The Wrong Kind of Ultralight: Nallo 2

Looks like a great tent!

Looks like a great tent!

I hope it will be.  Numerically, it mostly works…but no plan survives contact, so we’ll just have to see how it feels when it gets here.

Also, I went and did another thing: I took a 30m/90′ section of 2.5mm Glowire and ran it through my washing machine on the hot/delicate cycle…and now that I’ve dried it, I’d say that it’s actually a bit more flexible.  I don’t see a significant change, but there’s definitely an improvement in the flexibility.  I think that all I did was work some of the initial stiffness out of it, but I’ll take any improvement over the freshly-starched factory feel.

Well, it’s here…and – of course – the first thing I did when it arrived was to throw it on the scale to see exactly how much it weighs.

Pictured: Thicc.

That’s the all-in, fresh-out-of-the-box weight, with literally everything included: the full tent and all of the stakes, spares, bags and tags.  Also, I made an accounting of all of the individual weights for the components, mostly because I couldn’t find a record anywhere of anyone that had weighed everything.  So, I fixed that; among the more interesting of those weights were…

Pictured: The exact mass of a single Hilleberg V-stake.

Pictured: The complete pole set, including spare, repair sleeve, genuine banana-slug-skin bag, and cheat codes to the original Mortal Kombat.

Pictured: The tent body and fly, and a cardboard box containing exactly 1818g of antigravitons.

Pictured: VCR programming instructions, the slip from a Swedish fortune cookie, and Jekaterina’s phone number.

All jokes aside, there’s not a lot of excess weight in the as-packed tent: that 34 grams of promotional materials is about all you can really lose, unless you want to ditch the repair parts for your poles (and I don’t).  Here’s the full accounting of weights:

• Complete tent, as packed: 2453g
• Tent body and fly, as packed: 1818g
• Main stuff sack: 44g
• Pole set and spares, as packed: 368g
• Front pole only: 172g
• Rear pole only: 146g
• Pole sack: 17g
• Repair pole, sleeve, and instructions: 35g
• 16 ct. V-stakes in bag: 195g
• Single V-stake: 11.62g
• Stake bag: 10g
• Tags, notes and digits: 34g

Now, before anyone goes adding anything up: due to my large scale only measuring in whole grams, there’s a variance of about 8g between the additive total of the component parts and the measured total of the packed tent, which means that my accounting is only 99.4% accurate.  Or, in other words; Hilleberg’s published 2.4kg weight is dead on the money, despite my scale’s ineptitude.

I should have some time tomorrow to find a flat patch of ground and give this thing a set-up; maybe at one of the local parks, since my own yards is a bit too sloped and/or covered in pine cones to make a good test pitch.  We’ll see.

…it was the lightest tent that I could find that was available in my country and which should definitively do everything I want it to do, all without suffering from any of the drawbacks that I didn’t want to deal with.

I’d be interested in hearing about what your requirements were that led you to this, what drawbacks you saw with other tents that meant that you feel this one is the one for you.

I’d be interested in hearing about what your requirements were that led you to this, what drawbacks you saw with other tents that meant that you feel this one is the one for you.

Explained in great detail here:  https://backpackinglight.com/forums/topic/time-to-swap-shelters-again/

I think you will appreciate the sturdiness of this tent when needed; and the livability at most times.

I used to have a Nallo 3 GT when my kid was 6-11, and we had two dogs. Used it for hundreds of nights.

Now have a Kaitum 2, Unna and an Enan. The former two for winter in Colorado and the Enan for solo trips with the dog. I use the Enan mostly without inner and no foot print.

For the Nallo I would also consider packing it without inner for nicer weather trips with low bug pressure. But I don’t mind exposed bare ground, even damp ground inside the tent.

I’d be interested in hearing about what your requirements were that led you to this, what drawbacks you saw with other tents that meant that you feel this one is the one for you.

I can summarize it pretty quickly if you don’t want to delve into the long and winding thread that Dan linked – thanks, Dan! – which wouldn’t be your fault in any way: it really is entirely too long and winding.  Basically, this comes down to three factors: objective suitability, subjective comfort, and manufacturer confidence/communication.

