Your sleeping bag quiver?

when I rolled on my side the opening of my non-mummy bag gaped open and allowed the cold air in.
This may mean that your bag is too short for your height. Do not skimp on length.

I had base layers on but forgot my wool beanie (dumb move).
Yup, definitely not a good move.

and I froze.
At this stage I would be asking what sort of mat you have. So very often it turns out that a lot of the sleeper’s heat is being lost downwards to the ground. Your mat is almost as critical as your bag.

Cheers

I have a fairly close fitting mummy bag with 17 oz of 800 fill down (Mountain Equipment Firelite) that I use when the forecast is for night time temps from 25-40F. It has kept me warm into the high teens – and yet I have also been cold in the high 20s occasionally with the same bag – so occasionally I supplement with my insulating layer.

I have a cheap (12 oz of 600 fill) summer mummy bag, but I am currently in the market for a quilt for >40F temperatures. From prior experience – at <40F I like the ability to “mummy up” when needed to keep the cold air out – so I doubt I would like quilts at colder temps. For me – I think the mummy bag I have plus a “summer weight” quilt will likely cover most of my scenarios.

I have also left my insulated cap at home and regretted it – it is so light I just bring it now unless we are talking mid-summer at low altitudes.

There are a LOT of sleep system threads on BPL with lots of good advice and individual opinions – mats are important, so is eating and hydration. Many like quilts – some prefer mummy bags. I think the answer is very individual and learned from experience.

I am curious about the source of the temperature ratings associated with your sleeping bags – were these EN Comfort or Lower Limit ratings? or from the manufacturer? If these were older bags (I think Moonstone has been out of business for a while) they may not have had EN based temp ratings. Everyone is different when it comes to sleep comfort and temperature ratings. I don’t know that the EN ratings are super accurate in absolute terms – but I do think they allow for some consistency for comparison purposes – once you figure out where you are vs the ratings.  Ultimately I think there is no substitute for experience in figuring out where you fall in terms of sleep comfort – you suffer a few cold nights on the way (bring the extra insulation layer). Once you have a handle on that you can start figuring out what a reasonable quiver looks like for you. Even then – comfort can vary greatly with the same bag at the same air temp depending on you (fatigue, food, hydration, etc.) and the conditions (wind, humidity).

Also – I am deeply skeptical of manufacturer’s liner temperature rating claims – I doubt most liners could add 14 degrees of temperature to a sleep system. I think it is better to rely on using an insulated jacket for supplemental warmth.

In addition to the air coming in around you neck and head, the non mummy bag probably had a lot of extra space in it that was not heated by your body – every time you moved it mixed cold air in with the warmer air around you. Next time – you could try using extra insulation or clothing placed around you neck/upper body to act as a sort of neck baffle to keep cold air out.

Finally – sleeping pad makes a huge difference – especially <40F – although probably not in your recent scenario. When I tried sleeping in temps 25-35 degrees with R2 or R3 sleeping pads by morning I could always feel the cold from below. It wasn’t until I upgraded to a >R5 sleeping mat did I truly sleep warm at these temps.

A pad upgrade is probably the best and most cost-efficient way to sleep warmer. No bag or quilt can keep you warm if your heat is being sucked away by the ground.

Quilts with pad attachment systems can slide to allow the sides to close up around you as you turn. Of course, you’ll need to remember that hat. Alternately, some mummy bags have tighter hoods that will turn with you so there won’t be gaps.

If the 45 degree bag has a drawstring at the top, consider wearing a hooded puffy to sleep and cinching the bag as a sort of elephant’s foot. Or try out the quilt concept by unzipping your mummy bag to about the knees, twisting it so the zipper is under you and laying directly on your pad. This may help you decide which type will work for you.

Thanks for the replies!

Some info I should have included – I am skinny, tall (6’2″), and sleep cold.

