Montbell Down Jacket

For those temps I would look at the Mirage. I have about 5-6trips with my one and love it.

I think those would be the extremes of temps. I would expect more mild temps for a majority of the time. In the really cold stuff, I would expect to layer. I should also mention I run very warm all the time. Last winter I did a quick trip into Little Yosemite Valley. We had temps into the low teens, and I was fine with a layer of thermals, a long sleeve t-shirt, thin fleece, beanie and thin fleece gloves.

An Alpine Light works great for me from May through August at higher elevations in the Sierra. Sometimes it was too warm. A UL Down would be better for pure summer use. Although the Mirage looks like a LOT more warmth if you don't mind the extra ounce, the extra cost, and the potentially less durable fabric.

I use down jackets just a little bit between hiking and setting up/taking down camp. I assume that when it gets colder in Sept and Oct that I would have a warmer hiking layer (capilene 4, etc) to layer on with the down at camp. Otherwise you will want more warmth below freezing.

I always skip the hood, but I use a warm hat.

The UL down inner should do you so.

Is the difference between a jacket and a Parka just the hood?
The Alpine light weighing 11.6oz and the UL Down Jacket weighing 7.6oz is quite a difference…is there a substantial difference in warmth? pack size?

Stephen…I didn't see the UL Down Inner…whats that?

I like the Ex Light series…but I would like to have pockets…

The Alpine Light packs down to almost twice the size of the UL Down. Both of mine are hoodless. I think you could do the UL Down based on your second post. The difference in loft is substantial.

Covering all the temps above 20 degrees is too much for one jacket unless you compromise a lot. This is why I own so many… Decide what temps you'll use it in most and compromise from there.

Is it worth looking into synthetic jackets? I know down is lighter and packs smaller, but doesn't hold any warmth if wet. Synthetic is heaver, packs larger but holds warmth if wet. Any other pros and cons I am missing?

Don't get your down wet and it won't be a problem.

Synthetic gets a lot of praise for being "warm when wet" but really it just sucks a bit less than down when wet. Even that is debatable as down dries quicker, and you can carry a lot more down for the same total weight so situations where the synthetic option is actually warmer are rare.

Fleece is way better than synthetic in the wet (sucks even less), so take down if you can keep it dry, or take fleece if you can't.

The age old question. I have both down and synthetic in my armory. My go-to vest is a Rab Generator with synthetic fill. Love it, extremely versatile, and the weight / bulk surcharge over down is minimal. But in the Rockies, for a general use insulation jacket I will always reach for down. I too have the Mirage and am blown away by its warmth and compressibility. In really gnarly conditions I layer an oversize Rab Xenon (XL) on top of the Mirage (L), which solves the damp issue (rare as it is in my dry climate) and offers me additional warmth. But I would have to say that – for a drier climate – a down jacket will be warmer than a similar weight synthetic jacket, and it will pack smaller when not in use.

Edit: fired this post off late. Dan has already addressed the issue.

"Synthetic is heaver, packs larger but holds warmth if wet."

Is this true…I mean the wet part. I have heard it a million times and I have heard much to the contrary by some much more knowledgeable than I that its simply not the case.

Either way if my insulation layer is wet how long before I am, and when wet doesn't my body have to heat all that water to body temp before I can at least break even temp wise. That seems like quite a chore. Synthetic may hold off longer in humidity but "wet" is a different story is it not.

Anyway after a lot of research and advise from the BPL crowd Im going with a montbell down jacket. Im in the same boat trying to nail down the jacket for my most use temp range. Unfortunately one jacket just wont do it all. Same could be said for a lot of gear that way.

Keep your powder…and your insulation dry :)

jimmyb

Warm when wet is a fallacy learned by anyone who actually tries it out. Nothing is warm when wet if it breathes, since all the heat is sapped away instantly. If you wore a wetsuit, that's about the only time.

That said, synth tends to dry faster since the moisture is not absorbed into the fibers directly. It also maintains it shape when wet, so surface area for drying is greater than collapsed down plumes. This is why it's nice for stop and go activities (like climbing) where you don't have the luxury of constantly adjusting layers. You can build up a sweat but it won't collapse the insulation, so it's "warm" when you stop and dries out.

It's the ability to dry out synthetic with body heat that makes it advantageous in perpetually wet climates. Still, as an active piece, synth is usually overkill for hiking and other constant aerobic activities. In those situations fleece can be better for both precipitation and perspiration moisture.

Article here on down vs synthetic drying. It's not clear cut either way:

http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/wet_weather_performance_down_vs_synth_vests.html#.VE3yBYc7u24

As I recall, BPL has another article (probably a few) that looks at down vs. synthetic drying which was more clearly in support of down drying faster.

Dan,

First, MB uses Parka for hooded jackets/sweaters and Jacket for no hood. That is the only difference.

At your temperature range I personally would go with a UL Down Inner Parka as the best all-around choice. Also the best value – if you want a down sweater you'll pay much more for a minor weight saving if you buy the Plasma or Ex Light. The UL Down Inner has a bit more heft and gives more warmth. Works for me (and I'm cold prone) down to 25-30 with a rain shell. For a true down jacket at those temps I agree with others that the Alpine Light is your best bet.

Richard

I have a Mirage and Exlight depending on what temp range I'm going. I usually bring both if it's going to be in the 20s or lower with wind. I've had my mirage down close to 0F, but wasn't in proper base layers. Does anyone else think 0F is a good rating for the Mirage?

Just for reference I was fine down to 32F with my exlight with a R1 Hoody, Black Rock Gear Down Hat, Smart Wool mid weight long underwear with thin nylon Columbia zip off pants. Keep in mind that I don't produce much body heat so you'd probably be good into the 20s with the exlight.

I'll just leave this here: http://www.phdesigns.co.uk/yukon-down-jacket-k-series

"Looking at getting a down Jacket from Montbell….wondering what ya'll would recommend. It would be used primarily for 3 season backpacking in higher elevations…..temps maybe getting down into the low 30s/ high 20s…at the most extreme. Most of my trips are in the Sierras between May and October. Id like a nice compromise of lightweight, comfort and warmth. Was looking at maybe the UL Down Parka…thoughts."

You just described the Alpine Light… I have one, terrific jacket. We have Arcteryx, Patagonia, Marmot, EB 1st Ascent, Mammut, etc., down sweaters in the house. I think the arcteryx, Montbell and Eddie Bauer 1st Ascent are the best of the down sweater genre that we own.

Jeff: "The Alpine Light packs down to almost twice the size of the UL Down. Both of mine are hoodless. I think you could do the UL Down based on your second post."

Agree with Jeff.
You said you run very warm. I do, too, and have the Alpine Light Down Parka. Got to use it for a week last month with morning temps of 29-40F(was expecting much lower, or wouldn't have brought it) and it's definitely overkill at those temps.
Given you said "low 30s/high 20s…at the most extreme", plus expect to layer, I'd be looking at the UL Down Parka or EX Light Down Anorak(actually put up a thread about the anorak when it came out).
My other down jacket is a bit light for freezing temps, so I'm tempted to buy that anorak, and just use the Alpine Light for <20F.

I have the Montbell Ex Light down anorak and I think its a great jacket I had it out camping a few weeks ago when it dropped in to the low 30's at night and all I wore underneath it in camp was a long sleeve midweight thermal long sleeve and an icebreaker tech t lite shirt. I think its a great jacket. It's as light as a Mountain Hardwear Ghost whisperer and its $110 less.