Four people a mid?

[Tjaard Breeuwer]

Hi,

I am looking for a (winter) tent for my family.
This would include winter camping, so quite large sleeping bags. 4 “L” size thermarest pads. 2 “long” sleeping bags, 2 regular.

I was hoping to find pics or experiences of using the MLD Supermid with 4 people.

Are you able to avoid touching the wall with head or foot/the side people?

I am actually looking at the Liteway Pyraohm Max, but it has similar dimensions to the Supermid, except taller.

https://liteway.equipment/shelters/rypaomm-max-tarp

Right now, we use a Golite Hex3, plenty of room with 3, especailly if we use an inner net.

[David Thomas]

I find the Black Diamond Mega Lite pyramid to be okay for 4 adults in the summer when you’re all just glad to be under cover instead of out in the weather.

I’d find it on the small side for a family of 4 while winter camping because of how long you stay in a tent in the winter with short days.

If you can set it up on packed snow, at least you can dig down for more headroom (bring a taller pole or a saw to cut one) and to get more height around the edges, but it’s hard to count on those snow conditions in advance.

I know it’s not as UL as possible, but we’ve brought two shelters sometimes, putting the kids in one and us in the other and that left lots of room for gear and leaving the kitchen set up between uses.  At least mids are pretty darn light for the floor space they give you.

[Chad Lorenz]

http://maxneale.blogspot.com/2016/08/the-best-ultralight-tent-hyperlite.html

 

Max compares it to the Supermid…

[Tjaard Breeuwer]

Chad, I had read Max’ review of the Ultramid. I forgot whether he got much into the Supermid.

Unfortunately all he says is: “detrimentally smaller”.

The problem with published sizes for mids if of course, how high above the ground are the pitched, and how much due you lose to the nearly horizontal edges.

Here is published specs for them:

Ultramid: 111”x 111”x 75” tall

Supermid: 112” x 112” x 69” tall

Pyraomm: 109” x 109” x 73” tall

Hex 3 : 106” x  92” x 66” tall (not sure how BPL  arrives at those measurements, it’s a symmetrical hexagon, so length and width should be the same)

@Davidinkenai, I see what you mean.  I am fine with crammed together, and don’t mind less space inside. We don’t normally cook inside, and most tents that are big enough to do that with 4 people would be to big  to fit in most sites.

I do want enough space to prevent the sleeping bags touching the tent, where they will get wet.

I don’t need to be ultralight, but winter gear is heavy enough as it is. Then there is the hassle of setting up a tent in winter. That makes 2 tents a no go for me.

Our snow in Minnesota is also to shallow and faceted (suggary) to dig down for extra space.

I would also hope to take it spring snow camping out west in future though.

Basically, the Ultramid sounds right up my alley, until you get to the price.

I am fine with a tiny bit more weight, but was want to stick  faith  instead of silnylon, to reduce sagging.

Unfortunately, there are few silpoly Mids out there, this was the only one I found. If it was a few inches bigger, I’d grab it right away.

 

Anyway, still hoping someone has some pics or stories of 4 large sleeping bags in a Supermid.

[Brad Rogers]

I’ve used the Golite Shangri-la 5 for 4 people.   I think Oware has a 10×10 mid that might be a bit bigger then the others.

[Chad Lorenz]

Have you considered a Mondomid? If you do go with sil, it looks like a roughly 6oz weight penalty for vastly more room. Requires a bigger footprint of course. Ron makes custom inners for them as well.

No direct experience with the Supermid. I’ve slept many months under a BD Mega Light (it’s what I use for work) and I’ve only rarely been bold enough  to use it for four average adults, with or w/o the mega bug inner. When pitched low in foul weather, it’s  too tight  IMHO.

I’ve had 4 adults in modified BD megas with more success: one with perimeter netting (reduced splash, allowed for a slightly higher pitch) and one franken-mid, where we cut the top 2/3 off of  an old inner and stitched it directly to the fly.

I’m always on the hunt for a better mid, so am interested in what you end up going with.

[Jason McSpadden]

I have no personal experience with these tents but the pyramids from Seek Outside with a stove look nice for winter. https://seekoutside.com/hot-tent-combos/

[Mole J]

What about Oware pyramids?!

My 9×9 is taller than a Supermid I think, so steeper sides mean more room.

It’s about 2oz heavier than my Golite Hex3.

[Rob P]

I would look at some of the Seek Outside Mids…The Redcliff would be very comfy for four and you can get it silnylon or DCF.  It would also have room for a stove, even with four people.

