Shoulder Strap Placement on External Frame Pack

This is a similar approach to that of Mchales Guide Harness and it works brilliantly. The shoulder straps themselves act like load lifters.

I'm not a fan of the back brace effect and general lack of stability attaching straps above shoulder level achieves. It does take weight off the shoulders, though.

I've heard similar from McHale pack owners, that for his packs in particular they transfer the gist of the load to the hips. My one time experience confirms this. I personally prefer the gist of the pack's weight rest on my shoulders. I think it comes down to body geometry and personal preference. For me the hip belt is used mainly as a stabilizer but I will occasionally transfer the load to my hips by tightening the load lifters and letting things sit on my waist area for a spell. I do this more when hiking high mileage with heavier than normal loads towards the end of the day. I sometimes get nerve-related issues, like shocks starting in the collar-bone area, but again this is at above average weights, which thanks to the people on this forum I think are a thing of the past for me.

What have you got there?

It looks a little extreme, but the bottom line is, it works for you or it doesn't. I've always thought that in a perfect world, the shoulder straps should just be there to keep the pack from going over backwards. It is nice to give your hips a break once in a while and carry more of the load on your shoulders, but not so much with your example.

Of course there are other externals with a lower cross bar to attach the tops of the shoulder straps. You do get into the issues with fitting the hard bits away from your back. Some rely more on the wide strap above the waist belt to keep the frame away from ribs and shoulders. Most external frame designs carry the load much higher with a center of gravity to match, which I never cared for. You can offset it with proper loading, but you end up with some top hamper regardless. I don't care for tall thin internal frame packs either.

Dave U,

Thanks for the Mchales reference. It does look similar.

David,

"back brace effect"

That's a good name for it and that is how it feels. It is as if the frame is a bow and the shoulder straps the string. It squeezes me horizontally. The difference is that I like that effect.

"general lack of stability attaching straps above shoulder level achieves"

Good point. I am giving up some lateral stability in exchange for this. Keeping the shoulder strap top connections fairly close to each other counters this a bit. I also mount the back bag at shoulder height or lower so that also helps stability wise.

William,

"For me the hip belt is used mainly as a stabilizer but I will occasionally transfer the load to my hips"

Viva La Difference. For me the shoulder straps are used mainly as a stabilizer but I will occasionally transfer the load to the shoulder straps to give my hips a rest.

Dale,

"What have you got there?"

I stripped the bag off a Jan Sport Scout Frame just to illustrate the shoulder strap attachment points for discussion. It's not a pack I use. Looking at the photo I think it might be a bit higher than my actual use with a loaded pack. My main goal is to have no shoulder strap weight on the tops of my shoulders.

"the shoulder straps should just be there to keep the pack from going over backwards"
I agree…and to add lateral stability as David mentioned.

"Most external frame designs carry the load much higher with a center of gravity to match"
Yes, my old Jan Sport and MSR external frames were like that. I typically carried about 15 pounds at head height. I currently try to keep the center of gravity below my shoulders and use a front bag to help keep things balanced front to back. My older back appreciates it.

"I'm not a fan of the back brace effect and general lack of stability attaching straps above shoulder level achieves. "

The shoulder straps press against the chest, effectively loading the chest assuming the frame is angled toward the upper back. There is no negative effects on stability. In fact, the stability improves whilst all the weight is on the hips. A 'win – win.' You must be using ill made packs.

Not that high. For both internal and external I like the attachment point above my shoulders, but just an inch or two. That way I can carry the weight on my hips most of the time, but shift a little to my shoulders once in awhile. It also allows me to use the shoulders straps to hold the pack up while I fasten the hip belt.

Yes, and this approach does not work as well with separate load lifters.

Daryl,

While it looks like a wonderful fit for you and it obviously works, (and I'm embarrassed to say it) but it does remind me of many fellow scouts in my old troop (30 years ago), who were sent off backpacking with their parent's external frames that were waaaay to large for them.

Not only did their packs have a serious wobble problem as they walked (since there was nothing stopping the pack from bouncing up), but their head would always bop into the cross bar in the back (which was supposed to be situated in the neck zone – between the shoulders and the head.) And five minutes later the whole pack would slide down their hips, resulting in a miserable trip and a possible phobia the next time they went backpacking.

I do know that today's shoulder straps that "roll over the shoulders" are pretty much the norm, since they can handle upward thrust pretty well, but they require to be properly fit (a practice that I sense gets often overlooked by the average retailer and consumer alike.)

The bottom line: Just like shoes, if one doesn't properly adjust a pack to fit their back, the pack will surely attempt to adjust their back to fit it.

Stability happens in three dimensions. Keeping the pack moving in concert with the shoulders/upper spine works a lot better here. Talking about stability tied to the hips is useful on a flat trail, and becomes less and less relevant as the trail becomes less level (or ceases to exist).

"I stripped the bag off a Jan Sport Scout Frame just to illustrate the shoulder strap attachment points for discussion. It's not a pack I use. Looking at the photo I think it might be a bit higher than my actual use with a loaded pack. My main goal is to have no shoulder strap weight on the tops of my shoulders."

That's why it looks like you are missing a cross bar or it is wildly out of adjustment. The Scout is a kid's pack. My my reckoning, the bar at the top of the shoulder straps should be even with the knob of your neck. if you have the back pad and waist belt in the right place, the bar is out from your spine a bit.

Here's an adult size Jansport and it measures 18" from the top of the cross bar to the center of the waist belt:

Stability is a function of how secure the load is on your back, loaded (secured) by the pressure of the shoulder harness against the chest. Having shoulder straps that are tight against the shoulders results in a pack that 'fights against' the shoulders in uneven terrain (causing unnecessary shoulder fatigue) and forces the body to oppose any load shift side to side, increasing overall body fatigue. When climbing, raising the shoulders / trapezius up through arm extension causes a synthetic lengthening of the torso and with a taller frame there is more room for the shoulders / trapezius to move more freely.

While I do think the frame in the OP is too tall for me, shoulder clearance of the frame is ideal for a pack without load lifters.

Dale,

"it is wildly out of adjustment"

Yes, I put it wildly out of adjustment to provide a visual aid for this post. I only wanted to illustrate the upper attachment of the shoulder strap. It's not a pack that is being used by anyone and it is unlikely that anyone would want to use it in this configuration.

All,

From your comments and my experience I would have to say that getting a pack to fit is a complex subject and there is more than one way to do it. I find it frustrating and interesting at the same time. I've made dozens of frame packs and tried thousands of adjustment, shoulder strap, waist belt, etc. combinations. I've found that changing one thing (e.g. connection of frame to waist belt)can turn a comfortable well working pack into one that is not working very well at all.

For several years my friend and I used no shoulder straps at all. We relied on the front hanging bag to stabilize things. I finally relented and added the shoulder straps back for convenience and added lateral stability. Don't need them on good trail but they really help when going cross country or climbing up ropes or brush hand-over-hand.