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New Lightweight Fleece: Rab Alpha Flash


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  • #3490502
    Serge Giachetti
    BPL Member

    @giachett

    Locale: boulder, co

    see next post

    #3490503
    Serge Giachetti
    BPL Member

    @giachett

    Locale: boulder, co

    I know a lot of people here like to carry a light micro-fleece on some trips, so I thought I’d mention this new fleece from Rab. I just got it in the mail, but I’m pretty excited about it. Its airy, lofty, light and full zip at 9 oz for a size large.

    https://www.campsaver.com/rab-alpha-flash-jacket-men-s.html

    So I guess this is the same stuff as polartec alpha, just without any inner or outer shell material. Its an extremely airy, grid like high loft fleece. Seems like it’ll probably be a bit warmer and more breathable than a typical micro fleece. I think it’ll make for a great layering piece for the colder half of the year. I imagine I’ll be wearing it quite a bit by itself and under a breathable wind shirt in winter and sometimes under a shell when its been raining hard. I know micro fleece can be had for a lot less, but I haven’t really gotten along with any I’ve tried, and I don’t like the quarter zip on most of the lighter ones. This seems like it’ll vent better and probably dry quicker (?) It also compresses impressively small. I could fit this easily in a running pack.

    #3490549
    Steve K
    BPL Member

    @skomae

    Locale: northeastern US

    I’ve been a big fan of Polartec Alpha for stop and go activities. It has been great for rock and ice climbing and great for my cycling commute. The shell and insulation together make it a reasonable city piece too. I imagine without a shell, it could be more popular with the backpacking crowd as a fleece “replacement” and be much more versatile.

    #3490550
    Simon Kenton
    BPL Member

    @simonbutler

    Is it very resilient?

    #3490622
    Bob Shuff
    BPL Member

    @slbear

    Locale: SoCal

    Found an early review from GearJunkie here

    I like my Patagonia Level 3A jacket, but it’s too warm for most of my activities in SoCal – even in the winter.  I pictured it being used in the mountains, in wetter (but not downpour) conditions, maybe even as a daytime layer on a snowy backpack.

    I was since looking for a lighterweight fleece and this seems to fit the bill.  I’m curious how this would compare to an R1 for warmth?  I handed down my R1 hoody to my teenage son – it fits him better, and I vowed to replace it with something lighter.  I’m also curious that if this is significantly more breathable than regular 100 wt fleece, will it only be good in conjunction with a windproof layer on top?

    Price is a little steep, but not too much than the list price for an R1 jacket, except I often see those on sale if you are not picky on color.

     

    #3490631
    Paul S.
    BPL Member

    @pschontz

    Locale: PNW

    I would expect it to be quite warm.  Alpha Direct uses 125 g/m Alpha, whereas most jackets with Alpha have 60-80 g/m.  I would guess it’s similar to an Patagonia R2 jacket but I’m sure Richard N. could provide a more accurate comparison.

    Bob, if you want something lighter than an R1 I would recommend a Capilene Thermal or similar (e.g. Marmot Thermo).  I recently saw REI has some in their garage for a good deal.

    Thread with more info on Alpha: https://backpackinglight.com/forums/topic/polartec-alpha/

    #3490635
    Bob Shuff
    BPL Member

    @slbear

    Locale: SoCal

    I should clarify I wanted something that weighs less than the Patagonia R1, but it should be just as warm, breathable and versatile.  Also it should be cheap – like $20.  :)

    I don’t think I’m looking for anything less warm – I think that strikes a good balance of warmth and breath-ability, but it weighs 14.5 oz for a size L, and I probably need an XL in that or the RAB.

    #3490681
    Edward Barton
    BPL Member

    @porosantihodos

    Locale: Boston

    I’ve been eying this material and the Flash too. I imagine the open weave would make it quicker drying and give it a higher CFM than traditional fleece, perhaps making it relatively cooler without a shell, but warmer per weight under a shell given the high loft. I wonder if because of this it would have a wider useful temperature range. I just wish they made a version with a hood. @giachett let us know how this does in cold and wet, whether it dries noticeably faster, and what the useful temperature range is like.

