Is Eddie Bauer giving up on First Ascent?

I think FA products are nice. The problem for me is that when comparison shopping, I find something else I like better due to weight, cost, or whatever. Based on what I see on the trail, it appears (to me) that FA appeals more to yuppies than outdoors people; true could be said about other companies but I do see TNF, Patagonia, Montbell, etc on the trail and much more so than Eddie Bauer.

There are many obvious exceptions to that rule, and again, just my personal observations as I'm not privy to stats about their end users. I do wear their clothing quite often in the front country but the only EB garment I ever take with me backpacking is a 550 fill sweater I picked up for $25 which isn't marketed under FA.

I noticed the same thing myself last time I was in their store. It used to be that the FA clothing had it's own little section. Now you have to hunt and sort through everything else to find it. The only FA gear item they had was the Bacon Pack. I love my Downlight jacket and would like a couple of their other pieces as well.

I hope they don't give up on it, they make some pretty great stuff at pretty reasonable prices. And they often have sales which always helps to sweeten the pot.

One question about their sleeping bags, do you find they are quite long? I'm looking at buying a 0 degree bag and many of the reviews I read on the FA bags said even the regular length bags were crazy long (long enough to have one's boots stuffed at the bottom and still fit a 6' tall person). The specs on their site seem to corroborate this opinion. That's a bit of a deal killer for me if it is true.

I've always liked knowing that there is at least one store at the mall selling quality outdoor gear. It'd be a shame if they are giving up on FA, but I think I can understand – I'm sure this business is as cutthroat as any and it probably hasn't easy to convince people to shop for stuff like that at Eddie Bauer.

>> Anyone else seeing similar in their local EB?

Definitely seeing it here in Michigan. The only reason I ever went in the store was for the FA stuff, especially during sales. I started to get annoyed when their coupons and sales started to exclude FA items and, now, very little stock in the store. I have one of their softshells and some baselayers and my husband has the BC Microtherm down jacket. Happy with them all, especially the jackets.

Personally, I'm not sure about their decision to extend the line into gear like tents and packs. I thought they had a nice nitche with their clothing and I could see the sleeping bags since they've been manufacturing down products for a long time. I've never seen a tent stocked in any of their stores, much less set up on display. I have to wonder how they expect to sell one if no one's ever seen it.

I've noticed that their "Travex" line has really grown… maybe their outdoor demographic group are getting old and moving out of tents and into ecolodges…

It is true that among 'fast and lighters' FA wasn't at the top of the list. Their gear didn't stand out style wise or technically but their down stuff is a great deal when on sale. Seems they are caught between their traditional (and aging) customer base and the more adventurous types they were tying to get with FA. I think if they just would have kept focusing on their high quality down stuff and maybe improved the styling a bit they would see improved sales.

Regarding the karakoram, I'm 6' as well and have the 20 degree regular size. I find the length pretty much perfect with enough room to stretch my toes and that's it. Width/girth wise if say its a bit roomier than the WM versalite that I've tried but not by much (40" shoulders 33" waist). The pertex endurance fabric has a bit of stretch to it so I could see someone squeezing boot liners in the foot box but not much else.

The one thing the bag is missing for the coldest weather is a synchable neck baffle. While the main hood opening can be closed up tight it still allows a bit of cold air in that a sealable neck baffle would keep out. Not as much of an issue if you sleep with a insulated jacket on.

I hope they keep first ascent around for one reason: tall sizes. As someone 6'6" I love the fact they make stuff in tall

I'm 6'4" and I completely agree. FA was one of the few brands that offered tall sizes which was very nice.

Yep, EB has all but cornered the tall market. I may have to quit hiking if they drop FA. :-(

Their stuff is pretty good, too, so it would be a double shame to lose it.

"Their stuff is pretty good, too, so it would be a double shame to lose it."

Agreed. I picked up one of their Downlight 50 down jackets last year for $80 and it's a fantastic jacket. XL tall size, 10d nylon and 900fp water resistant down(4+ ounces of it actually). Even stuffs into its own pocket and makes a great pillow. I would put that jacket up against anything else made – cottage or otherwise.

