- Sep 17, 2017 at 10:17 am #3491481Michael FBPL Member
So a fully woven 50d Cuben fiber pack would cost like 2 or 3 thousand dollars ? LolSep 17, 2017 at 1:23 pm #3491522
Well the cilogear 60L worksack in their ‘W/NWD’ is $775. Whatever denier fiber they use in the weave, the fabric, full weave+laminate, is ‘lighter than 210d pack cloth.’
Is it safe to assume a weave of 50d fiber would weigh about 1-2oz/yard? (Isn’t 70d nylon that 1.9oz/yd stuff?)
McHale packs has been using a 3.5oz/yd full spectra weave with a 2oz/yd mylar laminate for a while now haven’t they? 3.5oz/yd isn’t ultra light weight, but for ultra strength it doesn’t seem that heavy either. McHale’s full spectra weave with laminate is 5.5oz/yd, lighter than VX21.Sep 19, 2017 at 2:09 pm #3491938Michael FBPL Member
Two materials I have been looking for by the yd.are the DCF-WPB, and OutDry fabricSep 28, 2017 at 7:45 pm #3493742
Could dyneema webbing or grosgrain be similar weight or lighter than nylon/polyester/etc?Sep 28, 2017 at 7:49 pm #3493744Sep 28, 2017 at 8:18 pm #3493751Sep 29, 2017 at 1:42 am #3493813Nick SmolinskeBPL Member
@smoLocale: Rogue Panda Designs
I’m interested in hearing someone’s firsthand experience with dyneema webbing. Dyneema is normally quite slippery so it seems like it wouldn’t hold very well in buckles, but I could be wrong. Dutchware and RSBTR know what they are doing, after all.Sep 29, 2017 at 11:52 am #3493884
@smo, Kyle’s stuff is brand new so I can’t comment on it. However, the Dyneema webbing that has been used in hammocking, considering the load bearing from a human’s weight, is not compatible with cinch-based hardware so you are correct in your assumption. Dutch actually states on his site under the webbing that it should not be used with cinch buckles, etc. Myerstech is another source for Dyneema webbing and it what I use for my hammock suspension. They’re just a small shop operating from Facebook but their webbing is great. It is also not able to be used in hammock cinch applications. As Kyle states, his is thicker than the competition so he says it can be used for buckles on packs, etc. However, once his 1″ webbing is released, I’m still interested to see if it will be compatible with cinch buckles.
In case you’re wondering how or why it’s used for hammocks since it can’t be used with cinch hardware. The webbing is just sewn up with a small loop at each end, usually a 5′-7′ finished length. It’s then attached to dyneema cordage such as Amsteel or Dynaglide which has been spliced into Whoopie Slings or UCRs and the cordage is actually the adjustment point. Suspension these days can be VERY light. I’m actually very surprised that more people on this forum aren’t moving to hammocks as I have found so many benefits to it and my pack didn’t gain any weight. My suspension only weighs 1.8oz total bringing my total hammock weight to 14.9oz with a full zippered bug net. The HammockGear cuben tarp with doors (you want doors) only weighs 7.3oz so I’m in my setup for only 22.2oz, which is actually lighter than the single wall cuben shelter I was using. My 20* underquilt weighs less than the insulated pad I was using and hammocks allow the use of a smaller top quilt so Iwent from a long/wide to a reg/reg EE Enigma. Okay, I’m done with my hammock plug. :)Sep 29, 2017 at 3:04 pm #3493910Sam CBPL Member
Since packs were mentioned above, ff you are looking at it from the perspective of weight savings, this is an instance where it might border on the ridiculous. Yes, the 3/4″ UHMWPE is just over 60% lighter per foot when compared to say the 3/4″ Mil-Spec, but the difference in weight between the 3/4″ UHMWPE “Venom” and 3/4″ Mil-Spec nylon, both at 1 foot, is only 1.4 grams per the foot. So if one ounce were the equivalent of one U.S. dollar, the difference in weight between the Venom and the Mil-Spec would fall somewhere between 4¢ and 5¢.
So I dunno, if you are looking to save weight on a tarp/tarp tent, pack, or other project that would require 2′ or less of webbing, considering that you will use so little of this webbing it might not make that much of a difference unless you really need that abrasion resistance. If you are a DIY/MYOG hammocker, which I believe Kyle is and is the reason for his starting RSBTR, and need 40′ or more of webbing, then yes, the weight savings might be worth it.Sep 29, 2017 at 3:41 pm #3493914Nick SmolinskeBPL Member
@smoLocale: Rogue Panda Designs
I honestly hadn’t even thought of hammock use at all. Of course it makes a ton of sense for that application!
