Hikers shot and robbed in California

I've always argued comfort is an important consideration both ways. I could walk around in body armor. It is legal pretty much everywhere, and I don't have to be a good shot to use it. Its also pretty uncomfortable so only soldiers and police use it.

On the other hand "someone" I know slept with an airweight .357 (12oz) loaded with very heavy loads while camping in grizzly country (bear spray won't go through tent walls).

I look at protection as a "comfort" item just like a thick pad. If a place is so dangerous you can only consider yourself truly safe with a gun I question the wisdom of going there. We don't do recreational backpacking in Afghanistan after all. On the other hand if light pistol helps you sleep better at night go ahead and pack it.

I support the if its less dangerous than driving I shouldn't worry about.

The reason isn't that the other risks don't exist but instead I have determined that driving is an acceptable level of risk in my life that I don't consider so why should I be afraid of far lesser risks.

People avoid going hiking because of a fear of bears but will drive to work on a freeway without a second thought. So saying its less risky than driving isn't discounting the risk its putting it in perspective. In terms of getting robbed and killed I would be willing to bet the city is far more dangerous than the trail. So you definitely shouldn't take any additional precautions on the trail that you don't in the city.

Instead of spending time planning how I would deal with this type of situation or carry some kind of defensive weapon I am probably able to decrease my risk of death by more by getting better at first aid or navigation or fire building and the weight would be better spent on more food, insulation or a PLB.

Trying to mitigate the risk of being attacked is a waste of resources that could be spent mitigating greater risks.

One thing that would probably increase your safety the most is to be well rested driving home from the trailhead instead of driving 4hrs after hiking 12. But we don't have a thread on fatigued driving and the risk it poses.

Spend your efforts fighting the most significant risks.

…

"Example of flawed logic:
We ride dangerous cars everyday.
People rarely get shot on hiking trails.
Hence you are safe on the trail, and on airplanes."

Roger Dodger – agreed.

Probability is not a feature of the natural world, like gravity, for example. It's useful for explaining the natural world because it describes the net aggregate effect of genuine features of the natural world, like gravity, and is why a coin will approach 50% heads the more times it is flipped. So there's no rule (as far as "the universe" is concerned) honoring stats.

I guess what I'm trying to say is, yes, the conclusion does not follow, but there is a fundamental reason that the validity of your argument is irrelevant. (Edit: to say by 'irrelevant' I'm not knocking your point – I agree with it – reread this morning & thought it could be taken wrong so wanted to clarify.)

You (anyone reading this) are an adult and are well aware of what your options are for personal safety so there's no point in me trying to convince you of anything. I'm also well aware of what my options are and don't need your approval.

Carry on but this all seems pointless. Again, so very sorry for these two gentlemen and I hope they catch this dungheap. Has there been a followup story and has he been arrested?

I wish you all would just agree with me. On everything. Then all would be well and my argumentative nature could rest and give room to my sweetest kindest self that is temporarily hybernating.
;)

"You (anyone reading this) are an adult and are well aware of what your options are for personal safety so there's no point in me trying to convince you of anything. I'm also well aware of what my options are and don't need your approval."

+1 Ian!
The constant attempt at justification is pointless.

$1500 reward offered, looks like no one arrested yet.

…

I hope my good hiking friends here, when evaluating risks, will consider the risks associated with carrying a weapon in the backcountry. There is a significant statistical risk of injury/death to yourself or friends or family by possessing a weapon in your home. I would expect that risk to be even higher in the backcountry since we daily pack and unpack.
I live in a high gun ownership area and find that people rarely appreciate the danger involved in possessing a gun. When there is an accidental shooting, we tend to dismiss it as something could only happen to a buffoon-even if the gun was owned by a well-trained gun owner.
While there is always the possibility that a weapon might be useful in the backcountry, there is also a significant risk of unintended injuries and death. I'm not trying to say we should take people's guns away. I just hope my friends here think about the addition risks we cause to ourselves by protecting ourselves from another risk.

…

Rodger,

You and I are in complete agreement. 100%. Furthermore, I'm an instructor on the topic. When I give a class on edged weapons defense or firearm retention in a mat-room, we are all willing participants and students. Here at BPL, no one is asking or cares.

I'll probably write an article on this very topic on my blog as a reference for those who care to learn about my thoughts on firearms and how to carry them safely but from what I've seen here at BPL, discussions about guns are as productive as yelling at a cactus.

By all means, knock yourselves out but in a short year, I've seen what these conversations devolve to 100% of the time so I spend my energy elsewhere… like trolling Craig's music threads in Chaff.

On the subject of the OP — Yesterday, I was reading Dirtmonger's 2014 PCT blog, and he mentioned that he has been encountering drug dealers near the trailheads (catering to thru-hikers, he claims). If this is the case, I can see these areas becoming increasingly dangerous…

He said:

>>*Lastly, this is directed at some 'so-called trail angels' and the hikers who enable them. This pot/ganja/marijuana thang is beyond repulsiveness. Respect the trail, nature, and man. Hiking the PCT is not an illegal profit business. I don't care if you smoke pot but the more you buy from these 'so-called trail angel' roaches the more they are encourage to drive around to different trail heads and poach. To me, this is the epitome of hiker trash that give a bad name to long distance hikers who live the lifestyle and walk the walk (and I'm calling out the name Hiker Trash. For reals!?).

http://freedirtmonger.blogspot.com/

…

Maybe a bit off topic, but an interesting story came thru my email from a Superior Trail thru-hiker this spring. Reminded me of why, in the old days, one would be called foolish for venturing alone into the backcountry unarmed. Of course mankind has tamed most of the wild, ironically with those very same arms, so it seems foolish to chagrin those who still opt to carry them, but HYOH and all that.

This reads like something straight from Jack London.
Ran into a pack of wolves coming up the east ridge for the Manitou River at dusk. Heard them close so made a lot of noise thinking they would scatter, but coming up a steep rocky stretch thru some trees I looked up and at the top about 75' away were two of them sitting there waiting for me! I yelled loudly thinking they would scatter but they did not flinch. Tried again and they stared at me unafraid. Then they both turned their heads outward at the same time, and I thought where is the rest of the pack? By instinct I made a hasty retreat down and quickly back across the Manitou. I am puzzled by this encounter, maybe they were just curious, but they went out of their way to block my passage in a spot where they had a big advantage and they knew it was a human coming.

Worms, bears or dogs. We all end up as food for something eventually anyway. Choose your Deity wisely.

People have probably been selling and resupplying pot to thru hikers at trailheads since the beginning of thru hiking.

I'm not sure I'd let one hiker's rant on a blog lead me to the conclusion that reefer-crazed dealers and criminals will now be taking over my local trailhead.