Knife sharpeners

[Glenn S]

I realize knives are a rather controversial subject when going light, but for the sake of thread-topic, let's assume a substantial knife is carried. Not only carried, but let's also assume that it gets used, sometimes harshly. So after some light baton work with a Mora and it comes time to clean a fish (hypothetically speaking), what about sharpening it?

Outside of the backcountry, I've grown fond of the credit card sized DMT mono-crystalline diamond in fine, but at 40 grams, it's a pretty hefty hunk of steel. I've even buffed the backside with metal polish to try and justify it as a dual purposing item for a signaling device, but I still can't bring myself to pack it.

There are other options in the mono-crystalline diamond vein, but finding real-world weights is challenging. Crock stick pull sharpeners are horrid, whetstones aren't really viable, is there a perfect solution?

[Dale Wambaugh]

You can get smaller, lighter "credit card" style sharpeners. The Lansky Dog Bone mini ceramic sharpener has worked for me.

[Justin Baker]

I have a small sharpening stone that weighs 28 grams. I don't know the name of it but I bought it at ace hardware. It's not diamond so it takes more time.

[Glenn S]

I'm gonna go out on a limb here, and assume you meant 28 grams? ;)

[Tom Lyons]

A Mora is a "scandi grind" edge, which means that there is a wide flat bevel that is designed to be laid flat on the bevel when it is sharpened. This comes from the old ways of being able to sharpen it on a rock in the field.
However, a piece of very fine sandpaper on a flat surface can do the job, and the sandpaper is very light.
Another thing you can do is keep it from getting really dull by stropping it regularly before use. This can be done on a piece of old denim jeans material that is loaded with some green chromium polishing compound available from most machine shop supply stores.
If you don't really ding the edge, or damage it, these methods will work fine.

If you prefer to put a secondary micro-bevel on the edge instead, you can use a ceramic rod sharpener. These are very light and narrow diameter rods which can easily slip into a pack or pocket.

[Justin Baker]

Yes,
sorry it's late…

[James Marco]

I will second the sandpaper. 2000grit finishing paper (carborundum wet/dry) weighs only 2-3 grams and a piece can be wrapped around a stick for sharpening. I find it in the automotive supplies next to the paints.

[Michael Driscoll]

A couple posters are talking about the "scary sharp" method… tons of stuff online about it… I glue a piece of w/d paper to a small mirror… It is mostly used in woodworking around plane blades and chisels at least that was my introduction from boat building… also it is good to know the type of sharpening you need, alluded to with the jean comment…

Sacary Sharp Honing Method
W/D Paper, Float Glass, Sharpening, Honing, Stropping Alternates, Angles, and Secondary Bevel

[Delmar O’Donnell]

Glenn, I'm also a nut for a sharp knife, but I take a different approach for backpacking knives, to save weight.

I carry knives with exceptionally hard steel, which translates into long edge holding. Edge holding good enough I'm confident I can leave the sharpener at home for weeks at a time. A typical knife steel may be in the mid- to upper-50s of the Rockwell hardness scale. The knives I carry backpacking are hardened into the mid-60s.

I carry knives of ZDP-189 steel, which can take the additional harness. Frankly, it's difficult to sharpen. I use a Lansky rig and then follow up with a SharpMaker rig for the edge. But once it IS sharpened, the edge is going to hold for many weeks of my typical use. So all sharpening tools stay home.

A William Henry Knife employee stated in a Blade Magazine article (Feb 05) that he thought ZDP-189 would cut 3x what VG-10 would cut before needing a re-sharpen, 4x what D-2 would do, and that it was 10x the cutter of ATS-34/154CM. And all of those comparison steels are high quality steels, not your typical soft and bendy 440A.

Carrying a hard steel knife is not without its compromises. Most "survival" knives are actually quite soft, many around the 50 range hardness. This is so they can make them tougher, more resistant to chipping. A hard steel knife is more brittle. You can hammer on a soft survival knife; you have to respect a hard steel knife and use it ONLY for cutting, not twisting or prying. So, there is no free lunch. But all sharpening tools and concerns stay home, for me. I'm confident my edge will last the trip, and then some.

