Sleeping not inside a tent – how do you deal with it?

[Daryl and Daryl]

My simple answer is that I always sleep in a tent.  Over time the loose gear issue plus slugs on face, rattlesnake in boot, mice running over me, pack rats stealing things, marmot running off with shoe and porcupine chewing on pack have all led to me being a dedicated tent occupant.  It relaxes me to know that all my gear is within the tent.

Last night, sleeping at home, I dreamed that I stopped in a shelter while hiking to eat lunch.   I had a table to myself so was casual about my gear monitoring.   A bunch of people showed up.  By the time I finished lunch  my gear was mixed with theirs, some was missing.   Very stressful.  It’s obvious that my gear organization/retention issues go beyond Dianne’s straight forward question.

[Jerry Adams]

Funny dream

I’ve had mice run across me.  I worry that some creature will steal my spoon.

[Diane “Piper” Soini]

It’s funny but I pretty much always have a good idea what time it is when I wake up in the night. I also don’t use an alarm clock in regular life. Another thing I don’t do is use a flashlight or headlamp to get up and pee in the middle of the night or to try and find things in my tent at night. I so seldom use a light that I often do not bring one. I like having a watch for daytime, though. It helps me see how far I’ve gone and remember what day it is and also to let me know not to eat my lunch yet (otherwise I will always eat it at 10AM and then be too hungry the rest of the day.)

[Hydro Man]

I never sleep in a tent unless it’s raining or buggy.  If it’s “maybe” going to rain I’ll sleep out but have my tent set up just in case.  When sleeping out I don’t have many things left to account for.  My tent is either up or in my pack, sleeping kit I’m using, food and cooking stuff is hanging or in a bag by my head.  Extra clothes are in a stuff sack in my pack and all that’s left out is pretty much just my watch, headlamp, glasses and book.  Any other items are in the pack loose. I generally put my watch, headlamp and glasses in my shoes and my book just ends up nearby on the ground sheet.

[Tipi Walter]

There are so many disadvantages to Cowboy Camping (with or w/o a bivy), especially in the Southeast mountains of TN/NC where I backpack.  In the old days I used to “bedroll camp” all the time—and would frequently get rudely awakened by a crystal night turning to a thunderstorm at 3am.  You cannot discount this problem.

And then there’s your normal heavy dew by morning, coating everything.  Or when this dew freezes solid or after a sleetstorm causing pack zippers to lock up and webbing to stop moving in buckles.  Stuff inside a tent does not get covered in sleet and ice and snow.  Or cowboy camping in mosquito country and seeking refuge in your hot bag or bivy sack combo.  And then there’s spindrift.

And there’s no privacy.  And black carpenter ants can ruin a good night of sleeping.  And there’s the mvt of sheeting ground water in heavy rains, something a good tent floor keeps away.  (A lone ground cloth DOES NOT—as this water will run over the top of a ground cloth).

But I still cowboy camp if I feel like throwing the dice—did so recently at the end of a Pisgah trip when my shuttle driver took me to her home for an overnighter in her backyard.  Too tired to set up the tent.  Of course the dew was bad and the bag compromised.

 

[Duane Hall]

The cowboy is a romantic figure in American culture, but we can forget that it was the cowboy’s lot to suffer in the wind, rain, sleet, snow, and even the foggy foggy dew.   I cowboy camp once in a while, but it has been some time since I considered my dew soaked or frost coated sleeping bag to be romantic.  It’s just cold and wet :)

[Tipi Walter]

I was raised in Oklahoma and I was always taught that a Cowboy was a Boy who was Cow-like???

[Mina Loomis]

Piper,

Your question caught my attention partly because you have a lot more backpacking experience than I do and it goes to show the benefits of asking questions and learning. Also your questions are always interesting!

My take on it:

If it is windy enough to blow my stuff away I won’t be able to sleep without some sort of blocking mechanism. Even if temperatures are warm, just the motion of that much wind is stimulating enough to keep me awake.

