Intermittent Fasting

[Arthur]

I’m old enough to see just a few diets come and go.  Name a few, “Reach for a Lucky Strike instead of a Sweet”, Grapefruit, Tapeworm, Weightwatchers, Slimfast, Dexatrim, Weightwatchers again with Oprah, Atkins, South Beach, and 20 more that came out of Hollywood.  And how could i forget the “low fat” craze that still seems to surface with all its high sugar foods.   While the IF diet is getting some good press and some preliminary medical validation, there are still what we used to call in public health “large series of one” statements out there.  Loosing weight to a healthy point is good for 100 different bodily functions (except for the mentioned clothing cost!), but the REAL diet is the one that becomes a lifestyle and can become adapted to everyday life for decades.  I think the IF has potential, but so did a lot of the above mentioned when they became popular and then proved unsustainable for any number of reasons.  People on this forum are not typical and are mostly able to tolerate the intolerable longer than the general population. Lots of tough people here.  I am really interested in how this latest experiment progresses.

[AK Granola]

Arthur, how could you forget the Scarsdale diet? I lost 20 pounds in two weeks on that one! It was basically no food, but well packaged and marketed to suckers. I think a few people died trying that one. I then stayed slim for 15 years, by not overeating. Pregnancy and the demands of career plus child rearing changed that mindfulness about food and prevented adequate exercise. I could stand to lose 20 pounds at this point.

Yeah, most of these diets are a crock; they worked because people stopped over indulging in whatever foodstuff made them chubby to begin with. Some diet habits are distinctly unhealthy, like daily soda pop. But there’s a wide range of national and cultural diets (as opposed to reducing diets) that can keep you healthy, which may involve bananas, gluten, eating three squares, high carb, low carb, meat, no meat, dairy, no dairy. My grandparents came from Denmark, and always ate their Danish food and lived long healthy slim lives. Cream, butter, buttermilk, meats, smoked meats, fish, pickled vegetables, beer, wine, Aquavit, lots of rye bread and pastries, and and still lived to their mid 80s. My grandpa smoked those brown unfiltered cigarettes too; I’ll never forget how their house smelled like those cigs.

A few years back some clinical studies were being done at, I think, UCLA, to test the effect of fasting on cancer cell growth. I don’t remember any major news coming out, so maybe not a successful study? Without some solid studies, which doesn’t  mean how it works for you but instead means well designed scientific research, it’s all just anecdotes. But most of BPL is just all our anecdotes. If fasting helps you hike, do it. I’d be cratered on the uphill side of the trail.

I don’t have the patience for a fad diet. I just focus on eating vegetables and fruits, and much smaller portions, and eventually the weight goes. Wish I had time for a big through hike, that muffin top would be gone in no time!

 

 

[Jerry Adams]

There are studies that link obesity to cancer.  Fat cells produce hormones that help cancer cells or something.

I tried restricting diet to 10 AM to 6 PM.  I was like high in the morning until I ate at 10 AM.  It was tolerable if there was something to be gained.

Now I eat oatmeal at 6 AM, then eat between 10 AM and 6 PM.  I could lose 5 or 10 pounds.

[Arthur]

Karen, forgot Scarsdale.  i was working 80-100 hours a week then and never read a newspaper.  (remember newspapers?) And of course, i was walking up hill both ways in the snow!

[Mark]

I am a little late to this thread as I am a newish to BPL, but IF (and keto) are fascinating subjects in relation to hiking and backpacking for me.  I have no medical training so this is my personal observational evidence, however I think there are major benefits of fasting and long distance hiking/backpacking.

Background:

• I have been predominantly keto for 4 years so I am fat-adapted.  This is strictly for the potential neurological preservation benefits (as you age) with ketones having a significant effect on cognitive function.  (It was developed and still used as a control for epilepsy).
• I do carb-cycle when extreme anaerobic physical exertion is required.
• I have lost 30kg / 65+ lbs through intermittent fasting.  I followed a strict protocol of fasting from 8pm on night of day 1, for 34h and breaking fast at 6am of day 3.  Then eating normally for 14h and repeating.  If you are over 45 like me this is a very simple and safe way to lose a lot of weight.

It may seem difficult but as with anything it takes practice and it becomes much easier.  Fasting is a natural process for your body, with hundreds of millions of people performing this every year.

>> I can say that being lighter (me) and lighter (my pack: base weight approx 5.5kg for autumn in the Alps) allows me to enjoy hiking/backpacking much more!