I do too much hiking in the desert to ever consider a hammock setup myself so they tend to be totally off my radar.Oct 25, 2017 at 3:40 pm #3498333Patrick CanterburyBPL Member
I’d like to see dyneema used in in parts of clothing for certain sports where crashing is more or less routine. For example sports like cycling, rock climbing, skateboarding, parkour.
The idea would be: dyneema panels covering crucial areas such as elbows, knees, hands, shoulder, ankles etc.
Giant bicycles has recently put a tiny amount of dyneema in parts of a single model of cycling short. But dyneema is otherwise absent from cycling world.
Last I checked there are three companies that create dyneema shirts etc for security guards etc, and one of those companies is (amazingly) willing to sell its custom/proprietary dyneema fabric by the yard.
Dyneema is nearly entirely absent from sports clothing where it is needed the most.
(Last I checked, even in the word of motorcyling, kevlar and nylon etc is used in some protective clothing, but dyneema not yet, not even for summer wear where it would be ideal).Oct 25, 2017 at 4:14 pm #3498338Jeffs ElevenBPL Member
So dyneema pants was suggested, but not a good use of the fabric? Is that what i read?
(i guess since they would be white, you’d have to wear them during the summer?)Oct 25, 2017 at 4:26 pm #3498341Patrick CanterburyBPL Member
I think Levi’s has a “tough” jeans with something like 5% dyneema. Mostly marketing IMHO.
Grey colored Hyflex dyneema gloves are thick mesh but still amazingly cool in the summer.
White is a great color for extreme heat, it’s what I use in those conditions, but I’m admittedly a bit eccentric.
Cut resistant trousers:Oct 1, 2018 at 1:00 pm #3557985Dec 6, 2018 at 3:33 am #3567730William NBPL Member
RBTR is a great place. I’ve made all kinds of very workable (but dubiously sewn) gear from them.
DCF is interesting stuff. I’d like to know more how to put it together and make stuff. (That being said I made a small, too small it turns out, project a couple of months ago. The tape….I don’t know. I guess I should find my project and see it I can pull it apart.)
I’ve tried to order the white DCF more than a few times and it’s always out of stock. (I’ve got some blue, but unfortunately the 75 cent Ikea bag is next to my fabric stash, and it looks exactly the same.)
Last week, I went to order some Silnylon to make different color stuff sacks…and all the light colors were out of stock. It’s like the old USSR, “No problem comrades, we have the same color selection as the bourgeoisie in Seattle, but today we only have black, blue, military green and dark gray…oh and a resupply of dark brown” No more dark colors. I’m backpacking, not hiding.Dec 8, 2018 at 9:22 pm #3568092
If you’ve been around myog lately, you’ll know that there have been supply issues from Dyneema corp. RBTR just happens to see the worst of it since they’re currently the largest DCF supplier to our community.
on the color selection, you must’ve been looking at MTN Silnylon. They have tons of colors in regular silnylon and their silpoly/silpoly pu4000 are more popular these days anyway so you should look at those. If you can’t find the right color in those fabrics then you’re after something truly exotic.Dec 9, 2018 at 7:47 am #3568141Eric BBPL Member
Dyneema has a low melting point and that might be a consideration for crash-resistant clothing.
I know from personal experience that polypropylene tights and shirts can melt in a 30 mph bicycle crash on pavement.Dec 10, 2018 at 11:57 pm #3568406William NBPL Member
Thanks Hoosier T, A lot of these colors are out of stock, though….but some are still available. I wonder what determines which colors are made?
Looking at the colors for Membrane silpoly PU4000 and 1.1: Olive Yellow, Blaze Yellow and Robin Egg Blue, Burnt Orange and just maybe Khaki and Crimson would stand out inside a backpack in low light, all the other colors would just look black. I have various RBTR fabrics in a range of these colors so I’m not just looking at ’em online. ‘Low light’ includes everything from night and evening in the back country to inside a car in broad daylight, in my living room in sunny southern California. That’s my grumbling, and I apologize for being a crank. I don’t want my gear to look a particular way, I want it to work a particular way.
I have some nylon bags for wood screws, black inside. Pretty useless. I sprayed them with Krylon white for plastic. The fabric soaked up most of the paint (so it’s not a backpacking solution) but they got lighter enough to make a significant difference.
(For two days I misplaced the black ABS lid to my Klean Kanteen mug in a car that was all black. I always carry a flashlight. I’m really tired of so much of everything being black. After losing a couple of mini-stakes in two days–more a small problem than a color problem, I started tying orange parachute cord to them. Didn’t lose anymore for the next 2.8 months. My coffee lid? more orange cord. My TV remote? I put on a tail of blue painters masking tape. It looks stupid, but I almost never misplace the dumb thing anymore and I never have to pause and figure which end is which.
And I’m already blushing at the comments that’ll say, just use different color draw strings on your stuff sacks. But we was talking DCF….
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