Mar 2, 2018 at 7:04 pm #3521851
With your help I have purchased my first fastpacking gear setup. The only thing left to purchase is stakes and guyline – which I do have a question about. Gatewood cape users do you use the lines that come with the gatewood cape or use your own guylines? I’m also open to stake suggestions.
Overall i I would like to see my base weight go down. I am considering a different sleeping pad like this one – https://www.gossamergear.com/collections/sleeping-pads/products/nightlight-sleeping-pad-torso-length
I’ve never used a pad this minimal so I’m not sure how much of a sacrifice it will be compared to the pad I currently have. The other purchase I am eventually going to make when I have the funds is an EE revelation quilt.
So here is my gear. Let me know what you think. – https://lighterpack.com/r/1mfuijMar 2, 2018 at 7:07 pm #3521852
Note: the clothing is considering I am going to be in colder weather – most of my trips will be in TN,KY,NC, etc
One other question I had was I am planning on using a running belt to hold my trekking poles, some food and my phone. So is this considering part of my base weight or not? as it will not be attached to my pack and the weight will not be on my shoulders.
Thanks againMar 2, 2018 at 7:35 pm #3521861Michael GillenwaterBPL Member
@mwgillenwaterLocale: Seattle area
When you say fastpack, are you planning on trail running for much or part of your trips? Your selection of pack indicates so. My comments assume someone that is mostly running.
quick suggestions as lighter options.
Use quilt for sleeping and drop half a pound
consider no cook. after a day of trail running and setting up camp, I’m OK with high calorie food, does not need to be cooked. I spend that time and energy washing up in a lake or stream.
bring a blood clotting bandage package, for that chance situation of a really serious fall with major blood.Mar 2, 2018 at 7:43 pm #3521864Monte MastersonBPL Member
@septimiusLocale: Changes Often
I assume the Kelty Cosmic is a 40 degree bag. Yea, that’s plenty heavy for sure. Even a synthetic EE 40* quilt would be much lighter, and it’s considerably cheaper than down.
You might consider the Klymit Inertia X-Lite for a torso pad. Much more comfort than the Nightlight. Weighs 5.9 oz.
Do you really need the Garmin Beacon/Tracker in Tennessee and Ky? 7.5 extra ounces is mighty heavy for an FKT setup.
You could switch to Esbit fuel cubes and cut a lot of weight. Get an Evernew EBY 265 ti 400 ml cup (1.7 oz)
The FAK might be a little overdone.
I’d go with 6 titanium shepherd hooks and 2 MSR groundhogs for stakes. If you end up camping on loose soil the groundhogs will give you more hold for your front and rear stakes.
EDIT: I agree with Michael, you don’t need the Leatherman. Your into fastpacking, not bushcraft.Mar 2, 2018 at 9:37 pm #3521890
Thanks guys for the replies so far.
I was planning using the leatherman for mainly the pliers to handle the hot pot when cooking and occasionally the scissors . The leatherman is the size of a stick of chap-stick but Im open to other options.
Im about to pull the trigger on that Klymit pad – Thanks Monte!
I guess Ill just use my thermorest for winter? or is that klymit that versatile?
Ive never cooked with Esbit but Im definitely going to research it now.
The Garmin is purely for my wife’s peace of mind as I will be doing most of my trips by myself and there are a lot of areas I go to that do not have any cell service.
I believe I only need 6 stakes for the gatewood cape – still trying to decide on stakesMar 2, 2018 at 9:51 pm #3521898
Esbit is so simple and easy. I think it fits in really well with fast and light setups.Mar 2, 2018 at 10:04 pm #3521903David ThomasBPL Member
@davidinkenaiLocale: North Woods. Far North.
“bring a blood clotting bandage package, for that chance situation of a really serious fall with major blood.”
or just a film canister of bentonite clay (I get the stuff by the 5-gallon bucket) – the active ingredient in those trauma bandages. Sprinkle it around the wound, rub it in, and on whatever you use as a dressing. The effect of the clay is impressive – in one trial vastly more lacerated pigs survived with the modern bandages than with old-school ones.
-1 on the Leatherman. There are lots of ways to pick up a pot (bandana, extra sock, purpose-built UL pot grabber). A 1″ x 2″ piece of chamois leather could (1) be a good pot-holder and (2) is THE best thing to clean eyeglasses and sunglasses.
Thermorest for winter plus at least a 1/8″ CCF pad. Or a thicker CCF (Ridgerest, Z-rest, etc). Both for the added R-value (some of which is from the additional weight-free air film between the pads) and as “belt & suspenders” should the inflatable get a hole or burn in it.