The bag I was using is a Big Agnes Cross Mountain 45 Long (discontinued).  I’m not sure how they rate their bags.  It is part of their “Big Agnes System” line with no insulation on the bottom of the sleeping bag and a has a sleeve to stuff a pad into.  So as I read more about quilts, this bag is very “quilt-like” in that it requires a pad underneath.  I bought it because I thought it would be a good summer bag to compliment the 20* bag (that I confirmed is 3.0 lbs. in its stuff sack).

The pad is a brand new, long Big Agnes Q-Core Deluxe.  I know this probably doesn’t qualify as a light sleeping pad, but I was conscious of R-rating and losing heat to the ground, so I bought the Deluxe with an R value of 4.3.

The bag does have a draw string at the opening, but what I found was that with the pad in the sleeve, the opening was stretched wide and did not allow the bag to cinch up.  I should have slipped the top of the bag off the pad and that would probably have allowed me to cinch it around me tighter.

While I continue to do a post-trip analysis to correct mistakes, we have learned that the temps. we were seeing published online did not necessarily match reality.  I guess areas around us made it to the 30s.  This was definitely not the forecast we saw.

Forgetting the hat was a dumb move.  I did have a Buff that I wore on my head and around my neck for some warmth, but it is more for sun and wind protection.  And trusting the weather forecast was rather naive of us.  Northern Michigan weather can be volatile and the lakes really affect local climate.  I will just have to chalk it up to not thinking clearly and being thankful that we were not on the island (the original plan).

I agree with the above comment – I’m not sure that my Sea To Summit Reactor Liner was doing much, but was probably better than nothing.

I think I need to experiment more with the bag I have and the pad.  I’m definitely going to be gun-shy if I see that temps. will be getting anywhere close to the 40s…and remember the hat!

Thanks!

I think we all have a story like this. I’ve forgotten a warm hat, in fact, and ended up wearing a stuff sack. At least you had your Buff.

Katabatic used to have a really good diagram that showed how their clip system slides to keep the quilt pulled up against you as you turn onto your side, but I can’t seem to find it anymore. I think any quilt attachment works about the same. The clips keep the edges of the quilt tucked under you on top of the pad instead of wrapped around it, which helps keep that wide opening closed.

Lots of options. The important think it to figure out how much insulation YOU need (people vary) and what conditions YOU regularly face.

For a long time I had a winter bag rated for 10F (which was more like 0F for me), and a 3-season quilt which is rated for 32F but for me was comfortable to 15F when paired with my normal clothing and inside a DWR bivy which is part of my shelter system. Normally I would use my quilt. When I was expecting “cold” conditions I would switch to my winter bag. Years ago I played around with two quilts, one that was good for >45F for the summer and would be an over-quilt in the winter, and a quilt which worked well in normal spring and fall conditions.  I ultimately simplified back to my Nunatak Ghost.  Some more thoughts on my  getting a good night sleep and sleeping bag/quilt posts.

How I look at it, 45 degrees is what I would use inside my house. 20 degrees is what I would use outside my house in the summer (I live in the west where is cools down after sunset). 10 degrees is what I would use outside my house in shoulder seasons closer to winter. I’d add my down jacket to any of these to boost my warmth. I would also layer my 45 degree quilt with any of these if I feared being too cold. I have a zero degree bag that I use in our RV. It’s just too big and bulky to take backpacking. It’s perfect for inside the camper because often I have sat outside late into the evening jamming fiddle tunes with my friends and getting chilled to the bone and finding it really hard to warm up afterward.

By the way, my 10 degree bag weighs the same as my 20 degree quilt. The bag is a small, slim bag and the quilt is a regular size. This seems to indicate if you are a small person you can save significant weight in fabric and zipper by getting a smaller bag, and then use that weight savings for more insulation to get a nice toasty bag for the same weight as a less toasty but bigger bag.

My temperature rating requirements are the same as Diane’s. I have recently become more aware that using a slimmer bag can add a lot of warmth. I take down pants when I think I will need more warmth.