On the objective side: I basically need an all-mountain tent that can pull duty above, below and around treeline, and I want it to be able to do that through multiple seasons, different terrains, and inclement weather…so it needs to have a winter-cut fly, decent ventilation for warmer conditions, a solid interior to block dust and spindrift, and enough stoutness to deal with the poor life choices that I occasionally make.  Lastly, it needs to have enough durability to last through those varying environments, and to do so over the long haul…and after spending weeks canvassing the global tent market, I’ve realized that this short list eliminates 95% of the tents currently available.

Subjectively…well, that’s harder.  At heart, I’m something of an indoor kitty, so I want enough room in my tent to sit up, change out of wet stuff, cook a small meal if it’s ugly outside, stretch out and rearrange myself, stow some gear, etc.  In the current tent market, that means 2P sizing.  I also want the tent itself to feel strong, solid and cozy, because I’ll sleep better.  I don’t want to spend the night awake, thinking “is the tent gonna make it?” unless there’s a very good reason to do so.  Thus, many of the remaining 5% of tents are eliminated, because the majority of them are being built for a market that biases itself towards weight savings at the expense of all other factors.  (Note: this is especially true in the American market, which effectively focuses on either fair/mild-weather hikers, or specialist gear).

Lastly, communication with manufacturers and the confidence it inspired – or the lack thereof – was important to me.  I spent weeks canvassing the global tent market, looking into suggestions from friends and forum members alike, and often sending out contact forms/emails to manufacturers to ask questions about some aspect of a tent that wasn’t clear to me, or looking for info that I couldn’t find.  Out of several dozen contacts, I received exactly two responses: Hilleberg and Durston.  They were the only ones that took the time to reach out and address my questions, and they both did an excellent job…so when it came time to buy, literally no other manufacturer was even on the list, anymore.  I realized that I still had tons of questions and trepidation about most of the tents that made my final cut, but I had very few – if any – about the Durston and Hilleberg options, and I basically felt that at this time, the Hilly was going to work a bit better for me than the Durston (which was also sold out when I was ready to purchase).

So, in the end, the tent basically selected itself.  Sure, I’d like it to weigh less if possible, but I’m not really wanting to compromise on any of my requirements in order to get that weight down, because weight really wasn’t a prime requisite for me.

I think you will appreciate the sturdiness of this tent when needed; and the livability at most times.

Hopefully so.  I’m about to go set it up before the weather either hits 90°F, or before rain sets in – looks like it could be either, today – so I’ll have a good first look at the physical reality of it.

I used to have a Nallo 3 GT when my kid was 6-11, and we had two dogs. Used it for hundreds of nights.

That’s a good testament to durability, right there.

Now have a Kaitum 2, Unna and an Enan. The former two for winter in Colorado and the Enan for solo trips with the dog. I use the Enan mostly without inner and no foot print.

I thought seriously about the Unna, but the headroom and lack of a porch bothered me.  I literally don’t fit into a Soulo, else I could’ve gone that route.  I’m not sure I’ll have room in this one for myself and the dog, because she’s big.  Really big.

For the Nallo I would also consider packing it without inner for nicer weather trips with low bug pressure. But I don’t mind exposed bare ground, even damp ground inside the tent.

That’s the problem with the PNE: when the weather is nice for us, it’s also nice for the bugs…so they’re out in force at those times.  Hilleberg offers a mesh interior for hot weather, but it doesn’t save any weight; regardless, I may pick one up if this tent ends up working for me.  They also offer a floor-only section, which lets you rig the system as a bomber tarp set-up.  That’s not usually my thing, but in the cool and dry times I’d consider it.

How big is she?

That’s the problem with the PNE

What does “PNE” stand for?

How big is she?

Here’s a picture.

Pictured: Uh, yeah …about that…

That’s her on top of someone that’s 5’4″/163cm.  She’s slightly larger, now; that was a picture from a couple of years ago.  Even without the slight perspective distortion…yeah, she’s a big girl.

Also, my first impressions of the Nallo are that it’s an incredibly well-built tent that has an intuitive pitch, and that I was right when I said that it was the color of a banana slug.

Pictured: Same basic shape, too.

What does “PNE” stand for?

Typo.  Should have been PNW, but I didn’t catch it in time to fix it.  My laptop keyboard and I don’t get along; it’s too small and it makes literally everything an exercise in editing.

Also, apologies for having restated some of my first post in that follow-up that I posted this morning; I had forgotten that I had already detailed the communication situation and some of my criteria…but evidently, today I’m going to be working for the Department of Redundancy Department, so bear with me.  More tent info later. 👍

Okay, time for some actual content…and forgive me if my thoughts are somewhat disjointed; it’s been a day.