>> Being strict keto whilst backpacking is a challenge as fats go rancid quickly, so I am not too concerned on a multi-day trip. However I do fast!

Experimentation

I now predominantly follow an 16:8 or 18:6 protocol but there are major benefits from Autophagy (intra-cellular repair/recycling of bad proteins etc) which take effect after approx 20h, so I regularly (weekly/monthly) perform 36, 48, 72h fasts.

So now I am experimenting with hiking during longer fasts.  I live in the Swiss Alps so everything is up/down several 000m/ft of elevation.

• I am quite happy to hike 30km+ on day 3 of a fast with little or no impact on my speed or overall performance.
• I generally feel much better exercising on an empty stomach.
• The ketone production which is quite high at this point, keeps me cognitively sharp.
• The ketone production, preserves the muscle mass so you are tapping into the 10000s of calories of fat that we all carry.  Yes I lose weight as fat but not muscle (I check this daily though my body scanner)

>> And from a backpacking light perspective: if I want to, then I can carry much less food during a trip.  (Going to bed hungry after a long hiking day does take some practice though)

The other thing that I have noticed (and need to research) is that I can, if needed, drink far less water.  I think this is more associated with the fat-adaption and metabolising fats for body water as needed.  Curious as to others experiences of water need –  many people dry fast whilst performing strenuous work, so the body must have a short-term compensation mechanism?

[AK Granola]

I know people are being successful on keto and with IF, but I’m just not willing to be the guinea pig in an uncontrolled experiment. Harvard health lists potential side effects including kidney and liver problems, constipation, mood swings, fuzzy thinking, and nutrient deficiency. I have none of those problems now, why would I risk it?  I’m trying the ski every day and eat more veg and fruit method right now; I’ll keep you posted on progress. Plus, I need to save my kidneys and liver to process the wine I drink as part of my mediterranean diet. Maybe we need a BPL weight loss challenge!

[Ryan Jordan]

I’m with Karen. There are risks I still don’t understand.

But the neurological and autophagy benefits are becoming more and more substantiated with good research.

Will be interesting to see how this evolves over the next 2 decades.

+1 for the Mediterranean diet!

[PaulW]

Mark,
My overall experience with keto and IF echoes yours. Although I’m not on a strict keto diet, I’ve been practicing fasting for 30 years, and started on a low carb path just a few years ago. Since doing so, I’ve found that my whole metabolism has changed, especially in regard to exercise. I can hike farther, while eating and drinking far less, than I ever could before. At my yearly physical, the doctor always praises me for being in great health, and doesn’t believe I’m doing any harm by having adopted this eating strategy. And, as you mentioned, I feel very cognitively sharp while fasting. Regarding your comment about fats going rancid, I bring nuts. As long as they’re somewhat fresh before I leave on a trip, I don’t have issues. I’ve had them last weeks, although I usually eat them before then. They’re a staple of my diet.
One aspect of this that fascinates me is how much less water I consume now. I’m sure you’re right that has to do with the metabolizing of fats. I too would like to hear other’s experiences here.
This is interesting stuff.

[Mark]

Who is taking the greater risk?  Why I follow IF and Keto

• quality of life as you age
• Prevention is better than cure

Fasting is a lifestyle

• After approx 20h, Autophagy – the intra-cellular recycling starts
• Autophagy is a key component in “bad protein” recycling linked to dementia and alzheimers
• reduces blood sugar and insulin levels
• can reverse T2 diabetes etc.

Keto is a nutrition tool

• Elevates ketones
• Fat adaptation – burn fat whilst maintaining lean muscle mass
• reduces inflammation
• reduces blood sugar/ insulin
• mental clarity is extraordinary – you have to try it to understand

together

• performance – for low impact aerobic activity like backpacking I can walk faster, longer, do not need to stop for lunch, carry less food and water

I check my blood bio markers every 6-12 months. Since I have been Keto/IF all my markers are back to normal. No longer have irritable bowel, no longer have knee pain!

For me though the four keys are

1. Fast
2. eat real foods
3. sleep well
4. exercise

whichever diet you follow just cut the sugar and eat whole foods

we shall see in 20 years if we remember!

[Brad W]

Been doing IF 22/2 and keto for over 3 years. Works great for hiking. I can do 20 miles fasted without issue. I have bonked on some long high output hikes while fasted-this isn’t fun. Outpacing your fat conversion speed will lead to this.

[Author]

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