The Hilleberg House Project

[Cole Crawford]

Go for it Max. If nothing else I think you'll gain as much insight on life from the experience as from the masters.

That's still a pretty expensive program though. I'm applying for Fulbright/Marshall and some PhD programs next fall, hoping one of them pulls through – everything I'm looking at is fully funded + stipend. Not sure which programs generally make you pay sticker out of pocket but hopefully you'll have good job options on the other side – student debt is nobody's friend.

[Jennifer Mitol]

+1 on just doing it.

You're young, you're still "stupid" (and I mean that in a NICE way…not an offensive one…meaning when you're young a full of life and don't mind living in a fly creek UL1 for 60 straight days because, well, why not?), the stupid is, unfortunately, going to go away soon, replaced by a different kind of approach to life…and one that isn't necessarily any better…just more stressful and full of responsibilities.

So go for it. You'll have a blast, great stories to tell, and you'll save a ton of cash.

[J Mag]

Just to play devil's advocate (uh oh): If you are getting your Master's degree wouldn't it be worth it to think of the extra money for a real living space as an investment? In my undergraduate major just a 0.2 variation in GPA was the difference between starting above six figures and below it. If I were to go back for my master's the difference would easily be 10-20k in salary once hired.

Where are you living that rent is THAT expensive? I'm in DC and that's how much I pay for rent in a very nice place.

Edit: I realize this is not applicable to everyone. I think the RV idea is a great one. Easy to move and a real place to live if you can find a good place to park it. You will likely be able to resell it for nearly what you bought it for.

[Justin Baker]

Personally, I would like to use a big canvas tipi tent with a wood stove.
I would want more gear than I could carry on a bike for living a year.

[Marko Botsaris]

I like the idea. Would it be less high maintenance if you could work out a more or less permanent site? Would save you a lot of time. I think the robbery issue might get solved by not having anything there anyone would try to steal. Then you could also go a but bigger. Like a 4 person tent with a nice Pendelton blanket for a floor covering. Then when the local newspaper people come to interview you you can invite them in for tea in a civilized manner.

Plus with a bigger more permanent tent think of all the little UL improvements and inventions you would get to obsess over!

I have a unused 4-person REI tent that I would be glad to donate, but is sounds like you might have more expensive tastes than that.

[jscott]

nevermind.

[Nick Gatel]

About 15 years ago I lived in an 8 foot long tent trailer for two years. I was working full time and had to call on clients 4 days a week all over Arizona and California. Plus I had to wear a suit everyday. There are all sorts of tricks to this kind of lifestyle.

If I were in your position, given the severe winters, I would rent a small storage unit. They have lights (think electrical outlet). I would get a cot, 1500 watt electric heater, a hot plate, and maybe a Porta-Potti. Wouldn't necessarily live in it full time, but when weather was bad, so I wouldn't be a burden on others. They are cheap and a good place to store things when you don't need all your belongings.

[Marko Botsaris]

From reading Max's posts on here for a while I'm guessing he knows what he is in for, probably much better than the typical PCT noob. From this I conclude further that he knows what he may be giving up, and that this is not an entirely practical choice. But I do feel it might be oppressive so close to civilization to live out of a small tent, especially one you have to move all the time. What you probably want is a yurt with a small wood heating stove on someones property with permission. Maybe (gasp!) with a very nominal rent to do so. The you would basically have more or less the comforts of a real home but you could still go all Thoreau on that sucka.

Its not really a home unless going there is a relief – you don't want to have to go somewhere else to get away from your oppressive shelter. A nice yurt will also allow you to get to work on your unabomber manifesto in more comfort. ;-)

[Matt Dirksen]

Max,

Good journey, friend. Sounds like a nice ride.

My only advice about the tent decision:

Make sure you go out and get the cheapest poly tarp and cover your precious Hilleberg with it – at least while your not residing in it.

1) A years worth of UV will destroy even the best of tent flys. No use having such a beautiful tent go down from a years worth of car camping, so to speak. Even if Hilleberg might feel generous and replace it some day, no use having it fail "by accident" while you're out in nowhere.

2) It will look less "stealable" to those who seek out things like that (trust me, some people know.)

[Daniel Pittman]

You should do it. I lived on a sailboat for two years while working and attending community college. Granted, this was in San Diego so the weather worked in my favor, but there were still plenty of cold nights on the water and moisture was always an issue. Single-hull fiberglass boats have terrible condensation issues. Shower at the gym, hit the laundromat every few days… it's not a bad life. You're an interesting, funny guy; you'll probably get invited to dinners and make friends with people who own couches. If shit hits the fan you can always hole up in a motel for a few days. I had to do that during my second winter on the boat when I had the flu. You're a smart guy, just go for it.

[W I S N E R !]

I think your idea will be fun. What's the worst that can happen…giving up and renting a place to live?

My only question is why it has to be a Hilleberg. It seems plenty of other tents could do the job for much less money while attracting a little less attention. I wouldn't leave a $500-$1000 tent unattended on a regular basis.