Ryan

I went in to a EB store to return an item last week, and they said they were coming out with a new version of the FA Downlight (?) jacket. The sales rep said it would be lighter and have thinner baffles and released in September. I didn't ask any other questions but I assume more then just the jacket is being released.

I'm really hoping EB will continue their First Ascent line. I like everything in it even if I don't need most of it.

I do feel they have a good WPB membrane shell parka and my one piece of FA gear, the Downlite Sweater, is excellent.

A corporate decision by the "suits" to phase out First Ascent would put them back into Spiegel Catalog territory, from whence they came. Not a good decision. But Americans have seen many stupid corporate decisions over the decades.

Witness General Motors. It began its downward spiral when the car guys (automotive engineers) were removed from power and the "Bean Counters" were put in charge of the company. Or look at Winchester when they came out with the cheap version of the Model 70 rifle in 1964. Customers fled in droves and Ruger picked them up with its Model 77.

How about Talon zippers? This was the ORIGINAL zipper company in the world. Textron took them over and ran them into the ground as YKK in Japan eclipsed them in every way. Talon was bled dry by corporate zombies. Talk about the Zombie Armageddon – HA! we've seen it in corporate America. Gordon Gekko lives…

The same goes for outdoor companies. If they are run by MBAs who could care less about outdoor living then what you get is bottom line mentality. MBAs generally do not take calculated risks or have the imagination to give innovative products the green light. Ya gotta have SOUL, not just a degree.

Another 6' 4" + who loves his First Ascent shell. Also another member of the aging customer base and one who more often believes nothing good lasts forever. Wasn't the original Eddie Bauer a, or the, first company to make down gear available? Their corporate ownership must have changed many times over. I suspected–with no knowledge–that the connection with Whittaker Mountaineering was the cord to reliable gear quality for First Ascent, rather than any Bauer heritage. I also suspect that without Bauer's mfg/mktg guang, Whittaker would give up the First Ascent thing pronto. Any knowledge out there?

Might it be that EB is trying to position the FA brand to be independent? I think the brand gets diluted by being buried in an EB store. Similarly, its credibility to the outdoors community may be strained by its association with EB.

Agreed, that tall stuff is a bonus. I'm 6'6" and find myself having to buy ArcTeryx clothing because they have long inseams available. Great stuff, usually, but the price is tough to stomach and difficult to find sales.

The problem that most of us are seeing is that they are diluting the brand even more by reducing visibility in the store. If they wanted to show it off they would make a mini boutique inside of their store to show it off. As it stands you have to hunt through all of the preppy "outdoor" wear just to find the FA goods. Making their gear available online only seems like a surefire way of reducing demand rather than increasing it, especially how bad their website is at providing good specs on products.

It may just be that they are between seasons. They may be low on stock for summer, selling out what they have, before they roll out the winter selection.

I was at Whittaker's store, and they didn't have much FA presence there either. I didn't ask any of the store personnel why Patagonia, North Face, and Mountain Hardware had way more presence in the store, as I figured they were just low-level store employees, without any input to the marketing decisions.

As a smaller brand, Eddie Bauer or not, they may not have large seasonal runs, instead nearly running out of stock before each seasonal change. Look at Golite–it seems like I can never find what I want on their web-site, as I'm always looking at the wrong season.

You should see the massive selection of First Ascent puffies that they have at the Eddie Bauer Warehouse Store here in Columbus, OH. (4599 Fisher Rd, Columbus, OH 43228). If you are travelling through Columbus, be sure to swing by the West side and check it out. Along with the down and synthetic jackets and vests, they carry shells, rain jackets, baselayers, ski pants, etc. They always have racks and racks of puffies, but the other stuff is a bit hit or miss. The FA section is about 60' x 60'.

All First Ascent clothing in the warehouse store is at least 50% off. They occasionally carry some sleeping bags, tents and backpacks for at least 30% off. Add on the Eddie Bauer 'Friends' card and you can get additional 25% off on given weekends, and gift certificates based on past purchases. This spring I got a nice 900 down jacket for less than $50 with all the discounts.

The warehouse store is divided into two sections. The front part is a typical Eddie Bauer Outlet store, and the back part is their deep discount Eddie Bauer Warehouse store. The First Ascent section is part of the Warehouse section.

