Mosquito Beater?

Both times I’ve been to the Winds the mosquitoes were not that bad. I don’t think I saw any at all in late August. Maybe you should go to the Winds in late August instead of high mosquito season.

That’s an idea, too, but there are various family obligations that sort of direct me to late July/early August.  ;)

Mosquitoes haven’t bothered me too much in the Winds, but I have a friend of friend who lives in Bozeman and believes that the Winds are the worst place he’s ever backpacked for mosquitoes. And, I was watching someone’s YouTube videos from the Winds and the mosquitoes were obvious.

Thank you!

Insect Shield treat your clothing

Haven’t had a tick or been bothered by mosquitoes in the last 15 years of camping in the SE US. Lasts for 70+ washings.

If you are not a fan of DEET, Consumer Reports has done testing and they say some repellents with Lemon Eucalyptus or Picaridin perform similar to DEET.  I’ve had good luck with Natrapel wipes, but they only scored a 1/5 in CR’s testing.  Following are non-DEET products that tested better:

5/5
Repel Lemon Eucalyptus Insect Repellent2 Pump
Sawyer Premium Insect Repellent Pump
Cutter Lemon Eucalyptus Insect Repellent Aerosol

4/5
Natrapel Lemon Eucalyptus Insect Repellent Pump
Off Family Care Insect Repellent VIII with Picaridin
Natrapel Tick & Insect Repellent Aerosol
Natrapel Lemon Eucalyptus Insect Repellent Aerosol
Off Defense Insect Repellent I with Picaridin

https://www.consumerreports.org/health/insect-repellent/buying-guide/

Thank you for the information!

nylon pants; nylon sun shirt (perhaps treat the shirt with permethrin, even a light coat); sun grubbies with Deet but that’s not necessary; a rain shell for camp; wide spaced head netting.

Deet gives me a headache  so I only use it sparingly if at all. Wide spaced head net is better for seeing  the world. And there’s this:

https://www.sunprecautions.com/product/48100

That drape can be velcroed  up over your nose . With sun glasses, your face neck and ears are protected  without using a headnet.  The drape hangs loose off your skin and anyway the material can’t be bitten through. Again it can be  treated with permethrin.

So clothing alone can protect you from mosquitos very well.

I agree clothing is the best solution, although sometimes I use DEET – it doesn’t bother me

Once, I was eating oatmeal but the bugs were so bad I had to have headnet on at all times.  I forgot about it and tried to put a spoonful of oatmeal in but forgot about the headnet – spoonful of oatmeal didn’t make it into my mouth.  Good for a laugh.

DEET is a petroleum product. For me it ruined plastics, paint, rain jacket, burns my eyes, numbs my lips, and makes my skin feel oily. Picaridin for skin a permithrin for gear have none of the drawbacks DEET has. It is an excellent repellent and it kills bugs that contact it, but it’s not toxic to humans. DEET never worked on blackflies in Maine. Don’t know if permithrin does. By the way, at a lake high up in the NH mtns, the mosquitos were so voracious that DEET didn’t stop them. DEET did fine in Louisiana and Florida. Just my 2 cents worth

I’ve never heard of that product, but I have used Pic coils even on backpacking trips. I’ll take a few 3-4 inch pieces of coil, wrapped in a bit of aluminum foil. To burn them I create a fire pit – no vegetation, or use a flat rock. I put the pic coil piece in a large binder clip, so that it stays up off the ground and can burn all the way through. I do keep an eye on it while it burns; they do get hot enough to potentially start a fire. I’m usually burning it during or after dinner. If it hasn’t burned all the way through I’ll extinguish it thoroughly so that I can touch the burned end, totally cool. These are nice for when in camp. While I hike, I either am totally covered, or if it’s just too hot, I’ll use Deet.  I find that Deet works on all mosquitoes, but not at all on blackflies or horse flies.

I’ve hiked a good  amount in  hellacious mosquito conditions. I use poles,  so the backs of my hands are exposed to the l’il basta…devils. the worst mistake I ever made mosquito wise was not bringing mosquito proof gloves of some sort. I can’t/won’t have my hands covered in Deet when I’m eating breakfast, lunch and dinner. Spritzing Deet or permethrin on Sun Grubby type gloves works for me, because I can remove the gloves and rinse my hands in water (NOT a river or lake) before eating. Anyway, that trip  where the itching on the backs of my hands kept me awake all night ensured that I would never again leave my hands exposed when all else is covered.

I’ve noticed the same thing, DEET doesn’t work on flies

Does Picaridan work on flies?

I’ve noticed the same thing, DEET doesn’t work on flies

Does Picaridan work on flies?

Both should repel mosquitoes, biting flies, ticks, fleas, and chiggers.

Just looking at both quickly, both are synthetic repellents that work about equally.  DEET seems to affect the aboves bugs sensory receptors while Picaridin is a synthetic mimic of pepper.

Lots of DEET is unpleasant (kinda oily), plus it can dissolve nylons, etc..  at high concentrations… so maybe that’s why Picaridin is leading in some countries.  DEET has more safety studies though, despite a bad rap being confused with DDT or has been around for decades where people misuse it (like a rash of people drinking it in the ‘80s apparently).  Assuming no allergic reaction the choice is the consumers.

There are other flies out there like the common Crane fly that doesn’t bite (doesn’t have a mouth in fact).

Picaradin works on flies for me.  One trip this spring was timed perfectly with a fly hatch (watching them come out of the ground like a sci fi movie).   Nylon clothes + permethrin kept them off the covered bits.  Picaradin kept them off my head and hands.   I gave away all my deet years ago after it ruined a pair of glasses.  I’ve heard it can foul tent floors too.