[Delmar O’Donnell]

I couldn’t have done what you’re proposing, but you may be able to, without breaking a sweat. You’re an experienced outdoorsman. And you’ll become very intimate with the library for sure. I found grad schools to be intense social experiences, lots of research meetings in the ap’t, lots of study meetings in the ap’t, some parties in the ap’t, time you want to be alone with the GF. To keep costs down, most of my meals came from my refrigerator (taco salad mostly) as restaurants and cafeterias can really run the bills up. But who’s to say you can’t survive off unrefrigerated backpacking food for morning or evening meals. You’d have a lot of extra money to spend on eating out with no rent. Also appreciated having a nearby toilet, and climate control, and a safe place for the toys, including mountain bike, guns, tools, shelf upon shelf of books and file drawers bulging with articles (necessary to get through the program). But that’s me, this is you, and it’s amazing to me how today’s “kids” can make do with a computer/smartphone and not need/want much beyond it. Would make a helluva good story and a great blog. I’d follow it for sure.

Why not give yourself a more proximal goal of camping out for one semester? Perhaps not the first one! Which can be rough. You’ll need some time to learn the nooks and crannies of the campus and the town where you can hang your hat, get into the rhythm of school, and grok what your professors and peers expect. Just an idea. Best to you, as you pursue those letters after your name!

[Anonymous]

Sort of along the lines of what Matt Dirksen and Marko have said. I would go with a tent that has a polyester fly, it will last much longer with all the UV exposure. I don't know if they sell siliconized polyester tents/fly's or not, but if they do, i would go with that so that you can touch it up occasionally with cheap silicone spray. Once PU (common on poly tents) starts to peel, crack, etc, yeah it sucks and not as easy to remedy.

If it were me, i would try to find someone who would let me pitch my tent in their backyard, preferably a larger backyard with some privacy, if at all possible. Yeah, maybe you might have to pay them a little a month, but better than the hassle of being moved around all the time, constantly taking down, setting up, which is one thing on the trail when you got a lot of free time, but in the depths of winter with cold, short days and with all your other responsibilities and activities, will likely get old fast.

I also echo numerous peoples' sentiments, why the need for a super expensive tent that might get wrecked, stolen, and in any case will likely suffer at least significant UV damage? I could possibly let you borrow my tipi tent and titanium woodstove during the coldest part of winter, if you are in some place stable and relatively safe (like someone's back yard in a good neighborhood).

[Sharon J.]

Depending on your field of study, you may end up being forced to buy a $hit-ton of highly specialized books that won't be available in e-format. If you are lucky, your department or library may have some sort of locker available for students to rent, otherwise, well, storage or transportation seems like it would be an issue. Just one more thing to consider.

[David Hyde]

I had a good friend that did this for FOUR YEARS of a PhD program in Chinese History at UC Santa Cruz. The big difference was Santa Cruz has easy weather and endless woods.

Essentially what you're talking about is being homeless. People do that all the time.

The big questions I would have are:

Location? Will there be a cost to pitch the tent? Are there areas near enough that are REALLY isolated…no cops, no hikers, no meth heads?

Warmth? It's one thing to sleep outside for a few nights or even weeks, but a full winter could get old. Readily available warm showers on campus solves this?

Storage? Carrying all your gear for a year seems unrealistic. Books? Clothes for more formal department luncheons and job interviews? Your childhood baseball card collection? You are going to need SOMEPLACE to store at least a couple of milk crates worth of personal belongings. You are an American. You have such things or will. Be realistic and plan accordingly.

The tent? I'm not so sure I'd prioritize a big expensive tent. I think I'd be more inclined to add a pound or 2 and go cheap and big. Again this depends on where you'll be setting it up. Frankly I can see living out of a small car for a year no problem. But 1 panier seems tight.

[Scott Jones]

I say don't get the MBA. It is just not worth the investment.
Article
You can save that money and invest it or if you had to borrow it anyway, not worrying about paying off a huge student loan..

[Greg Mihalik]

"I say don't get the MBA"
He's not. Max is going for "just" a Masters.

"It is just not worth the investment."
$12,000, plus living expenses? It takes more than that to buy a car.

"You can save that money and invest it…"
$12K at 5% will get you $15K in 5 years. If you can find 5%.

Don't forget, this is Max.
I doubt he is doing this is on a whim, hoping for the best ….

Now, living in a tent, on the other hand …

[Walter Carrington]

I've done this sort of thing for 3 or 4 months till I moved into my new house. But, it was summer/fall (snowed a little during the last week); I had a house to stay in if the weather was bad . I was working at the time and did work evenings in my tent with my laptop. If this is in the cold parts of the northeast, it'll be hard to get any work done in the tent on cold nights. Writing or typing at -20F would be miserable; even flipping through papers would be hard with big mittens on.

If the area is as rural as it sounds, a more practical approach would be to rent a little bit of land (farmer, faculty member with land) and use a travel trailer or hot tent camping (tent with wood stove). The land owner might make you set up bathroom arrangements (portapotty, bucket).