I haven’t found any guy line cordage (strong enough that I trust it) that is lighter than 130-pound-test Dacron fishing line (we have big fish up here). I can do a modified tautline hitch in it (a few more wraps) to make an adjustable knot. And I always travel with an extra 25 feet of it: bear/critter hang bag, super-duper repair thread, replacement shoelace, cloth line, lash sticks into a tent pole, etc. If your local fishing store only stocks wussy gear for trout and bass, PM me and I can send you some.Mar 2, 2018 at 10:28 pm #3521915Jerry AdamsBPL Member
@retiredjerryLocale: Oregon and Washington
Forget Esbit, your BRS-3000 is much more convenient and faster
But there are a lot of happy Esbit users out there, depends on how much cooking you do and how long you’re willing to wait, try both and see which you prefer
A full 110 g butane canister weighs more like 7 ounces : )Mar 3, 2018 at 1:39 am #3521983Ralph BurgessBPL Member
I think it’s a mistake to go too minimal on the pad. If you’re burning a lot of energy a good night’s sleep is even more important. If you go down to the short Neoair it’s only 8oz. You can put your pack under your feet.Mar 4, 2018 at 3:32 am #3522188
Still considering Esbit or an alcohol stove. Just trying to see how much weight it’s actually going to save vs the downsides of Esbit and also figuring out a whole Esbit setup with windscreen and everything.
Im going with the Klymit pad until it gets really cold again and then I’ll go back to the thermarest. The only things I’m trying to figure out is the stove situation and what stakes/guyline to buy. When I have the $$$ I’ll buy a quilt. With the Salomon peak 20 space is limited which is probably for the best since I am fastpacking.Mar 4, 2018 at 9:14 pm #3522318Greg FBPL Member
@gregfLocale: Canadian Rockies
All non-consumable weight counts as base weight that isn’t worn clothing so the weight of the running belt and phone would count towards it. Traditionally on this website poles aren’t counted in baseweight though. None of that really matters though unless you are trying to hit an arbitrary target or compare with someone else.
as for your list you have some potentially easy options and others that involve some sacrifice.
New Quilt – saves .75lbs big expense but big opportunity.
Net tent – consider ground sheet plus bug head net – saves 8 oz or Borah gear bug bivy saves 4 oz. both of these reduce the usable bug protected space.
inreach – leave behind but definately don’t bring it and a cell phone.
Cook Kit – 8oz Leave behind, though I have same set up and quite like having hot food and is worth the weight.
Base Layers – Leave behind, get rid of dude wipes, add small micro fiber towel. This saves 11 oz. Can you sleep without a base layer? Your bag gets dirtier but you can bathe in a creek to clean up before bed. On a single night trip I make this sacrifice for a more runnable sub 24 set up.
First aid – seems fat at 3.5oz, take it apart and decide if each piece is required and if the quality is correct, and you don’t have a substitute.
Given you have a 8-9lb kit, that compactly fits into a running pact the question becomes how many nights can you go and how much running / uptempo movement. And a what weight do you find you can’t run anymore? For me it’s 14lbs. So you can add 4 lbs of food and a 1l of water for a 2 day trip. Cutting wieght right now just extends the number of days.Mar 4, 2018 at 11:06 pm #3522334Monte MastersonBPL Member
@septimiusLocale: Changes Often
An Esbit titanium folding stove weighs 0.4 oz. You can make a windscreen out of an extra large disposable (aluminum) baking sheet from Walmart. Cut out a rectangle a 5″ X 16.” It will weigh about 0.7 oz. You can easily boil 20 oz water with a 0.5 oz cube, and you can blow the cube out and use what’s left (if any) later. Esbit (hexamine) emits more BTU per weight than anything else.Mar 5, 2018 at 12:07 am #3522352
“Still considering Esbit or an alcohol stove. Just trying to see how much weight it’s actually going to save vs the downsides of Esbit and also figuring out a whole Esbit setup with windscreen and everything.”
Esbit Downsides: 1] It smells like rotten fish when you open up a 14g tablet. 2] It can leave some sticky black stuff on your pot. 3] It’s not as fast as isobutane
Esbit Solutions: 1] Use 4g tablets (they stink less, dunno why, maybe because of packaging). 2] Use 4g tablets (dunno why they seem to leave less residue). 3] I do other stuff while it is silently simmering away.
Good article on 4g Esbit Tablets. I use a stove/burner like the one he is using.
The stand Monte links to works well but I prefer my Caldera Cone or a wire mesh stand from QiWiz or Zelph depending on which setup I’m using on a particular trip. You’ll have to email Zelph to ask if he has mesh available right now because it’s not listed on his site. Zelph’s mesh is slightly lighter than QiWiz’s.
You can use some heavy-duty foil for a windscreen or order one from QiWiz or Toaks. I like the Toaks windscreen because it’s the thinest Ti foil I’ve seen. The QiWiz stuff is thicker and more durable. Here is a kit I put together for my hiking partner.