[robert van putten]

I have used all manner of stones, steels and sandpaper for knife sharpening over the years and both my wife and I have eventually settled on one favorite sharpening tool –

I get 'em here –

https://www.ragweedforge.com/SharpeningCatalog.html

This is what Ragnar says about 'em –

"Two Sided Diamond Plate from Hewlett

If I were starting over, and buying a single tool to sharpen my knives, this is what I would get. It has a medium (600) surface on one side and a fine (1800) surface on the other. It's 4" long, 1 1/4" wide, and less than 1/16" thick (.055"). The plate and it's plastic sleeve weigh about 1 1/4 ounces. Made in the USA. $19

The two sided diamond plate is now akso avaialble with coarse (270) and medium (600) grits. This would be useful for taking out nicks or restoring edges. The price is the same $19. If you would like this option please to be sure to specify "two sided diamond plate, coarse/medium". If you don't specify I'll send the fine/medium.

I also have a single sided plate in this size in 600 grit. $10.

If I were going to add anything, I'd get something for a super fine finish or strop. The Viking whet stones shown below would be excellent. The inexpensive ceramic sticks listed below would also work.

The single sided plates shown below are a close second, and actually fit a wallet better. I personally prefer the slightly greater length however. "

When I got my first one my wife tried it out, then walked away with it and slid it into her purse! I had to buy myself another. We both like sharp blades and use knives all the time, especially since we butcher most of our own meat.

She carries hers in her purse to this day.

I haven't weighed mine, perhaps I should. But, if I were to carry a real belt knife on a trip, or reckoned I was gonna need to be resharpening my blade, – You know, if I figured I needed it – This is what I'd take.

[Dave @ Oware]

http://blog.owareusa.com/2012/08/13/lightweight-sharpening-stone/
11 grams

also-

Saphire fingernail files can work too, they are course, makes more of a saw blade edge.

Cardboard works as a strop.

[robert van putten]

David, looks great but I've tried similar looking perforated diamond stones from Harbor Freight.
They were horrible, threw 'em out…

[Dave @ Oware]

That is from harbor freight. I works okay on a swiss army knife for touchups. Also works great on the trapazoidal utility knife blades, they end up much sharper than the factory edge. I also have a larger DMT, but it seems to work no better. A farmers carborundum stone works better than either, but is too heavy.

[Rudy R]

Why carry when you have bazillions of sharpening stones under your feet. If you have a blade that needs sharpening just find a smooth stone to do the sharpening with. Smooth river rock is my favorite. A drop of soap and a splash of water and I go to town. I'm not saying it is the best method, but it works great in the wilderness with my Mora. Also I'm not to concerned about getting the perfect edge with my $15 knife.

[Owen McMurrey]

Using a smooth rock is easier said than done when it comes to finding one that you can actually get a good edge with, BUT you're probably not looking to grind a fresh edge.
Most of the damage that occurs in short term use, particularly something like the batoning mentioned with a thin edge(as opposed to skinning, etc.) is deformation, not wear. In that case, the edge needs to be realigned, not sharpened. That you can do with a smooth rock, a small steel, file, or ceramic rod, the spine of another blade, and so on.

[Delmar O’Donnell]

You'd also need to know which rocks have a higher hardness than your knife's blade. If you use a stone softer than your blade, then your knife is just wearing away the stone, and getting no sharper.

If memory serves, for your typical 55 Rockwell-C scale hardness blade, you'd need to find a rock with a mohs scale of 5 or higher, containing perhaps Apatite, Feldspar, or Quartz…

[Daniel Pittman]

I use my DMT diamond plates at home, W/D on glass at work, and nothing at all on the trail. One tough blade for batoning and a razor blade for slicing. Also SAK scissors. If I had to carry a sharpener, it would be a small coarse DMT and some fine W/D.

[Glenn S]

I'm a little leery of a hard, brittle blade when it comes to the abuse factor. Same goes for getting the edge "too" sharp. A softer, larger blade for abusive work and a harder, lighter blade for delicate work might be in order, with perhaps a piece of w/d just for touchups. I guess a rock would work for a softer blade, just to smooth out any nicks, etc., but I can't imagine getting a reliable edge for anything delicate. I've never had good luck with ceramic sticks for some reason. Maybe I can't hold a good enough angle with them, but it seems like they just plug up too easy and need a good scouring to get them working again.