[Tjaard Breeuwer]

Oops, I see I had a typo in my second post, where I meant to say:

I want to get something in Silpoly.

I have always struggled with the sagging in nylon tents. In a Mid, where the lower walls are already so close to you, that is an even bigger issue. Also for winter use, where you need to maintain a tight pitch to resist snow loading.

DCF is rather exorbitantly priced for my amount of use. And, although light weight and no stretch are huge plusses, the packed size and stickiness for snow, and lack of stretch for less perfect set ups,  are negatives that make the extreme price hard to swallow for me. (I have a DCF hammock tarp that is great. There are certainly benefits, just don’t see pro vs con adding up to the price for me here).

Silpoly seems like the best option for my case here: low wet stretch, supple, small packing with little adhered snow, forgiveness in pitching, reasonable price.

So that is what had me looking and found that Pyraomm Max.

 

I looked at the Oware mids. Certainly I like the taller height, and the options for larger sizes (in general I agree, a few inches extra in a mid are worth the small increase in weight for 4 person livability). Besides silnylon vs silpoly, I shied away from them for lack of mid panel tie outs and top vents.

The MLD Mondomid Does not seem appealing to me (for my winter use). It is only 72′ or 71″ tall (depending on wether you use the metric or imperial measurements). That is quite low for such a huge floor size, so very low angle walls. Great for wind resistance, but poor for snow shedding and interior, livable, space. Adding to that the challenge of finding a site to fit such a large tent. And of course, Silnylon.

For my use, a slightly smaller footprint, with steeper sidewalls is better. If you want to shelter a group out on the plains, , and want lots of covered space, it is probably a great design.

The Seek Outside I also looked at. I have a friend who has one with a stove jack.

Again, aside from the Silnylon, the weight starts to get high, and the octagon floor makes for difficult set up. I notice that with my Hex now (12 sided): much harder to set  up, because you can not simply tension out opposing corners  as you stake them out before set up. I see the benefits for tighter pitch and better wind resistance though.

 

[Brad Rogers]

You may have a real short list if you want SilPoly.

[Tjaard Breeuwer]

@mocs123 , yep. not many silpoly tents out there (yet).

Hence the list narrowed down to the Pyraomm. A list of 1 is long enough for me ;-)

It checks all my boxes: top vents, decent weight, silpoly fabric, steep walled design, mid panel and mid corner guy outs.

My one worry with that tent was trying to get sense of how tight/roomy it fits 4 people. Floor size is not a very reliable space indicator in Mids.

So that is why I was asking for pics or experiences of 4 people in a Supermid.

@Lotuseater ?

The review here on BPL doesn’t actually show that, nor does the one on Outdoorgearlab.

I really wish tent makers and reviewers would show a picture of the appropriate number of people inside sleeping bags in their tent. I.e. 4 in this case.

Tarptent does a good job listing floor size of a certain height.

Liteway does have a picture of 4 regular sized pads, with of course fits (inner tent is 240cm/95″ wide/long).

https://www.instagram.com/p/CB4yiL6F4Dq/

But the big question is, once humans in sleeping bags are on those pads, how much are they touching the walls?

 

[Tjaard Breeuwer]

I measured the stock inner tent of my Hex 3 (which is about the same diameter as the outer tent, which is one reason I don’t use it)  and it measures about 108″ across the hexagon.

[Mole J]

I had a Silpoly (RBTR 1.1oz) shelter with big panels some years ago. – Trekkertent Drift 2.

We used it 20 nights. Only a couple in freezing temps.

Yes, Silpoly doesn’t sag as much when wet. Or absorb water.   But large panels certainly still bow inwards in the wind due to elastic stretch of the fabric. I’d imagine snow load will be similar.

Maybe it is design, but I find the Tarptent Stratospire2 we bought to replace it, has less sag and stretch.

Also, there is the strength difference to consider.

 

 

Oware offer  midpanel tieouts. But sadly not vents.

To be honest I’m not sure how effective a vent is. Conditions definitely override a cent easily enough anyhow. Though I’ve only ever used my Oware mid with 2 of us.

[Dave @ Oware]

“I looked at the Oware mids. Certainly I like the taller height, and the options for larger sizes (in general I agree, a few inches extra in a mid are worth the small increase in weight for 4 person livability). Besides silnylon vs silpoly, I shied away from them for lack of mid panel tie outs and top vents.”

The Pyramid tarps come with tie out points on the side panels about 1/3 of the way up. I offer additional tie out points anywhere you need for $4 each.