Under the stars: Only if not windy. I’m not much concerned about critters. In Texas we do try to avoid ant nests, cactus, etc. If it’s hot then outside a tent is much more comfortable. Main issue is, no matter if it’s desert or whatever and the sky is clear all day and evening, it can sneak up and rain at 2 a.m. Have a shelter plan B handy.

Open tarp: Like an 8 x 10 or similar. With a polycryo groundsheet to keep excess dirt or wet off of gear. Avoid any ground that looks like it might collect rainwater. This includes spots that are clear of vegetation and stones and thus look like good spots—these spots are often clear *because* they channel or collect rain. Slight depressions in the ground surface can be hard to spot. Wind with a tarp: stake edges down, put other gear across remaining open sides. For example, pack on edge, rain jacket hung from pole and upper tie-outs, open umbrella, anything I can rig from what I have depending on the circumstances. My 8 x 10 is big enough for 1 or 2 without using bivies.

Shaped tarp (mine is a Haven2, or a Gatewood if by myself): Almost like a tent in blocking wind. But more room than a tent, and less weight to carry.

Bugs? Mosquitoes and flies bite and it’s nice to have the inner net for the shaped tarp, but then all together that makes a tent. Ants? Always around but tend to mind their own business, same with spiders and scorpions. (Texas scorpions aren’t particularly dangerous.) Caught without the inner net or a tent or just under the stars and a ton of mosquitoes show up and it’s too hot to stay in a sleeping bag? It’s happened. Solved with a whole lot of deet.

Other non-human animals, it doesn’t seem to me that a tent would make that much difference. And sleeping out, if some critter wanders near (hardly ever happens) I can see it. Humans around? Ignore them. (Or make friends.)

Stuff: Like the others have said, same organization in tarp or in the open, as in the tent. One advantage of having a minimal kit is less stuff to keep up with. Glasses, headlamp, and phone in shoes. Or under pillow if I am car camping and have a pillow. If cold, electronics like phone or camera inside the sleeping bag with me to keep their batteries warmer. Personal items ditty with stuff like chapstick and aspirin, right next to shoes, where I can easily find it in the dark. My hat is floppy so not as good for stowing things but sounds like a good idea with the right sort of hat. Cook kit, either way out yonder on top of the bear can, or if no bear or other critter concerns then just next to me or near the tarp opening, or in the shaped-tarp vestibule. Same for food bag if no need to protect. Water bottle within reach. Bandanna and socks spread out to air or dry, maybe weighted by a shoe.

If I did have a reason to stow everything instead of keeping it out handy, each item would be in the same place in my pack where it lives during the day. Always keeping every item in the same place has helped me a lot. Otherwise I lose stuff and get confused. Losing stuff especially bad since going light means no duplicates.

Another benefit of being out in the open:  Companion starts snoring loudly, easy to pick up and move far enough away to go back to sleep!

Good discussion!

[Miner]

When I cowboy camp which is almost always (is always if you count under a tarp), all the stuff I don’t need overnight goes back into my backpack. I normally keep my stuff organized in my pack in a few zpacks cuben fiber stuff sacks of various sizes as they weigh next to nothing so there aren’t a lot of loose items to deal with other than maps or my phone which go into my pack to keep them dry. My clothing that doesn’t make it into my pillow stuff sack gets folded inside my long hiking pants and put under my pillow stuff sack to give it more height as it’s never on my sleeping pad. The things I don’t put inside my pack that I might need, I dump into my upside down hat by my head (glasses, chapstick, flashlight/headlamp, and my carbiner altimeter watch). I normally put my backpack by my head and cover it with my rain jacket (tucked under in places) to keep dew off it. So I usually extend part of the jacket (usually hood) to cover my hat as well so it keeps most moisture and dust off my glasses.

Lets talk wind a little bit. We are obviously only concerned about strong wind gusts that can send items flying. In most circumstances, any wind will pass a few inches above the ground; often higher, so it’s above your hat. So with a few exceptions along the PCT in SoCal (I can only think of 3 times over the years), you don’t need to worry about your stuff blowing away. The weight of the items I mentioned tend to be enough to keep the hat grounded. A full water bottle will help if needed as non of the items mentioned will tend to fly off on their own. Now in those really rare times where even the dirt is flying and hitting you which would be a concerned about sending your hat flying, since I often use a bivy sack when cowboy camping, I just put those items inside the bivy next to my head. I guess I could also put them in my snack hipbelt pocket that I usually empty out at night as it will be by my head most of the time.