    #3490729
    Christoph Blank
    BPL Member

    @chbla

    Locale: Austria

    Would be very interesting how this compares to R1 or rather R2 and also the Patagonia Thermal Hoodie.
    It is by the way very similar to the Noronna lofoten Alpha raw Zip Hoodie.
    I assume it is lighter than traditional fleece, but it would be interesting how it compares to higher loft fleece.

    Maybe Richard Nisley can post an opinion?

    #3490739
    Serge Giachetti
    BPL Member

    @giachett

    Locale: boulder, co

    Man, that Noronna looks really nice too. I bought the rab with %20 from campsaver, so it came in a little closer to $100.

    I’m leaving for a 9 day section on the sierra high route in a couple of days, and I’m considering bringing this, along with a borah vest or montbell ex-light.

    Without knowing for sure, I bet this is a touch colder than the R2 and a bit warmer than the R1. With a shell, its prob close to the r2, since the fleece is pretty lofty. Its tough to say on the resilience, but I’m sure its not the most durable fleece out there. Its extremely fluffy and airy and it feels like I could probably pull off chunks of fleece with my hands if I tried. I bet I’ll use it a lot and it’ll get a little matted down and worn out and I’ll just keep using it.

    I like how minimalist the design is though with no hand pockets and just a simple welded over chest pocket. The stretch fleece on the sides is also quite thin and light. I’ll let you know how it does on the SHR if I decide to take it, though I doubt there will be much moisture to contend with.

    #3492014
    Christoph Blank
    BPL Member

    @chbla

    Locale: Austria

    Any comments or opinions on the two jackets or the material?

    #3493371
    Serge Giachetti
    BPL Member

    @giachett

    Locale: boulder, co

    I brought the Alfa flash on my 8 day trip to the sierras and so far I’m really excited about the piece.

    My hiking buddy and I typically opt to sleep in and hike till after sunset, so we were usually on high ridges or passes right at sunset, which is when this piece came on. There was also a 5 inch snow storm with 20-30 degree temps when I wore this for most of the day. Otherwise, I was using it at camp under a montbell ex light anorak with light down pants. Temps dropped down to the low 20’s high teens at camp and I was happy with this combo wearing light down pants around camp.

    I’d usually put this on after working up a sweat coming up a long pass in the afternoon/eve just as I crested the pass. The material does a great job of wicking away moisture and drying up my baselayer. When I got to the pass, I’d add a breathable windshirt (Nike impossibly light, very high cfm) for the way down. When I got to camp, all my layers would be completely dry and I’d just add the extra light and a shell for camp and be happy.

    I wore this jacket less on the move than I thought I might, because it’s got decent warmth. It does dry fast, wick extremely well and have great breathability though, so it worked great for hiking on that cold stormy day. I hiked the top part of a pass, wearing it under my windshirt and down the other side under a shell as it snowed.  It was pretty darn perfect for that which tells me it’ll make a great shoulder season/winter piece. I also used it for breaks and just kept my puffy tucked away in my drybag. It provided just enough warmth for breaks, but also seemed to help dry me out.

    I typically bring a cap 4 weight hoody as a second base layer/mid combo. The cap 4 comes out more often on the move, but for about the same weight, this jacket adds a lot more warmth to my camp setup and also some extra insurance on the move for cold wet conditions. I’ll prob swap this in for colder trips. At 9 oz and full zip I’m pretty sure it does everything a microfleece does, but a bit better because of the extra warmth and better breathability. For cold winter, I’ll prob bring this in addition to my nano air, but on spring ski trips, I bet I’ll opt for this instead. Anyway, a bit long winded, but that’s how I see using it in my system. Great piece overall, esp for the weight. Try out the impossibly light jacket too. It’s the lightest most breathable windshirt I’ve found and it can be found for cheap on eBay. Cheers.

     

    #3493435
    Paul S
    BPL Member

    @pula58

    How do you think this would compare to R1 fleece?

    #3493441
    Serge Giachetti
    BPL Member

    @giachett

    Locale: boulder, co

    @paul S.

    I’ve only used an r1 a little bit, but I think this would be warmer, more breathable and lighter. There are probably less situations you would use this on the move though. Cold mornings and evenings, 20ish degree days and foul weather under a shell. This is also comfortable as a very cold weather baselayer.

