Trying to Decide Monk vs. Grace Solo Tarps

Also, since I mentioned having the MLD Poncho/Tarp, I should answer the obvious question of why I’d think of replacing it with the Monk instead of just using what I have, since it’s pretty similar:

• Slightly larger (9′ vs 8.5′ ling)
• No hood to worry about leaking/seam sealing.
• Interior hang loops for bivy
• More side tieouts (I’ve already seen a few good pitches on Youtube for the Monk that require the extra tieouts)
• Center panel tieouts
• Linelocs (low on the priority list, since there are plenty of options for adding those easily and cheaply.) Still, nice to have.

Sounds like this is for 3 season with a good forecast? I tarp and bivy and have for a few years now and agree that cowboy camping ends up being the nightly setup the majority of the time. I just picked up a hex+ tarp for bad weather trips, I hate the front entry as well.

What is your rain gear going to be since ditching the Gatewood and mld poncho tarp?

I am picking up an mld cuben poncho to try out this year. With the type of trips in mind, with a bivy, it should be plenty big enough to protect and gives me rain gear. It’s 9′ long. Sure they could add the extra perimeter tieouts and zpacks sells the stick on hang loops to put were needed for the pitches you like to hang the bivy from. Besides aframe pitch, not sure the Ridgeline hang loops would be in the right spot so you might want to play around with it and still pickup a few stick on loops to add flexability.

If you don’t want another poncho tarp I say go for the monk tarp. The flexibility could come in handy and you can pitch it so the entry is much better on those just in case nights.

I’ve been dabbling in bivies for the last year or so and really liking the simplicity of sleeping “cowboy” without having to be concerned with creepy-crawlies. I’ve been trying out different tarp options: Deschutes Silnylon (too heavy and not much headroom. Simply Light Designs Monk knockoff (about 8″ narrower than MLD’s Monk, too small for real protection). HMG 8.5 x 8.5 (great for me and the kid, me and the dog or me with tons of storm coverage above treeline).

I’m not particularly motivated to pick up another tarp right now but if I did it would be a 1P Patrol or Grace. I don’t care much for A-frame but it is very practical. The half-pyramid pitch on a Monk doesn’t provide that much coverage for a storm above treeline. A flying diamond between two trees is actually pretty nice but again it doesn’t provide protection for a serious storm…

What kind of conditions will you be using the tarp in? If it’s in the trees then maybe the Monk? Above treeline I would almost lean towards a Grace but then I’d just go a small step further in price/weight and get a Patrol. I like the looks of the fast pitch and closed foot end. Just pin the low end down to the ground and know you can hunker down for a pretty intense storm…

Dang it, now I kind of want to try a Patrol.

RE: conditions- Most of my hiking is going to be broken down into 2 types of trips over the next 2 years- either finishing up the PCT in large chunks (“large”= 5+ weeks at a time), or doing short 1-2 night trips where I’m cherry picking the weather. (I have to rent a car to go anywhere, so I’m unlikely to spend $120 and 8+ hours of driving to go hang out in the pouring rain). My immediate PCT sections are going to be in NorCal and Oregon (the latter of which is not necessarily going to be “dry” but it’s within my risk tolerance.

Re: Raingear- I’m probably going to go back to my OR Helium II and ULA Kilt. I never used the Gatewood as raingear. I’m doing a pure NorCal section of the PCT in July that I’ll probably poncho-tarp just for funsies. Long-term, I’ll probably sell the poncho, but I want to play around with it for a bit. By and large, I’m more enamored with small flat tarps than I am with poncho-tarps.

I’m also going to keep the Gatewood and will primarily be using that as my consistent foul weather shelter. I realize that’s a weird thing to say about something that’s technically a poncho-tarp, but the thing is pretty bomber and I don’t really need a ton of space in a shelter. My trips are rarely structured in a way that gives me a lot of buffer time, so I’m never really looking to spend a ton of time hanging out in my shelter even when it sucks out.

I think the big test is going to come this weekend- I’m doing a backyard test with the poncho-tarp when the forecast calls for thunderstorms and a fair amount of rain as it drops to about 35* or so. Perfect backyard camping weather.

Also, Jeff, if you’re keen on the MLD Cuben Tarp, I definitely recommend this Suluk 46 Youtube video where he goes through a few pitches- it really gives a good idea of the size and coverage of the tarp: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uXrapf_8WFM

That one’s probably a bit minimalist for me, but I can definitely see the appeal at that weight class.

Hey John, I have a sil tarp that’s the exact same size and cat cut like the grace solo. I even had the maker add a mid rear loop to pitch in storm mode like the mld pro poncho. If you want to cover shipping I’ll send it to you to check  out the size and shape if you want? I’m in redding.