[Diane “Piper” Soini]

Texas scorpions aren’t particularly dangerous

I always thought of Texas as the Australia of America and now that illusion is broken with this comment.

[jscott]

“Aren’t particularly dangerous…” but still sting like hell? Or even just sting like heck over half your body?

I hate bugs and scorpions and mosquitoes and ants and snakes and hanta virus mice (been there with them scampering over face all night when I tried tarp camping) and marmots and bears stepping over you. What am I forgetting? Oh yeah the night when a tree stump near my fire exploded with thousands of flying bugs that swarmed me as I ran for my netted tent and stayed swarmed to that netting all night.

No tent? No thanks.  I like a clean bag too…and knowing that my glasses won’t get stepped on by me or an animal.

But I do miss the star gazing. That’s the one very significant down side to tent camping; the only one.

[Mina Loomis]

Re: the little scorpions commonly found all over Texas–yes they sting, I’ve been stung a couple of times, but I’ve seen them just wander off without stinging too.  Their stings hurt like the dickens for about 20 minutes but then go away completely, no mark or welt or itching or anything.  (I am not allergic though.  People with allergies, that would be different.)  I’ve read about some scorpions in Arizona that send you to the hospital.  No personal experience with that.

But then there are chiggers…you don’t even know they got you until the next day. They dissolve holes in your skin and itch for weeks.  But just sleeping in a tent won’t save you.  They got you when you sat on that nice log at lunch.

[Jason]

Please, please, please, someone tell me what is a pee-rag?!?! And where do I get one!!!!????

[Pedestrian]

@thebestbackpacker:

Since this seems to be your first post here on BPL: welcome!

And since you’re “The Best Backpacker”, I suggest you do the following:

Pick a popular backpacking trail (you should know many well…..) especially in the summer and position yourself at a strategic spot. When you see a female backpacker approach – ask the question that you posed above. If you’re lucky you might even be rewarded with a rag for yourself: just wash and you should be good.

Meanwhile, feel free to consult Dr Google for more immediate gratification.

All others: please excuse the thread drift…..

 

 

[Diane “Piper” Soini]

Ha ha ha what’s a pee rag? Well, what is pee? What is a rag? How and when and for whom might the two reasonably go together?

[James Marco]

Ha, hey…it sounds a bit kinky when you put it like that… Tommy, you don’t really need one.

 

 

[obx hiker]

The first thing I do when I select a campsite in the Winds ( cowboy/tent whatever) is gather up about a dozen apple sized rocks to keep stuff from blowing around. Pull something out of the pack or take off a layer; put a rock on it. You can use ’em later to stone Jeffrey’s bears ;)  That’s the only place I can remember where I’ve cowboy camped and wind was an issue and I’ve cowboy camped in some interesting spots like the base of Banner above Garnet and again on that trip at the lakes behind Ritter… The Grand Canyon, Grand Gulch, Salt Creek. The Enchantments, Goat Rocks…. lots of  places..the beach at Matanchen Bay in.Mexico.. the no-seeums were  ridiculous. Oh yeah Haleakala. That was a good one.

Walter’s right as usual about the East and Southeast. I think the answer to cowboy camping there is called a hammock.

[Randy Martin]

Cowboy camping comes down to campsite  selection.  If I am expecting to camp in heavily used campsites then I’ll use an enclosed shelter because those campsites tend to have significant small animal traffic.

To the original OP question, I keep all of my smaller items inside a lightweight  accessory bag like this https://www.rei.com/product/117931/eagle-creek-pack-it-specter-tech-quick-trip-kit

Hygiene, Water Treatment, Fire Starter, First aid, everything else that is smaller in size goes in this container.  This keeps things contained that would otherwise be hard to find and easily get lost.  Everything else except water bottle and shoes goes in my pack.  That’s how I keep my stuff organized whether I am cowboy camping or tent camping.  Same system.

[Author]

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