First of all: I don’t actually mind the packed size of this tent, despite it only being slightly smaller than a baby zeppelin as it’s packaged from the factory.

Pictured: Nearly-dead pink 20-oz. coffee mug provided for scale.

Honestly, it’s kind of compact despite being 2.4kg/5.3lb, and I’m willing to bet that if I really took my time and tight-rolled it, I could get it down to a very small overall package; ditto for using some kind of compression sack.  That being said, I am not going to carry this tent as an all-together package: it’s a bit cumbersome and outsized for my normal fortyish-liter pack when it’s rolled into a long Twinkie-shaped-object, so I’ll probably split it up.  The body and fly can be stuffed/rolled into a smaller package (or just stuffed loose and used to pad out the middle of the pack) and the poles and stake bag can go pretty much anywhere they’ll fit.

I already used my side-on picture of the inaugural pitch, but despite working for the Department of Redundancy Department today, I can’t really use that one again in good conscience.  Instead, I’ll post a full-frontal view and categorically state that this is easiest tent I’ve ever pitched.

Pictured: Also, phrasing.

All jokes aside (again), I’m really not kidding about that; the Nallo 2 is incredibly simple to pitch.  The front and rear corners all have tensioners, there’s a convenient staking point at the center-rear for holding the body and fly down in heavy weather while you deal with the poles, corners and stakes, and the poles themselves are extremely easy to insert and tension; after that, it’s just lift and pull in one manner or another.  In Hilleberg’s video on the Nallo 2 – as well as in countless others on YouTube – everyone pulls from the front of the vestibule to stretch and pitch the tent into place; I found that this is one way to do it, but not the only way to do it.  After experimenting for a few minutes, I found that it’s actually easier to get a clean pitch by:

1. Staking the front pole corners,
2. Staking the rear fly corners,
3. Pulling the front of the vestibule into place,
4. Staking everything else per the factory instructions.

I’m sure there are multiple ways to do this, but I like the method above…and it only takes about four minutes, total.  I actually timed myself to see how long it would take, and after pitching and striking it a few times in the local park, I averaged somewhere around the four-minute mark every time.  More importantly: even when I wasn’t trying to get a flawless pitch right out of the gate – more on that in a minute – I could still get the tent to about 95%-perfect without really trying to do so.  I think that part of the tent’s design is the self-directing aspect of the pitch: as long as you basically put the stakes and guys where they logically go, you’re going to end up with a strong, stable pitch in the end; if you take a few extra minutes to be careful, you can get it as close to perfect as the ground will allow.  Conclusion: this is a far easier shelter to pitch than my Stratospire, and I already have a lot more confidence in my ability to get it up quickly if things aren’t balmy and calmy like they were this morning.

Moving on the subject of guy lines (because I promised this post would be somewhat unstructured)…

Pictured: Do this on the front…

Pictured: …and do this on the rear.

In case it’s not clear what I’m showing, there: a good location mnemonic for the guy lines stakes on both the front and the rear of the tent is “approximately in line with the front and rear edges, and as far from the tent as they’ll go at full extension.”  I messed with these staking points a lot – like, I repositioned them about a dozen times, each time making a slight refinement – and found that placing the stakes this far to the front and rear of the poles created a good approximation of the 45° angle (relative to the pole) that Hilleberg calls for in the pitching literature…and this  angle makes a HUGE difference in the interior tent’s tautness.  The entire assembly is definitely sturdy with the lines pulled out at pretty much any angle, but when you get the main guy lines pulling in the correct direction and under the correct tension, the interior tent just kind of lofts into place and drastically increases the usable volume.  Guy line angle and staking is definitely one of the parts where taking that little bit of extra time really pays off.

Also, I’ll say that after messing with the guy lines and stakes for an hour or so this morning, I will be absolutely be swapping to lines that are both brighter and more reflective.  You’d think that the bright red and white lines on the stock lines would be pretty visible, but just look at the pictures of the rear of the Nallo: they somehow kind of halfway disappear in places.  I had a lot of trouble with keeping track of them in my peripheral vision – which is quite good –  so I’ll probably go ahead and swap to the blue Glowire that I already have.  I may also change out line tensioners; the factory Line-Loks are nice, but I seem to fumble with them.  A simple cam tensioner might be just as good, but I’ll have to think on that.