[Dale Wambaugh]

I don't carry a sharpener often, but here ate the two I would consider. The top one is 2.5" x .75" and 13g. I can't remember the brand. It is fairly course and has a groove for sharpening hooks.

The bottom one is the Lansky Dog Bone ceramic sharpener that tips the scales at 19g. The end pieces act as stops and angle guides. They make a triangular one that would be better for serrated blades. I don't know what material Lansky uses, but it is better than other ceramics I have. Ceramic sharpeners should be cleaned occasionally for best performance, as the pores fill up with metal. I use a green scrubby sponge and Comet cleaner.

[Delmar O’Donnell]

> I'm a little leery of a hard, brittle blade when it comes to the abuse factor.

Understandable, but it's important not to overestimate "brittle" or think it as "fragile." For example, I've used the ZDP-189 steel for day-in day-out hard outdoor and construction work and never had so much as a tiny chip. But I'm careful not to twist or pry with it, just cut. I look at a hard steel as the classic UL item: works great, requires less gear, takes a little more care.

The vast majority of my knife failures have been with the kitchen-utility style of knife, which is often recommended for UL. The metal on these is so thin that chips occur even in normal use. The ZDP blades I use are clad on either side with 420J, which is a very tough and resistant steel (but worthless for holding an edge).

[Bob Gross]

"I don't carry a sharpener often, but here ate the two I would consider."

You ate two sharpeners? That doesn't sound good at all.

–B.G.–

[Alex RAllis]

if you are only going to be out for a couple of days, I wouldn't bother sharpening it out in the field. And if you have a good knife, and can sharpen it pre-trip, it shouldn't need to be re-profiled on a sharpening stone that soon anyway. That is of course as long as you are not working the knife hard by building a new lean-to every day.

I would recommend taking a piece of cardboard about 3in. wide and 8in. long in order to re-polish the edge (which you already sharpened at home) by stropping it.

If you don't believe that a piece of cardboard will get your edge back in working order, give it a try at home. Remember, if it can dull the edge, it can sharpen it. Try cutting through 20 pieces of cardboard and see how dull your edge gets.

Here's an example of stropping on a piece of cardboard:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6PzZuLMqifc

[Derek M.]

A couple of questions for your knife enthusiasts:

1. What is is this w/d that you all are referring to? Wet/Dry sandpaper? If so, what grit?

2. With ceramic rods or simple, flat sharpening stones, how to you all maintain the correct angle for sharpening your blade (assuming you don't have a scandi grind to assist you)? What angle is blade angle ideal, by the way?

3. Are the pocket sharpeners that look like this complete crap?

I assume that trying to sharpen a blade by drawing it through a sharpening device like this isn't exactly ideal, but is it really that bad compared to the alternatives? It sure would be more convenient for the uninitiated to sharpen a blade with this method out in the backcountry since it's pretty much idiot proof and the whole package is small and light; I have very little experience with these type of sharpeners though. Does anyone know the angle that these things are preset to?

[Stephen Barber]

What knife (knives) are you using? The "ZDP blades I use are clad on either side with 420J" models hardened to the 60s?

[Glenn S]

What about something like the diamond file that come on Leathermans? The Surge use a bit system for the file and saw blade and it's only $5 for the pair.

http://www.leatherman.com/931003.html

A handle could be fashioned easily enough I'd think and might even make the saw useful?

I know I've sharpened knives at work with the diamond file on my Wave. It's not the best edge, but it seems to take out nicks and at least make it cut worthy again. Not exactly something I'd probably want to use on a high dollar knife, but maybe worth considering?

Anyone else actually used the diamond file for sharpening?

Edit: I found some reviews on these, and apparently they're adequate for softer metal, but the harder metal knives just tear the diamonds right out of the file. For $5 though, I think I'll order some up and play with them anyway.

Received these today, and the file is of much lesser quality than that of my Wave, so I don't think it's a very good option for much more than a real rouch edge.

[Author]

Posts