marmot Hydrogen(30F and EN rated@30F): 2"
-Katabatic Palisade: 2.25"
-Western Mountaineering Ultralite(20F): 2.5"

Owen is correct, it's definitely individual, but for me it's a legitimate 20 degree quilt w/ base layers

on the footbox, an open footbox is nice in warm weather, but I want my quilt to perform it's optimum at it's limit, which in that case I want a sewn foot box, if this was a 50 degree (maybe 40) quilt I'd go w/ a open footbox design, with a 30 degree or lower quilt I definitely want a sewn foot box

as mentioned above, if it's a little too warm, simply pull your feet out and drape the quilt over them

the superior warmth of a sewn foobox outweighs any advantage of an open design imho w/ cooler weather quilts

@Owen & Mike:

I partially disagree. I'm aware of the fact that temperature ratings are individual. However if Mike says "The 30F Palisade has felt warmer than previos 30F bags I've tried", this statement has a fair amount of objectivity. Which does not necessarily mean that I, too, could use the Palisade until 20F (which is the part I agree with).

/edit: What has always baffled me about the loft-measurements: Are these comparable for bags and quilts? With a traditional sleeping bag, the measured loft includes the to-be-compressed backside of the bag. With a quilt, it usually doesn't (although the palisade might be an exception in this case due to its mummy-shape).

Thanks!

bags typically use both top and bottom for their measurement, quilts are typically measured w/ just one side (top)

I use this as a rough guide, (just halve the measured loft w/ a bag)

Theo,

I tend use the Flicker as a blanket when it's warmer and then zip it up partially or fully, depending on how cold it is. I personally find the attachment straps to be another thing to fiddle with when setting up camp and don't miss it (I adjust for temperature by opening or closing the bag up with the zipper or opening or closing the footbox). The Flicker zips up like a full bag and you can orient the zipper as a center zip on top of you or off to the side. You can turn within or with the bag when it's zipped – I usually turn within.

I disagree on the footbox issue – I found draping the Katabatic quilt over me when it was too warm fiddly at best and I either slept a bit cold or my legs/feet were too warm. I feel that the Flicker is true to it's temperature rating when zipped up and have not noticed any drafts through the footbox. Caveat: I tend to sleep on the warm side, but have found the FF bags to be true to their rating (if not overly generous) in all cases.

I recently bought a Katabatic Palisade from Gear Swap and took it out for the first time this weekend. I was very impressed with the pad attachment system. I also tend to toss and turn when sleeping and I could easily flip around while the quilt stayed firmly in place. The silky smooth fabric of the interior helps with the ability to turn without the bag trying to turn with you.

The system seems a bit fiddly at first with the multiple cords and clips, but it's pretty easy to use in practice.

Mike M

I remember my very first solo trip after moving back to California.
I was nowhere near SUL and must have used a 12-14 pound base.

I was however a BPL member already.
I saw this graph:

Saw just what it would take to follow for my 80 Sierra trip and found that I could get to 30* and over 2" of loft in a 15 ounce quilt with 9 ounces of 850 fill down.

Night 2 was at 12,600' feet just south of Forrester Pass at about 29* and I froze my rear off awake shivering half the night.