Jeff, I really really appreciate the offer to borrow. Right now, I’m heading into my hell period at work, so I wouldn’t be able to try it out for a really long time (I travel out to the suburbs to do my test camps back at my folks’ house since I live in the city and that’s a perfectly normal thing for someone in their 30s to do) and I definitely wouldn’t be comfortable keeping it for that long.

Quick question, though- I am a bit curious about the geometry of the cat tarp and whether you’ve ever tried pitching it in another configuration other than A-frame? It’s something that doesn’t come up a lot, but I’ve always noticed that discussion of cat tarps tends to indicate that they are “best” pitched A-frame, not that it’s not possible to futz around with it a bit (some version of the lean-to, at least, seems plausible, although I’ve never really thought that provided anything close to adequate shelter). I suspect that a drum-tight, stormworthy pitch is out of the question for a different configuration, but I’ve always wondered if they can be pitched to the point of being good enough.

At the very least, the older (and maybe current) Spinn shelters seemed to be workable for that, although the cat cut seems less aggressive.

You can backyard test it ;)

I have set it up flying diamond and modified lean-to with good results. Fits into tight spots and over/around logs/rocks. The flying diamond pitch worked at a lake to really block the wind and it was not flapping about enough to make lots of noise. With the rear being able to be pitched to the ground like the mld pro-poncho I have made it through a couple bad storms with no issues.

I have debated lately having a new tarp made that has the pro-poncho rear and a patrol shelter front. Could leave rear open for draft or pitch closed for blown rain. I am just drawn to the single pole, side entry style shelters right now and going to give the hexamid a fair shot this summer and see how it does.

Results are in from last night’s backyard test with the Simple Poncho (basically a Monk with a hood and no Linelocs)- conditions were a later afternoon thunderstorm with shifting winds (not a TON of rain, but rainy enough), but there was at least one 90* shift in direction. I hung out under the tarp for part of it, but mostly just left my bag/bivy set up unattended (learning very quickly that it’s important to properly weigh it down with something) and checked for rain spray later on. Temps dropped to the low 30s after the storm (I slept outside). Cold winds were swirling the whole night, and, even though my sleep system (Zpacks 20, Bristlecone, half ZLIte) kept me more or less warm, the wind chilled my face and made it not wonderfully comfortable.

Pitch was a passable but not great A-frame with a differential height in the poles. I played around with other pitches during the daytime (including a very low modified lean-to), but really would be uncomfortable trusting anything but an A-frame for meaningful weather. Even pitched pretty low in the a-frame, there was enough room on the sides for the wind to really get me, especially after it shifted to that direction. I didn’t get a chance to try to more or less drop the sides to the ground and make myself a full-on pup tent, which I imagine would have done a better job of blocking the wind, but would have really, really, really made things unpleasant as far as living space goes. With more time/motivation, I could easily have improvised a windblock with, say, my pack liner or rain jacket, but that’s not something that necessarily comes to mind at 3AM when you’re half asleep.

Based on all this, I am more or less 100% committed to the Grace at this point. Having spent more time with the various flat tarp pitches (and actually dealing with the extra guylines and setup changes needed to do varied pitches on-trail), I can pretty safely say that I’m much more interested in having something reliable and quick to set up, and the Grace is definitely the tool for that job. I also like that the shape allows for a variety of taut low-side pitches that allow for good coverage and headroom. The Grace also appears to give a decent bit more living space.

Now to debate sil vs. .51 vs. .74. I’m leaning .51 cuben, since the sagging silnylon was one of the things I wound up not liking about the Gatewood Cape…

all your talk here and on fb has me thinking about a 51 grace with no linelocs. :)

Everytime I see that option I think “wow!” a 4.7 ounce shelter that still gives solid coverage!” And then I remember that I’d gain a chunk of that weight back with the extra guyline, and wouldn’t I rather just pull on a lineloc anyway? I’ll probably stick with the 5.5oz boat anchor they sell as the stock version.

I’ve definitely been tempted by that, though. Very, very tempted.

I used a Cuben grace solo for my PCT thru hike in 2014. It was .74 with no line locks and just random pieces of zpacks cord as guy lines. It worked really good, I paired it with a Gossamer gear polycro ground cloth and no bivy. In all the weather I encounted on the PCT, which included snow, my tarp handled it great. Site selection is paramount and so is pitching it. But for a sub 7 ounce shelter it did wonderfully, and held up great. I plan on using it on the CDT this year.

yeah maybe the boat anchor lineloc option makes sense.

I have used a small cuben flat tarp (roll width x 9′) and this year grabbed the Grace solo in .51. The Grace solo seems like a palace of space comparatively. It sets up super quick and stays taut. I’ll take the space over the setup flexibility most of the time. With line and 8 stakes the Solo is a beast at 7 ounces!