On a similar subject: I will be upping my stake game, because as soon as one of these V-stakes hits so much as a pebble in the ground, it stops moving and won’t push any further…so I’ll need some solid pins to take care of that problem.  I guess I’ll go with the Vargo models; they look workable, for the price.  The Hilleberg set looks…well, expensive.

I think that’ll be it, for now: interior and vestibule details will be coming tomorrow.  Or possibly later.  We’ll see.  Regardless, signs are good: I think this could work out well.

Okay, moving on to a few notes about the interior and the vestibule…

Pictured: This is perfect.  The end.

I could probably just stop there, because the vestibule is exactly what I was hoping for.  It’s roomy, wide, accessible and shaped well for storage and cooking, and it looks like there will be a good amount of space for changing without tripping over everything.  The headroom is generous, the peak is reasonably wide, and the door is…well, the door is actually pretty impressive.

I didn’t take a lot of pictures of the various ways in which the door can be configured, but it’s essentially infinitely adjustable within its perimeter.  It’s an inverted U-shape with twin zippers, and it can open from any direction –  top, bottom, either side  – and that’s not incredibly revolutionary; the interesting part is that it has a retention/tensioning strap across the threshold that ties the vestibule sides together.   I didn’t know about that strap until I read the instruction manual, but its presence means that the door can be staked down and that the sides of the vestibule can be used as entries; that’s very useful if the wind shifts and a protective entry is needed.

All that being said, my favorite feature of the door is that it can be rolled down from the top in order to create a chimney; that makes cooking so much easier.

Pictured: Dopeness…except, not.

So, one of the few oversights that I’ve caught is the inability to secure the door fabric when it’s zipped down from the top as shown.  I think I have a fix, though:

Pictured: I’ll just roll it up and assume it’ll automagically stay in place.

I think – think – that since this is kind of a no-load situation, I might be able to use the zipper itself as a makeshift fabric retainer: I could add a tiny bit of shock cord and a toggle to the pull.  This would loop around the door fabric and back through the zipper pull ring, and it should hold the fabric up in light winds.  In heavier conditions this would be a no-go answer because the wind would probably just pull the zipper further down; if needed, I could add an actual fabric loop on the edge of the vestibule sides, but I don’t really want to make that addition unless I actually need it.

Regarding the interior…

Pictured: It’s lemon-flavored.  I like it.

Despite the wide-angle distortion, you can get a good idea of the interior proportions in relation to the outer tent; there’s a pretty significant gap, which seems like it’ll be good for ventilation, albeit not-so-good for headroom.  On that topic: the headroom is…well, adequate.  If I sit up straight, I can hit the 100cm/39″ fabric ceiling even when the tent is pitched as perfectly as I can currently get it; that’s not great, but the ceiling is relatively flat, so I don’t get the same immediate fabric-on-the-side-of-my-head issue that I had with the Soulo and a few other tents of similar clearance.  So, this isn’t ideal, but it’ll work…and since it only happens when I sit up straight – which I often do, to ease pressure on my lower back – I think that I might be able to change up my chair and sleeping pad situation a bit and make things more comfortable.  I’m thinking that one of the pad-to-chair-conversion dinguses might be a good idea, here; I’ve never used one, but it might allow me to have a sitting solution in the tent that gives good sitting comfort without putting my head into the fabric constantly.

Pretty much every other dimension inside the tent is okay; the length is definitely clipped by the sloping rear wall – more on that in a second – but the width and volume are really nice.  In many ways this really is a 2P tent, but there’s no way around the fact that it would be tight for longer than a night or so; for longer trips or more consistent companionship, I’d personally want something larger.

So, about the foot area…

I’ve read a lot about how the effective length of the Nallo is compromised by the sloping rear wall; the floor is well over 2m long, but you actually end up with slightly less length than that because of the slope, which causes the foot area of sleeping bags to hit the sloping wall.  It’s not an ideal design, but it’s a pretty good one for the weight and size; fixing the issue requires a design like the Nammatj or the Kaitum and adding another kilogram of weight.  The common fix to this is to just sleep diagonally, but I think there’s another method: just pitch the tent correctly.