They also have a scratch and dent area that is only open on Friday and Saturday. Very cheap, but also can be very damaged.

Eddie Bauer's regular clothes fit my wife and I's style, so most of what we wear comes from EB. And lots of my hiking clothing is now EB as well. Love the tall sizes.

I think First Ascent was mostly born out of envy that TNF and Patagonia could charge so much money for outdoor gear… and become so loved for it that people wear their expensive outdoor stuff around town all the time.

It further gave them an exclusive label that tied to their past pedigree and fit in with their earthy, outdoorsy feeling clothes. Throw in the idea that their gear is 'designed by guides' and is aspirationally targeted at the technical climbing/mountaineering market. And that they could go to market at all of their high end mall locations. I can understand why FA has been around for a few years now.

As an aside, Horace Kephart's "Camping and Woodcraft" published in 1906, makes mention of some of his favorite gear outfitters of the day. Abercrombie and Fitch is listed several times. Eddie Bauer had yet to be founded. Kinda funny how these past outfitter brands became t-shirt and blue jean stores. Makes me wonder if Patagonia and TNF are destined to become Old Navy in 50 years.

http://www.eddiebauer.com/product/downlight-reg–stormdown-trade–hooded-jacket/38832184/_/A-ebSku_0880773175000060__38832184_catalog10002_en__US?showProducts=&backToCat=Jackets%20_%20Vests&previousPage=GNAV&tab=first%20ascent&dcolor=175

Looks like their down is now powered by Downtek. 800 fil, WR down @ 12 oz for the micro therm

The real money is in selling clothing to the masses based on image. That is what TNF, Patagonia do. But you have to produce a bit of gear and have a hardcore rep to have that image. EB used to have it, ditched it, and is trying to get it back, but only for image to support their clothing sales. Unfortunately in many areas retail floor space will give a better return with leisure clothing than real gear, just not enough buyers.

With high dollar mall floorspace, they are between a rock and hard place. There is a reason outdoor stores aren't located in malls.

Well, they have to go where the money is.
My concern, as a longtime EB customer, is that their clothing quality is hit and miss these days, and from what I've seen, that applies to the FA line as well.
This spring I returned a FA Microtherm hoody made after they'd supposedly fixed the down leakage problem for Fall 2013, and loved it-except that it constantly leaked down all over the place. I hope the new ones with 800 fill Downtek and "updated fabric" are better, and was tempted(especially with a local outlet now that has 40% off regularly), but already ordered a MontBell product instead.
Service is still great. Got my money back, and even received a form letter apologizing for having had a problem with a $10 gift certificate attached.

I have last year's Karakoram 0. (The red and blue one) It is not as light and doesn't compress as small as the other high end bags (WM, FF) but if you get it on sale and can't spend $600 on a bag, it is a great deal. I've not had it down to 0 yet, but I tried it out in the low 30's and kept it unzipped all night.

As for the length, the 3D foot box might be other reviewers' problem. There should be quite a bit of loft at the end, but that's not the same as empty space inside, that's how it is designed. I'm 5'2" and the short is perfect. My boyfriend had to return his regular to get the long. He's 6'2".

I use to work at EB and to be quite honest, most of the time people reviewing the gear on their website aren't going to be hard core enthusiasts. You may want to take their reviews with a grain of salt.

At any rate, with EB you can order both and return the one you don't like with minimal hassle. Hope that helps.

Ditto on the neck baffle. I have the Karakoram 0.

FA is not the lightest or most compact, but if you can get it 30-40% off, the gear offers a great opportunity for beginners to get good quality. Also, EB has a very generous return policy.

I used to work there because I really liked FA (a few years ago) but it seems like corporate EB just doesn't have a long-term vision they are willing to stick to in order to make it successful. If it doesn't make money next quarter, they give up on it.

Thanks for the info Tiffany, I was pretty hesitant of FA sleeping bags with specs like loft and fill qty missing from the website. It sounds like that would be a great option. Unfortunately, it is now a moot point for me as I pulled the trigger on a nicely discounted Marmot Lithium. Pretty stoked for it and the cold weather to get here!