I’m really enthusiastic on the topic of Esbit. I’m happy to talk your ear off about it. I think I have 5 different Esbit setups (I should probably ditch a couple of them but I like having setups to loan out to friends).
How much weight will it save? You are leaving the canister and stove at home and replacing those with ~1 ounce of stove, stand and windscreen. Then figure 8 grams of fuel per 1.5 cup boil.Mar 5, 2018 at 12:44 pm #3522449john hansfordBPL Member
The main problem with Esbit is that you get to a resupply town, and no one sells any. Plenty of canisters and alcohol though. So.. two stoves?
OP doesn’t say how long he’s out for.Mar 5, 2018 at 1:30 pm #3522451
I could be wrong but I think he’s a weekend trail runner.Mar 5, 2018 at 11:38 pm #3522540
Yes mainly weekend and the occasional 2 night trip.
Just messaged you Matthew on Esbit setup advice. Also started following you on Instagram 👍🏼Mar 6, 2018 at 1:59 pm #3522660Link .BPL Member
. STICKS BLOG has several posts on lightweight esbit setups with tests he has performedApr 15, 2018 at 3:23 pm #3530517Bri WBPL Member
That’s funny you put the Protec Orb Mini in there. I just saw that itty bitty foot massager yesterday at my local running shop and the first thing I thought was, “That would be perfect for fastpacking!” Haha definitely a “luxury item” though. Unless you have painful scar tissue problems, is it really necessary to bring along for these short trips? Maybe instead promise yourself some extra foam rolling time when you get home!
The shelter/poncho idea is definitely versatile. I did that for two overnighters with the Sea-To-Summit equivalent (only used it as a ground sheet one night and as a shelter another night; only wind, no rain), and I found I preferred a bivy. After running all day with a pack, the last thing I want to do is hunt for a sleeping spot where my stakes will work and then actually set up the shelter. Having said that, a shelter is nicer than a waterproof bivy in the rain because you can change into dryer clothes more easily underneath it…unless your bivy has excess room and you are super flexible. However, if it’s raining and you’re wearing your poncho, will you have to get wet in order to turn it into a shelter? If there’s a way to do this without getting wet, I’d practice it a few times in the rain before going out.
Regarding the Salomon SLab Peak 20, if you haven’t already done it, cut out that inner dividing shelf material (really pointless in my opinion), cut the excess straps (maybe it’s because I’m smaller, but I’ve found Salomon puts so much strappage on their packs), and remove the back pad and replace it with your new folded-up Klymit pad slightly inflated (or if you get a CCF pad for added winter insulation, use that pad).
Also, regarding the pad, you obviously have no insulation where the holes are on the Klymit pad, so if you get a quilt, you might be cold. Maybe consider an UL sleeping bag system instead of a quilt, like Nunatak’s half bag (“elephant foot”) and down jacket. I’m a cold sleeper, though.
I personally do the “cold cook” method, and sometimes the cold soak method if I’m craving ramen. I tried the Esbit foldable stove, a DIY Ti foil windscreen, and a DIY Ti lid for my Ti pot, and it worked okay for some trips. I found that when it was windy, even with my windscreen it was difficult to keep the water warm for long. Also, as others have mentioned, it stinks and leaves gunk on your pots, which I would have to clean along with my dishes because I didn’t want it attracting animals. Mostly I stopped bringing along a stove because I hate to do dishes. I’m usually cold at camp and really don’t want to handle water. So now I usually bring bars, packaged puréed food (kinda like baby food!), and any high-calorie/fat/protein foods that don’t require cooking. If you’re a coffee drinker, I bring the iced coffee Starbucks Via packets. And if you have room in your pack and really feel like cold soaking, the collapsible mug or bowl (“Go Container” by sea-to-summit) works really well for that purpose, but DON’T LEAVE IT OUT overnight unwashed because the squirrels will chew right through that rubber material! :)
have fun and stay safe!Apr 15, 2018 at 3:56 pm #3530527Bri WBPL Member
One more thing someone reminded me of …I had initially recommended a down bag above because I assumed that’s what you were planning on using, but I’ve been converted into a synthetic lover recently for fastpacking. Idk what your region is like as far as moisture goes, but synthetic will stay warmer when wet than down, and if it’s raining and you’ve been wearing your poncho and then you turn it into a shelter, chances are, it’s probably already soaked (and so are you from sweat!). While heavier, the synthetic option might be better. I also am a big fan of vapor barrier liners for sleeping, but this might be overkill if you don’t run cold or you live in more humid areas. Ultimate Direction has new non-breathable waterproof (AKA VBL) rain pants and jacket that I’ve recently acquired. If you ended up ditching the shelter for something else, this might be an option for both rain AND VBL sleep gear.
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