So, I noticed a few things when futzing around with the rear of the tent, and in summary: a lot of the “correctly” seems to happen there.  The instructions mentioned detaching the inner from the outer at the rear and staking the inner separately in order to improve ventilation and airflow, so I tried that to see what happened; the result was a much cleaner pitch at the rear, and a more vertical rear wall on the inner tent.  The entire inner just kind of relaxed and eased upwards, so I think I had the rear over-tightened in some way to begin with.  With that in mind, I slacked the rear adjusters, checked and adjusted the rest of the guy lines, and then took a look inside.

Pictured: And then I noticed something.

Question: Why is there a cord lock on the clothesline?

Answer: Because it’s an adjustable clothesline, duh.

So, while I was futzing around with the inside of the tent – I do a lot of futzing, it seems – I started wondering what happens if you change the tension on the clotheline…and it turns out that small changes in the clothesline either pull or relax the fabric tension on the fabric above the footbox, which has a pretty large impact on the clearance in that area.   You can’t really over-tighten it because you’ll be pulling against the front and rear guy lines and the cord lock will just slip, but within the tolerances of the cord and the lock, it seems to make a pretty big difference.  I ended up having quite a bit more room than was present when I initially pitched it.

Without actually spending some time in the tent and testing it, I can’t say much more about the interior and the livability, but I can say that this thing is really, really, ridiculously well-made: that part of the Hilleberg rep is no exaggeration.  All of the seams are straight and even, there are no weird wrinkles or accidental gathers, no issue with the fabric, etc; they even used seamless rings on the stake points (which I’m pretty sure are titanium, by the way).  Overall, the quality is top-notch…and for that, we can thank Oksana Ussova.

Pictured: Thank you, Oksana.

I don’t know that I’ve ever seen this in a tent before, but I’m here for it.

So, I do have a few nitpicks aside from the one that I mentioned with the door fabric, but this post is too long already and I need to get around to finding a Box of Random Hardware that should have some line tensioners in it.  Should.  No promises.

Well, that didn’t take very long…

Pictured: Success.

Those are storm line adjusters from Dutchware, and I have no idea as to how I ended up with a bag of 50 of them.  I think someone on the forum sent them to me, possibly along with something else that I bought, but don’t quote me on that.  They’re sized for 2.5 and 3mm lines, so the 2.5mm Glowire that I already have will work just fine for them.  Now, I have to decide whether or not to include a metal stake ring on the line, because I think that might be a minor weight increase that I would really appreciate.

Couple of small updates…

1. The forum is stripping initial posts from threads this morning, so if the now-vanished initial post on this thread never reappears, this thread isn’t going to make much sense. 🤣
2. I can’t find any kind of metal ring that definitely resembles the rings that Hilleberg uses.

On that second point: I’ve been looking for hours and hours and I’m drawing a blank.  Depending on where you’re standing when you’re doing the measuring, the factory rings are either 25mm by 2.5mm or approximately 1″ by 1/8″.  Also, they’re entirely non-magnetic, or the magnetic quick-attach fob on my busted-ass Toyota key has decided that it doesn’t like them.

Pictured: Unreasonable hatred. 

The matte/tumbled finish looks like titanium to me, but it’s hard to tell.  It’s a welded ring – the seam is barely visible upon close inspection – and it doesn’t have a round cross-section: it’s actually flat on the inner and outer surfaces and crowned on the faces.

Part of me wants to just email Hilleberg and ask them exactly what the hell these things are made from, because even if it’s a part that’s being bought in the tens of thousands, it should still be available somewhere.  And to clarify: I don’t honestly think that I need them on the guy lines – Hilly certainly doesn’t think so, either – but I’ve used rings before and I kind of like them.  Mostly, I now just want to know what they are to satisfy my curiosity. 🤣

I think you can roll back the back side of the Nallo and be able to look out the inner window. Or it’s on option on the Anjan.

I think you can roll back the back side of the Nallo and be able to look out the inner window. Or it’s on option on the Anjan.

Maybe?  I know the back can roll up a tiny bit…

Pictured: Vague similarity?

I think it’s possible to roll the fabric all the way up to the rear pole, but I’m not sure if there’s a tie-off, toggle or something of that nature.

Being a “kinda tunnel” tent I think the NALLO is very good for winter use, especially with that vestibule. The shape will shed high winds and/or heavy snow very well.

As with any tent in heavy snow you will haver to occasionally get out and shovel snow away from the sides to keep it from pushing inward and restricting interior space.

