New Outdoor Research Helium UL Rain Jacket – 5.6 oz (M)

I just wish they’d add pit zips.

for that amount of money, a Montbell Versalite is much more attractive.

Just be aware that the legacy OR Helium is not a reliable weather proof garment. Even OR admits that in private conversations.  It’s good for the bus stop in Seattle. It is not a good choice for all day rain hike in WA state or anywhere else.  No, I haven’t used it. yes, there are lots of reports and as I say, even OR will acknowledge its “niche” in private in person conversations.  I can’t imagine why the newest version would be any different.

I agree that I’ve heard dubious things about the Helium’s capabilities as a rain jacket, and I’m not saying this new version is any better, but I would think that since the new version uses a completely different fabric and WP/B membrane that may (or may not) fix the wetting out issue the previous Helium had, we can’t jump to absolute conclusions about it’s performance.

I’m not sure the previous Helium (or any rain jackets) shortcoming is the membrane, but rather the DWR.

I just wish they’d add pit zips.

for that amount of money, a Montbell Versalite is much more attractive.

100%.

I won’t buy a rain jacket without pit zips.

And agree, the MB Versalite, which I own, is a far better jacket.

Does anyone have any firsthand knowledge on how this product performs? (The new one, not the old one.) I’m sure it’s not perfect, but I’d like to see more reviews before the new Helium is labeled a failure.

A little more info on this waterproof/breathable fabric from Japan.

https://www.fieldmag.com/articles/what-is-dermizax-waterproofing

interesting

a bit confusing.  It says “The jacket is able to do this because the membrane is hydrophilic, meaning that it can absorb moisture on the inside of the jacket and transport it to the outside.”

hydrophobic means it doesn’t absorb water which seems to contradict, although Seeber’s data shows water can pass through hydrophobic if there’s pressure pushing it

at the Toray site, some places say the membrane has both hydrophobic and hydrophilic molecules

at some point the scientific explanation doesn’t matter if it works : )

on some diagrams it says the outer layer has a DWR.  I wonder what that is.  It could be the same problem that DWRs have – forever chemicals, after it rains for a while it can wet out,…

there’s another similar fabric, sympatex from Germany

they say there are hydrophilic molecular chains in the membrane that allow water vapor to flow through.  Instead of pores like goretex.  the pores can plug up with body oils and lose effectiveness.  the hydrophilic molecular chains can not.

maybe that’s what dermizax does

Brador in Canada sells sympatex fabric.  3.5 ounces per square yard.  They don’t give prices, you have to request quote, which I did.

It says it’s free of solvents and PFS chemicals, and it says the outer layer is fluorocarbon finished, which seems to be contradictory – the bad chemicals are fluorocarbons

At some point perhaps they will come up with some new sort of DWR, because as of right now the best ones (C8 fluorocarbons) are banned because of their negative impact on the environment, and the current ones (C6 fluorocarbons), which still aren’t great for the environment are also not nearly as good at being a DWR.

polypropylene is hydrophobic all by itself, natural DWR, no fluorocarbons

I think they’ve moved on from c6 to c0.  I wonder if c6 is really that much more environmental than c8, and c0 better than c6.

Brador got back to me.  $20 per meter for sympatex, minimum order of $150

I wonder how well that fabric compares to gore tex, etc.  I don’t feel like spending $150 to find out.