PETZL PUZZLE

I have been using Petzl lamps since I was in Scouting for their reliability.

Is the manufacturing fit and finish the same as the old models?  It almost sounds like they might have gone to a contract manufacturer, went down a cost reduction rat hole, and lost sight of design for function, not to mention lost quality control of the manufacturing.

I can buy AA Lithium batteries most anywhere, even at little shops in in small mountain villages in far-away places.
Where can I buy these ‘Core’ batteries?

When will mfrs learn to put the customer first, rather than trying to force them into buying ancillaries only from one source? (Rhetorical question, and the answer is probably ‘never’.)

Cheers

As far as I’m aware, the Core battery can be replaced by AAA batteries. The advantage of the Core is that it’s rechargeable.

Charging time
Charging time is approximately 3 hours with the USB charger or a
computer. Warning: if several USB devices are connected to your
computer, the charging time can increase (up to 24 hours).
While charging, the charge indicator lights steady red, then steady
green when charging is complete.
Replacing the rechargeable battery
Use only a Petzl CORE rechargeable battery. Using another type of
rechargeable battery can damage your lamp. Do not use another type
of rechargeable battery.

I’ve been using a Black Diamond LED headlamp for years.  Rechargeable with USB.  I always charge it up before a trip and it’s never run out.  I’ve never “opened it up”.

I think my model is obsolete but there’s a similar one:

https://www.rei.com/product/162945/black-diamond-sprint-225-headlamp

I have this project of not buying products with non rechargeable batteries – mostly unsuccessful though.

I’m sure other manufacturers like Petzl would be fine also, but I don’t know if they have one that’s rechargeable.

Having a rechargeable “core” battery that’s removed from the headlamp seems unnecessarily complicated – just build the lithium battery into the product and have a USB plug on the side of the headlamp.

That is an 092931 battery, 3.7v. The lowest price I found for an 092931 with the charging port built in was for an Ozark Trail headlamp that comes with one for under $20.

The versatility of using either AAA or 092931 may be slightly better than using rechargeable AAA’s because of the built-in charging port. All you need to carry is the cable (plus whatever USB power source you were carrying for other gear).

It might be possible to use an 092931 in any device made for 3x AAA, with two conditions:

1. The humps between AAA cells in the battery case need to be reduced. Might be possible with a Dremel.
2. The device must run adequately on the slightly lower 3.7 volts (rather than nominal 4.5v of 3x AAA).

I try to avoid devices with non-removable batteries because you have to throw the whole thing away when the battery inevitable degrades. (Or else figure out how to disassemble a device not made for disassembly.)

Better to use rechargeable AA/AAA batteries (or this 092931 if you can find one that you like). It is also possible to buy rechargeable AA/AAA batteries with built-in charging ports. That solution does not require a Dremel case mod.

Hi all
Consider me enlightened – thank you.
Cheers

I think we’ve bracketed the subject Bill, good points

I’ve used my Black Diamond for years with no noticeable battery degradation

Maybe a LED flashlight is so cheap (in $ and environmental cost) that it doesn’t matter if you have to discard it when the battery dies.  Vs the cost of a bunch of batteries needed over it’s lifetime.

With a phone or my Inreach Mini maybe it’s more important to be able to replace the battery.  I successfully replaced my inreach battery.

Hmmm… now you have me wondering if I can open up my headlamp… I see a joint between two pieces of plastic.  Hard to tell if it’s adhered or just snapped into place…

Cases are often glued. A heat gun or hair dryer can help. Take care not to heat the electronics above 100C/200F. The battery may be even more sensitive (and possibly explode-y). Best practice is to have a bucket of sand and a fire extinguisher handy.

Not trying to discourage you; people do it all the time. It’s just that lithium burns HOT. Like hot enough to burn through the floor. Better safe than sorry.

Agreed that rechargeable is better than trashing hundreds of batteries. I just prefer the choice of removables. Even better with standard sizes so that I can buy replacements anywhere when necessary.

I think I won’t try to look inside : )

what I like about BPL is you get a bunch of information on all sides and then you can decide what works best for your case

Having a rechargeable “core” battery that’s removed from the headlamp seems unnecessarily complicated – just build the lithium battery into the product and have a USB plug on the side of the headlamp.

Petzl do have such headlamps, as well as AAA/Core models. The Swift RL and the Bindi, for example.

It’s really not that bad, Jerry. You have a fire extinguisher somewhere, right? Just get it out. You probably have a bucket (or #10 can or baking dish). If you don’t have sand then dirt will do. Or baking soda. Now that you have been cautioned, it is unlikely that you will start a fire.

I just wouldn’t feel right telling people how to take their electronics apart without saying a word about safety, that’s all. It’s kind of like, “Don’t hike in the mountains without looking at the weather forecast (and carrying an extra layer just in case).” Yes, people die (or start fires). Not you (probably).

A more likely challenge can be putting tiny stuff back together. Best to not do it on a device that would sadden you if you break it.