I can tell you that Deet will not help you with our Alaskan black flies. Not one whit. I also found that it did not work on larger biting flies on the TRT and in the Bob Marshall wilderness. Flies love me. I have tried everything – permethrin on clothing, Picaridin and Deet and nothing I have tried keeps flies away from me. I have to keep completely covered and even then they find ways to bite me. I’ll take mosquitoes any day over other biting flies!

There are these flies in the Cascades.  Maybe they’re midges.  Like in July.

When I have DEET on, it has no affect, the flies just bite me.

I resort to long pants, long shirt, head net.  I could put my hands in my pockets or just watch them and swat off any bugs.

The problem is eating and drinking.  And bugs in my food.

Permethrin didn’t stop them?!  Wow, that’s the nuclear option.  We have deer, horse, stable and black flies, skitters and midges and it’s always worked on them all for me.   I do a refresh treatment if I know the pressure will be biblical, maybe that helps

I wear light cycling gloves which helps keep bites off the hands

“I wear light cycling gloves which helps keep bites off the hands”

Yep.

First, I want to thank everyone for their responses – this has been great!

Second, here’s a summary of everything. We applied a good amount of Mosquito Beater to our yard for my daughter’s graduation party a couple of days ago – and we weren’t impressed. So, that’s off the board.

There seems to be an equal amount of support for permethrin and picaradin. I used to perform pesticide risk assessments, so I’ll look more closely at them. I do use DEET when I have to use something, but I don’t enjoy it because of how it damages some of my plastic items.

I also wear a long-sleeved shirt most of the time in the mountains, mostly for sun exposure. But, I also sweat – a lot! – and I typically rinse my shirt out each evening, so I’m not fond of the idea of soaking my shirt in an insecticide and then washing that in a lake or stream, and harming insect (non-mosquito) larvae.  And, I’ve been wearing sun gloves (like bicycle gloves) for several years, too. But, when I’m sitting around making supper, yeah, that’s the worst time for the mozzies.

Anyway, thank you all and I’ll continue on!!!

Tim

…I typically rinse my shirt out each evening, so I’m not fond of the idea of soaking my shirt in an insecticide and then washing that in a lake or stream, and harming insect (non-mosquito) larvae.

That’s not how Permethrin works.  You can wash the clothes right after treating if you want; they’ll still keep the bugs at bay.  Good for “six weeks or six washings,” or so they say.  Professionally treated clothes usually claim something higher, maybe 70 to 90 washings.

I don’t understand the chemistry, but it seems preferable to slathering nasties directly on my skin multiple times per day, both for my own health and that of any lakes/streams I happen to cool off in.

just to be clear

permethrin should be applied to clothing and let dry before your trip

for ticks this is useful – they normally crawl on the clothes until it finds some skin, but not if clothes are treated with permethrin

for mosquitoes, the clothes already protect you from mosquitoes.  You need protection on untreated skin like hands and face, but your clothes aren’t there so the permethrin doesn’t help.  Maybe the permethrin odor drifts from your clothes to adjacent skin?  If your clothes were loose weave like netting that mosquitoes could get through, then permethrin treatment could help with that?

the [untreated] clothes already protect you from mosquitoes

That’s overstating the case in my experience.  Skeeters can bite through almost any clothing hikers like to wear on a warm day.  The wrinkles and folds do reduce the attack surface a bit, but not completely.

Tim, I share your concern about rinsing my permethrin sprayed clothes in lakes, as it can harm fish.  It’s durable but it’s a spray application and not locked into the fiber.  I spray my shirt, pants, upper socks that stick out of the boots and outside top of my hat

I’ve found their 6 washes guidance to be exaggerated.  Bugs walk all over the shirt long before that where they jump off instantly when the application is new (and dry).  I reapply after 2 or 3 washes or 6 weeks, whichever comes first, but then I also rinse the shirt in between which may reduce life of the application.

I also sweat buckets and wring out my shirt from it.  So what I do is bring a gallon ziploc and at the end of the day, wring out my shirt, put it in the ziploc, and rinse it in the bag using 1L filtered water and dumping it > 200feet away from water sources.  Works great.  I use filtered water since lake water can start to stink much more quickly.   I don’t bother rinsing the permethrin treated pants but that’s also doable in the ziploc in the same way.

The ziploc doubles as my sink for washing socks and underwear using campsuds, and stores my wet swedish cloth used as my personal cleaning cloth.

Todd – good point

I wear supplex pants and shirt and I don’t think any bug can bite through it.  I can’t think of mosquito bites I’ve got through the fabric.

But, maybe bugs can bite through

If clothes are treated with permethrin, you’ll be protected from crawling bugs like ticks, and maybe some protection from flying bugs like mosquitoes.

It’s easy to apply permethrin.  After it’s dried there’s little risk to health.  May as well do it.

I think if you get liquid permethrin on your skin, the risk is skin irritation, not cancer or anything.

I’m not fond of the idea of soaking my shirt in an insecticide and then washing

Agreed. I use repellent frequently in mosquito season, so I wanted something a little gentler, both for my skin and the water table. Botanical mosquito repellent (lemon eucalyptus oil) works for me and my mosquitoes (but YMMV). Usually a light spray on collar and cuffs is sufficient, head net when appropriate.

I use Permethrin on shoes/boots, gaiters, and pant cuffs. I use spray (not soaked or InsectShield/BugsAway) because I really don’t want the stuff on my skin in large amounts. Somehow I can’t wrap my head around the vision of “100% safe neurotoxin”. It’s necessary for the ticks, but I don’t use any more than necessary.

(I know that Permethrin is supposedly safe for human skin when dry, so perhaps I am being overly cautious. I avoid unnecessary exposure to pesticides in general. We will know more about it in a few decades.)