It could be fun. Just be careful that it doesn't interfere with doing well in your studies.

[Delmar O’Donnell]

I don't mean to be overly scatological, but I keep wondering how to handle waste in an extended camping situation such as described. What faculty member wants you pooping in a hole in her backyard?

[Max Dilthey]

First off, the outpouring of generosity and also, COMPLIMENTS, in this thread is really nice :)

To everyone that offered, thank you kindly for the offer of a tent; I work, so I should be able to set myself up no problem.

Ok, let's answer questions where I can:

1. UV Damage and Theft

The idea is to ride out to my camp "spot" (I may have more than one) each evening, get in the woods, set up at dusk or dark, and sleep. In the morning, wake up and take down the tent, pack it back on the bike, and ride back to civilization for my morning shower/constitutional/meal/etc.

So the tent would never go unattended, and would never see prolonged sun exposure. If the humidity is low, I might even just throw down my bivy for simplicity. I chose Hilleberg for puncture resistance and warmth; if someone has a better suggestion for less money, please do share. As for a larger tent; no thanks. I just don't need the space.

2. What about emergencies/showers/etc?

Keep in mind, my younger brother Sam lives in town! The way this plan is evolving since last week, I think he and I are going to do an uneven rent split on a studio apartment. He'll have the place to himself most nights while I camp, but every now and then when work or weather dictates I'll use my camp pad on his floor. I've slept on camp pads on floors many hundreds of nights, not a problem.

3. What good is a Master's?

This particular degree sets me up as "certified" in the way of my resume for two fields: Environmental Consulting and Urban Planning/Development. Both interest me, my internships and connections will likely dictate the better path (as well as the things I learn). It's a neat program and comes cheaply, and if I do hook up with a professor for lab work or a fellowship, I can turn it into a paid degree rather than a cost. I'm working on it….

My resume is already very good. I've been published online hundreds of times, I have a solid undergraduate GPA, tons of extracurriculars and signs of responsibility, like six jobs and internships (many competitive) and I run a web audience of 128k on the blog and 1.5 million through published work. I'm 24… I'm doing ok. I have to remind myself of that sometimes. I want the Master's, and I want to use my brain to do some good in the world if I can. This feels like a good use of my money (but, I am 20k in debt for my undergraduate. All of my friends have 35-45k and some have much more).

4. Max, it's cold out there!

I know! I like sleeping in the cold. I love winter camping. I slept out every night in a row for all of December 2012. This year I did less, but I still slept outside for like 30 days over the course of the winter.

5. Max knows what he's doing.

HA! I still need guidance and grounded advice. I still make mistakes. I still get over my head. We'll see how this turns out.

It will be really unfortunate if my girlfriend Kelley gets a job/place in the same town like she's planning to after her summer internship. Then, I'll split rent with her and live like a commoner because, well, girlfriend…

Thanks again for all the suggestions and advice!

[Anonymous]

If money is not that much of an issue, this is what i would do for a shelter if i was in your situation. Get a mid sized silnylon mid with a stove jack, have Nathan Meyerson make you a shaped liner for the mid out of reflective cuben fiber with a stove opening (make sure there is a bit of an air gap between the tent and the liner), get the smallest/cheapest stove from Seek Outside…

Heaven during a cold, bleak Northeast winter. You don't need the heat on when you go to sleep, but doing other things while awake would be nice. The combination of the above will maximize the heat, so you won't really need much wood to heat it and heat it fast. On days you're feeling lazy or it's not as extremely cold, just light a few candles.

In the summer, if you're in the tent during the day, put the liner on the outside to help reflect sun's energy.

Might still cost AND weigh less than some Hillebergs and be A LOT WARMER than same… (since you mentioned the warmth of Hillebergs)

[Ian]

"It will be really unfortunate if my girlfriend Kelley gets a job/place in the same town like she's planning to after her summer internship. Then, I'll split rent with her and live like a commoner because, well, girlfriend… "

Don't be so pessimistic Max. A relationship need not separate you from a life living in a van and crapping in a five gallon bucket full of kitty litter or living off of bean burritos. In fact, a relationship often precedes an existence like this.

[Delmar O’Donnell]

LOL Ian, very funny.

[Mat D]

Slept in a Soulo recently. Would have preferred the Unna. I'm 6.1 and brushed the inner tent quite a bit when installing myself & getting dressed in the Soulo. Some folks that have the Unna mention that you can create a virtual vestibule by unclipping some clips. Being able to have your gear and equipment with you in the tent, the inner tent that is, seems like an advantage in your situation.

[marc D]

Max
You might want to check out this guy http://tracksterman.tumblr.com/archive.
He has lived most of the year in a tent for the last 6 or 7 years, with occasional stays in bothies. He does this in the Scottish Highlands, where the weather in the winter is rough, to say the least. Condensation seems to be a major issue. It would give you some inspiration at least.

[Author]

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