I have made some Mid’s with vents, it adds a lot to the price and experience hasn’t yet shown that they help with condensation, which is mitigated anyway by the steep pitch the walls. Major condensation runs down the walls and off the hem due to surface tension. As far as cooking inside, I have no idea about CO buildup but don’t recommend cooking in any closed up shelter as a general practice.  The zipper on the Oware mids has a second slider that runs from the top down so one can open the zipper partly at the top.

On the Outward Bound winter courses I used to instruct, we put 4 people to a 9×9 mid, but it was crowded. The Alpine Skills institute puts 4 in an 8×8 but used a large snow trench beneath for the needed room. An 11 x11′ mid will sleep 4 with lots of room to spread out or you can sleep 6. If I were to pick a size for 4 it would be around 10×10′ at the base.

I don’t know how sturdy a lower denier silpoly mid in a large size would hold up with high winds or heavy snow load.  How it is put together makes a big difference. If it has the tear strength of the old standard 70d ripstop with urethane  coating (about 9 lbs), then it is no problem. Some very large tents have been make of that. Does anyone know the tear strength of the silpoly? The 30d silnylons run 15 lbs and up. The 70d silnylons run 18 lbs and up

[Tjaard Breeuwer]

@owareusa, thanks for the sizing info.

I had not seen the tie outs in the pictures, but upon more careful reading I see you have them listed in the description, my bad!

[Mole J]

This company have used and tested fabrics for their shelters

They use Silpoly. And do larger shelters.

https://tipik-tentes.fr/abris_tarps

There is a table for weights, HH, tear strengths etc here:

https://tipik-tentes.fr/atelier/materiaux

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Dan @ Durston Gear]

FWIW, the X-Mid 2P is silpoly, sheds snow well and sleeps 4 in fly only mode. Has tougher #5 zippers and more structure from 2 poles (vs 1).

May be smaller than what you’re looking for though. It’s 102″ x 88″, which is less floor area than the Pyraomm Max (108″ x 108″) although maybe not that different because the 2 poles give generally steeper walls and also more headroom. Still not particularly generous for 4 people though. It sounds like you may prefer something a bit larger.

[Tjaard Breeuwer]

@mole , thank you. I had seen that website, but had not seen the fabric page, nor the fact they sold them as fly only.

@Dandydan, Thank you. I had seen the tents, but not checked on fly only dimensions. I do fear indeed still a bit small. My Hex3 is probably similar in size. So really looking for something large enough for 4.

[Jordan Chapell]

I know it has been a month, but we purchased a 2nd hand Supermid with innernet in the summer for additional room over our Big Agnes Copper Spur 3 Hotel (which is fantastic, vestibule big enough for 2 people to sleep). We are a family of 4 w 2 small kids who do a lot of backpacking, and love it! I wish I had additional photos of us in the tent! There was ample room for my wife and I and our 2 kids. While we are all relatively small (my wife and I are 5’8″ and our kids are only 3 and 6), our 6″ bags and full length sleeping pads were extended all the way and did not touch the tent.

While the first two photos I’m including are only from an afternoon of my kids playing in our back yard, hopefully it illustrates some of the ample room with two 20″ sleeping pads. I will note, however, that we slept with our bags outside the tent, and it would have been tight if we needed to pull them inside. The 3rd is from a messy morning in the Wind River  Range.

[Chris K]

I am looking for a (winter) tent for my family.

Maybe take a look at the Tent Lab Moonlight 4+. Obviously this is not a mid, more like an anti-mid. But…

– silpoly

– 96″ x 96″ with steep side walls (picture)

– double-wall: inner is a mix of fabric and mesh panels, fly can be pitched independently

– free-standing, but lots of guy-out options and strong in wind

Cons

– relatively large roof area will not tolerate heavy snow loading

– availability / lead time ???

I have no personal experience with this tent but was giving it a look-see while shopping for a larger family tent.

[Ian]

+ whatever for Seek Outside and O ware.   I also have the Megalight and would recommend something larger for four people.   I’ve had three people in it in a pinch.   I’m sure we could’ve fit a fourth but that would’ve been less than enjoyable.

[Mark Ries]

I guess my experience with silnylon has not been so bad with mid style tents I have a BD mega light a SMD wild oasis and a LHeart solo and lengthening the poles or pulling them at a straighter angle has never been a chore or taken much time. I have had  problems of silnylon stretch with other non mid designs that can be a real pain.

[Tjaard Breeuwer]

Thanks for the replies. I had looked at the tent lab, and will still consider them, but the weight is so incredibly high.

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