    #3493458
    David Chenault
    BPL Member

    @davec

    Locale: Queen City, MT

    It’s a good time to be a backpacker, with all the fantastic insulation options out there.

    #3493539
    Christoph Blank
    BPL Member

    @chbla

    Locale: Austria

    Looking at the Noronna lofoten Alpha raw Zip Hoodie it seems as if the wanted to use as little Alpha as possible..

    #3513289
    Richard A
    BPL Member

    @antisana

    I’ve been looking at mid layers recently and the Alpha Flash, being unlined and shell-less, and weighing just 230g for 120g/m Alpha Direct, caught my eye. I’d been comparing it to another two Alpha offerings from Rab – the Alpha Flux (330g in L), which has a shell and uses 90g/m of Polartec’s ‘Direct” insulation, and the Paradox Pull-On (360g in L), which uses 60g/m of straight ‘Alpha” and has a polyester mesh liner and a polyester knit shell. I wrote to Rab asking for a comparison with the above, as well as wondering at how warmth and breathability would compare to their Hi-Loft Polartec offering, the Firebrand, and their reply was:

    “You are correct in thinking that the Flash will be the warmest & most breathable of those you mentioned. If you were to couple it with a wind top like the Boreas much of the breathability would be retained. The Firebrand is warmer than the Alpha Flash due to a higher loft & greater bulk of insulation therefore performance comparison is tricky. The Flash very much focus on lightweight, minimal bulk insulation in a highly breathable format”.

    As Bob Shuff mentioned above, my remaining concern would be whether the Alpha Flash would only be useful as a true mid layer (with some kind of shell on top) in cold weather; it’s breathability effectively making any claims to warmth redundant if worn as an outer layer in cool conditions? That and the questionable durability when compared to fleece…

    #3513292
    Richard A
    BPL Member

    @antisana

    Sorry, posted without actually formulating my question! What i’m now wondering is if whether something like the Alpha Flash could efficiently be used in different temperature ranges by interchanging it with different lightweight shells, whether a wind jacket or one of the various soft shells, utilising their different levels of breathability and weather protection as requires? It seems from the original poster that this may not work as the jacket is in itself too warm for warmer (or less frigid) temperatures, but if it is as breathability and loose knit as it seems, i’m wondering it that is indeed the case?

    #3514054
    Serge Giachetti
    BPL Member

    @giachett

    Locale: boulder, co

    Hey Richard,

    Those are good questions and actually a little hard to answer since everyone’s uses/body temperatures will differ so much. Though I will say I find the alpha flash really useful in a variety of different circumstances and specifically because of it’s breathability and warmth/weight.

    The breathability doesn’t negate the warmth in calm conditions, but when it’s windy and cold I will pair it with a breathable wind jacket (Nike impossibly light). I typically will throw on a windshell first over my base, so there are times that I’ve work this over my windshell too. The breathability and full zip  extends the useful range of the jacket. I keep this on longer than I would a normal fleece jacket.

    I often hike into the night, so that’s when this jacket has seen the most use. I also will often start off ski tours wearing this jacket, when my body has yet to warm up. For sustained uphill skiing above 20 degrees, this is usually too warm, but that depends on pack weight. In non frigid conditions, I’d also throw this on as a belay for short breaks and then keep it on while I warmed back up. In a snowstorm, it pairs wonderfully under a shell. In cold sustained rain I could see it going well under a shell as a base, but I haven’t used it this way.

    Basically, I think it’s one of those pieces that you’d need to try for yourself to find out what it’s ideal uses are. I’ve only owned mine since september, and I’ve gotten a ton of use out of it already. It’s come on about 9 backpacking trips from Sierra’s in Sept to maroon bells in winter to capitol reef and its been great both on the move and as part of my static warmth. For my style of adventuring, it’s pretty ideal for the colder months of the year, but I wouldn’t bother carrying it in CO summer.

     

    #3514119
    Brett Peugh
    BPL Member

    @bpeugh

    Locale: Midwest

    What is the durability of this?

     

    #3514392
    Mordecai _
    BPL Member

    @mocai

     

     

    http://www.millyardage.com/SearchResults.asp?Search=alpha&Submit=Search

    Thinking of trying a MYOG hybrid windshirt fleece with the lighter of the two options in the above link and argon 67. One layer of each. (I have the materials already)

    (Separate pieces are not feasible with my standard machine, would need a serger(?) to stitch the alpha direct, thus need the argon pinching edges of alpha for both sides of the stitches. On the positive side, this could save weight on closure system, one instead of two.)