Jerry, and all:

Tried to cover all the bases; sorry for missing some.  One has to be able to get at the Petzl Core battery for 2 reasons:  Every time you recharge, you need to plug into the battery, which comes with a connecter with a USB plug on one end, and the tinier plug on the other end that fits the battery.  And when the rechargeable battery finally goes, you need to replace it.  There may be a way to recharge without opening the compartment to access the battery; but I’m not techy enough to do it.

So I just carry one or two recharged batteries on a trek (less than two oz), so there is no need to carry a heavier battery recharger.  For those who bring a lot of tech stuff trekking, that is obviously another story.  There are a threads on BPL about the rechargers.  I am a devout follower of KISS, so none of that.  I carry a Rescue Me PLB, but have used one only once.  Still,  like the idea of being able to converse with Search and Rescue folks, not to mention family, so that, along with other electronic equipment, could possibly get me to carry a recharger.  Doubt it though.

Bruce T, please note that the fit and finish on the new Tikkas is not great.  Like fragile acetal plastic cordlocks with small parts that fail.  That’s why it is a bear to get into the new Tikka’s battery compartment to replace the Core battery or recharge it without damaging the plastic.  Some  of the other brands have ports on the outside to recharge, but no access to the battery.  I like the old Petzl because I can just pop in a spare 7/8 oz fully charged battery when the one inside uses up its charge: so only have to carry one or two spares.  There is always one spare in my pack in a tiny waterproof case.  The new Black Diamond rechargeable battery is very similar, which is why I mentioned it in the OP.  And it is a snap to open the Black Diamond Astra headlamp to take out the battery, replace it, or put it into a very small charging case to recharge.  But not sure about waterproofing.  So for those reasons, the BD might eclipse the new Petzl Tikka; but a tour through reviews of the BD lamps might raise other issues.

Also, I’ve no idea what safety measures are built into the Petzl Core battery to prevent lithium melt down, and have no intention of playing with one to find out.  I’ve gone through a number of the Core batteries over the years with zero problems.   And am doubtful that the US mail would accept any lithium battery for mailing, so buy them at a nearby REI.

For those unfamiliar with the Petzl hybrid concept, Eveready non-rechargeable lithium AAA’s, or just conventional AAA’s, will fit into and work with the Tikka .

Granted, barring more new changes, I’m set with enough of the old Petzl Tikkas  to last a  number of years.  I just wanted to alert folks to some of the not so good changes, and perhaps bring about some fixes from Petzl.  There may still be some of the old Tikkas on line – one company called them “last season” Tikkas.

I have some device with a removeable rechargeable lithium battery with a USB connection on it’s side.  That works good.  Maybe it’s a bit tricky to make a USB connector waterproof so having it inside is good.

Maybe I can try to disassemble my headlamp outside on a concrete surface well away from the house, at a spot I don’t mind if it get’s “stained”.

Just to be clear, the Black Diamonds with built in rechargeable cannot use AAA batteries. The versions that come with AAAs can also use the rechargeable lithium battery, available separately. Yes, the bean counters got it all figured out for marketing purposes. The consumer is not allowed to have cake and eat it, too!

My solution: MYOG of course.
A single AA lithium cell, a custom voltage convertor (variable), and 1 or 2 white LEDs, all on a headband.
Normally we use them on the lowest brightness settings, where the single AA cell will last for 30 – 50 hours. (I forget the exact calculated lifetime.) Good in the tent and for cooking dinner.
UL too.

Comment added: I do NOT want a 200 m range searchlight on my head. The figures might be good for PR and marketing, but such performance is useless for us.

Cheers

Roger, is there a brand, or do you make the lamps from scratch, like your stoves and other items..

As a physicist, you must know about the law of conservation of energy.  Any lamp that boasts 700 lumens, like a Nitecore, is either going to have a very short battery life, or a very heavy battery or batteries.

And if you accidentally shine such a monster into someone’s eyes, serious eye injury may result.  A friend  standing over 25 feet away had to remind me that even an old Tikka set at under 200 lumens was blinding him, and I had forgotten the blasted thing was still on my head.   IMO, these lithium headlamps can be very dangerous, and we can’t forget how dangerous.  My brother just spent two months to recover from a retinal tear after surgery, and he had to sleep fully sitting up and keep his head facing in one direction.  An older Remington headlamp that was reviewed in BPL has a diffuser that rotates down over the LED, but the built in diffuser on the old Tikkas at least fully covers the diode.  Why they did not retain the full coverage is a mystery to me.  I hope they fix it, along with the “fit and finish” issue pointed out by Bruce T.  It might even make sense to beef up the diffuser where on the old Tikkas, the diffuser grid passes over the diode.  These are wonderfully light weight and in an emergency, critical little gadgets that are recognized as one of the ‘ten essentials.”  But they must be fully thought out by the manufacturers.

Hi Sam

As you guessed, they are ‘Caffin’ brand. MYOG. I do have a full electronics workshop: from my Science Consulting days. It is a bit idle these days.

Yeah, on a low setting my headlights cast a gentle glow: enough to see with inside the tent, but no more than that. I try to maintain some night vision. I prefer to lower the current than to waste power with a diffuser.

I reckon the absurdly high powers some brands boast of are just marketing spin: my headlamp is brighter than yours. Spin, spin, spin.

Cheers