I think you could stake out the back two inner corners and then roll it up to the poll. Not sure how much you could see out the mesh window, but it could be neat.

Being a “kinda tunnel” tent I think the NALLO is very good for winter use, especially with that vestibule. The shape will shed high winds and/or heavy snow very well.

I’m thoroughly in love with the vestibule; it has a better layout than my kitchen.  Pretty sure it’s larger, too.

As with any tent in heavy snow you will haver to occasionally get out and shovel snow away from the sides to keep it from pushing inward and restricting interior space.

Yeah, I’m hoping that this one doesn’t do it as badly as some others…but it’s still gonna happen.  Good thing I have a lightweight shovel; that encourages me to carry it.

I think you could stake out the back two inner corners and then roll it up to the poll. Not sure how much you could see out the mesh window, but it could be neat.

Visibility would be low, but I’m sure the ventilation would go up.  With a mesh interior, however, it would basically be an entire open end.

Also, as a quick note: I shamelessly emailed Hilleberg to see exactly what these stake rings are made from.  I’m still striking out with finding them.

Can you tell us where you were able to buy a Hilleberg for 72% off?  I would jump on that deal as well.

Can you tell us where you were able to buy a Hilleberg for 72% off? I would jump on that deal as well.

I wish I could, but I can’t, and that’s mostly because I didn’t buy it for 72% off.

…and I got it for slightly less than 72% of the standard retail price.

Reading back over that sentence, I can see how it could be misleading; an extra, phantom f completely changes the meaning.  English is fun, like that…

So, here’s the better way of saying it: I managed to find/create a 28% discount, all-in.  Final price was somewhere around $819, USD, and that deal was found at a website called Black Ovis.  They’re primarily hunting focused, and they’re getting rid of their Hilleberg inventory because they’re shifting suppliers.  I did confirm with Hilleberg that everything they have is legit, so it’s not secondhand or grey-market.  Likewise, I confirmed with Black Ovis that they’re simply selling off the remaining stock; nothing is damaged, returned, etc.  The sand-colored Nallo I bought was their last one in that color; I can’t speak to what else they may or may not have left at the time of this writing.

It’s worth restating that this is kind of an odd happening; Hilleberg really doesn’t do sales…so unless you catch an inventory reduction/liquidation like this, you only have one other common route to getting one without selling your extra children to raise the money: Hilleberg’s special offers section.  That’s their discounted-because-reasons “sale” page, from which I almost bought a Nallo that had some kind of no-effect seam/stitch issue.  It was 20% off, but it was in green…and as pretty as that green is, I just liked the poo-brown color better, so I went with that one when I tripped across it.  I’m still keeping an eye on the special offers page, though; if a mesh inner tent comes up, there, I’d gladly snag it just to try it out.

In unrelated news: I did find these rings for sale, but they’re not really that similar to the factory Hilleberg rings.  These are much larger in cross-section; almost twice as thick, as best I can figure.  They’re also anodized, and I’m not sure if that’s the case with the factory rings or not.  Hopefully I hear back from Hilleberg regarding what they’re using.

I may finally have a free day that’s both clear and dry, so it might be Guyline Switching Day.  We’ll see.

Other slight updates:

• I’ve been looking around at stakes, and I really can’t find a nail stake that looks better than the Vargo for anywhere near the price.  The Hilleberg nails are insanely expensive and don’t seem to offer much over the Vargos, so I may just go with the latter option.  I’ve also seen suggestions regarding carrying a single Ti nail to make a hole in the ground, and then using a set of carbon nails as the actual stakes…but this seems like a lot of fuss, even if it’s somewhat lighter.
• I haven’t heard back from Hilleberg on my ring question – 🤔 – so I re-sent the contact form; my previous response might have gotten lost in the shuffle.  We’ll see if I hear back from this second attempt.
• I’ve been looking for a nice inside-the-tent chair, and haven’t found anything that’ll work.  I tried a Thermarest Compack™ chair that I found, but it doesn’t fit my pad well; same goes for their Trekker™ chair, at 4+ additional ounces.  I also tried an old-skool Crazy Creek as well as the newer version thereof: both are initially okay, but they get uncomfortable after about ten minutes…and they’re heavy AF, too.  So…yeah… I might just have to pick up a cheap sewing machine and get serious about making some of the stuff that I can’t find.