    Hoping to use it as a reversible so the piece can be less insulative in windy more moderate temps with the alpha out. Or, put it over a base layer, alpha out, and rain shell on top to get two “chambers” of warmth for camp.

    Unsure whether it makes sense to make it a little baggier in the trunk, with closure of only the top half, or trimmer fit that opens all the way. Unsure of snaps vs zipper. Unsure if it might be worth it to substitute some strips of stretchy fabric, maybe along the sides under the arms, to get a trim fit.

    Anyway, general question:

    What else should I be thinking about?

    FWIW… I’m a novice sewer. I made a crude beanie in this manner to try it out. The fit is not right, and the seams are not finished correctly, but I think it could be close to 200-wt fleece in warmth, at less than half the weight. Breathability is reduced obviously. Hoping the reversibility can reduce some of the negative consequences of that. Skin feel of the argon is acceptable, to me at least, but that’s without sweat mixed in.

     

     

    #3514587
    Jeff McWilliams
    BPL Member

    @jjmcwill

    Locale: Midwest

    Mordecai,

    I emailed Thomas belmont at MillYardage a few months ago to inquire about the different Alpha fabric types and doing a project similar to yours.  (I haven’t pursued it further due to time constraints and other ongoing projects).

    I had asked whether the Alpha styles sold need to be sandwiched between two fabrics, because at least one of the styles says to sandwich it between layers of PowerShield Pro.

    He responed, “Style 4004 does not need to be sandwiched between two layers, and will only need one layer on the face.. it is designed to be used without a backer..  If the color they have at Mill Direct would work, I would suggest starting with that..”

    Please share the results of your project here or in the MYOG section.  I’d like to hear how it went, see photos, and maybe you can share what pattern you used, etc.

    The “lemon grass” in 4004 they have reminds me very much of the Outdoor Research Ascendant Hoody I saw on the closeout rack at REI about three weeks ago.  They had the Pewter/Lemongrass on sale for almost 50% off.  I should have grabbed one.  It’s a nice looking jacket.  The face fabric felt soft and breathable.  I’ve been doing some XC Skiing, and it seems like an Alpha jacket with a breathable face fabric would be a great “high output” insulating outer layer.

     

     

    #3514724
    Richard A
    BPL Member

    @antisana

    Serge,

    Thanks a lot for you reply, it’s really useful to hear some more detail about how it’s fitted into your various activities, conditions and clothing systems. It sounds like the Flash could be a good option for my uses, which are mostly hiking and mountaineering in temperatures that range from lows of about minus 10 degrees centigrade, to daytime highs that can be in the twenties (roughly, between 10 and 70 degrees Fahrenheit). Being on the equator, it’s not uncommon to have quite extreme temperature variation in a single day, and it seems like this piece might help me better manage that.

     

    #3514914
    Eric Blumensaadt
    BPL Member

    @danepacker

    Locale: Mojave Desert

    To me the lightest and warmest fleece is hollow fiber fleece.

    Anyone know what companies make this? I think Polarguard did.

    #3515341
    Richard A
    BPL Member

    @antisana

    Hi Eric,

    Patagonia uses “Regulator fleece” which is a hollow-core fibre in their various ‘R’ range of fleece jackets (R1, R2, R3). Polartec also produces a hollow fibre fleece called “Aircore” – Land’s End in the uk makes jackets using various weights of it. There is a thread about it here

    https://backpackinglight.com/forums/topic/72312/

    Adidas also made a hollow fibre fleece called the “Terrex Swift” using a branded fabric called “Thermolite”. They’ve since discontinued it but it still seems to be available online. REI lists it as weighing 15oz and, perhaps unfortunately, with 5% added spandex. I hadn’t heard about Thermolite – they seem to use a couple of different hollow fibre technologies; Sea to Summit use it for their fleece sleeping bag liners, but i haven’t seen anything particularly light.

    https://thermolite.com/en/Technologies-and-Innovations/THERMOLITE-Technologies/CORE

     

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