Jul 23, 2007 at 12:23 pm #1224234
Sharon BinghamBPL Member
@cowboisgirl-2Locale: SouthwestJul 23, 2007 at 1:18 pm #1396254
@miguelmarcosLocale: Middle Iberia
That's a very useful post. Thanks.Jul 23, 2007 at 1:41 pm #1396257
todd harperBPL Member
@funnymoLocale: Sunshine State
Thanks for putting in the time…
ToddJul 23, 2007 at 7:21 pm #1396269
Sharon, thanks, that's great. I didn't realize my Trek900 was so heavy, although the lid when inverted adds another 300ml of capacity. Another column you could add is whether there is a Caldera Cone for the pot, Y/N. I would not buy a pot if there was no Cone available due to the increased ease(pot support) and efficiency (wind blocking) of cooking with one; especially with alcohol.Jul 23, 2007 at 7:41 pm #1396271
Sharon BinghamBPL Member
Ha! That's an excellent suggestion – I had never heard of one until now.
I also wanted to figure out how one would analyze which of the pots give the best capacity to weight ratio for the buck, but couldn't quite wrap my brain around the mathematics in the short amount of time I had to devote to it.
It would be great if the community posted their comments about the various pots too – if they own them. I don't own a single one – I was looking into them to try to pick one to buy, so I couldn't add any info myself.
I was thinking of making these sorts of charts for other straight-forward gear too – like pack towels, hydration systems, etc.Jul 23, 2007 at 8:13 pm #1396273
Ben 2 WorldBPL Member
@ben2worldLocale: So Cal
Love your chart. Would you be agreeable to adding some of the smaller (solo) models? If so, here are three models — I've added their dimensions as well:
700 ml (24 oz capacity)
4.8 oz. weight
4.37" H x 4.125" D
Single Wall 600
600 ml (20 oz)
3 oz weight
4" H x 3.75" D
Comment – requires a separate lid
500 Titanium Cookpot
500 ml (17 oz capacity)
2.8 oz weight
3.75" H x 2.75" DJul 23, 2007 at 8:26 pm #1396274
Benjamin SmithBPL Member
@bugbombLocale: South Texas
Great list! This will be very helpful to many people.
My pot is an MSR Titan Kettle when I'm using a Bushbuddy. When I'm going lighter, it's the FireLite 500. I like 'em both – as I point out in my reviews, I'm a little like Goldilocks, still looking for the happy medium between the Titan's too-tight lid and the FireLite's sit-on-topper.Jul 23, 2007 at 8:38 pm #1396275
@theturk-2Locale: SF Bay Area
> I also wanted to figure out how one would analyze which of the pots give the best capacity to weight ratio for the buck, …
Divide the cost by the Capacity/Weight Ratio. The result is dollars/liter/ounce where the lower the value the better the, well, value. In other words, the lower the value, the more efficiently you've applied dollars to maximize liters/ounce.
This assumes that you only want to maximize liters/ounce and that ounces (or liters) are not intrinsically more important. For example, someone wanting to minimize weight may make compromises on volume that would not be reflected in a simple ratio.
But a simple ratio does allow an apples-to-apples comparison.
(I better stop here before I loop back on myself another time.)Jul 23, 2007 at 8:49 pm #1396276
@sdwhiteyLocale: Smoky Mountains
I use the snowpeak titanium trek 900. Since I don't fry anything I leave the fry pan lid at home and made my own lid out of an oven liner foil sheet. This drops the weight to 3.7 oz and makes it a little more competitive in the capacity/weight ratio category.
Another added bonus for me is that my bush buddy stove nests perfectly inside for storage in my pack.
As others have mentioned, thanks for the list!Jul 23, 2007 at 8:57 pm #1396277
I have a snowpeak small cookset (not sure on the name, but teh stove and canister fit snugly inside. It is not the mini solo). Because it is not suited to backpackin as a couple, my wife and I just bought the nonstick evernew cookset featuring the 1.3 and 1.9 pots and frypans. I agree with teh sentiment of leaving the frypan at home (although hope springs eternal for trout…)One downer on the evernew nonstick is the need (in my opinion) to protect the nonstick coating from abrasion from storing stove, etc inside. Also, no dry heating (baking).
I've experience the abrasion issue with my MSR blacklite frypan, which has been serving me well (and frying some trout) for years.
Great post, and timely, as I was researching these stats just the other day!
SimonJul 23, 2007 at 9:41 pm #1396282
Another way to do it is divide L/oz by $.(then multiply by 1,000) to get a whole number.
I noticed you placed the good thing (capacity) in the numerator, and the bad thing (weight) in the denominator. Thus, goodness is represented by large values and badness, small values. L/oz / $ continues that concept; but of course, either way is clear.
Sometimes a graph shows numerical information more quickly and intuitively than a chart; give it a try? For example, here's a recent analysis of cook system starting weights (in grams) showing the weight advantage of alcohol for short trips.
Jul 24, 2007 at 12:47 am #1396297
Rod LawlorBPL Member
I'm pretty sure you'll struggle to beat this one for bang for the buck.
REI carry it for $13.95
REI lists the weight as 1.6oz. It has no listed capacity, but appears to be the same bowl as they use in the 3-pc set which they list as 18oz.
Mine weighs 53g, or 1.9oz on my scale, and is sitting on my stove now boiling 500ml which Google tells me is 16.9oz. I could maybe get another oz in to boil, but just.
No handle, no lid. (Foil lid is 1g)
Not sure if there is a caldera cone, but I measure the outside of the lip at 138mm 5" 7/16 (REI says 5 1/2") The lip is relatively wide and flat, maybe 2-3mm
I calculate the L/oz as 0.25 (counting the lid) and using Brett's formula as 17.92 $/L/oz
(But I may be wrong on this last one. Brett?)Jul 24, 2007 at 1:55 am #1396298
Rod, yes, 17.92, but "L/oz$"(higher number better). Or using Steven's (more intuitive now that I think about it) method, 55.8 oz$/L(lower number better).
That thin titanium bowl is is a little heavier per volume than the FireLite 500 (pot only), but the higher volume/weight ratio(goodness) of the FireLite costs you a little more 10.73 L/oz$. Just shows that you can get light gear economically, but the very lightest is sometimes the most expensive.
I for one would be willing to pay more for lighter gear which lasts a lifetime, as would Titanium. Anyone want to amortize the liter-ounce-dollars per year?? aghh.. enough ; ) we are gear geeks.
Joshua pointed out in a later post that Snowpeak bowl fits the 3-cup Caldera Cone at a savings of about 17 grams. The lid and cozy from the TD pot also fit. Thanks Joshua!
And all convoluted analysis aside, when I'm going out the door for a trek, I either grab my Jetboil or the Trek900/Caldera setup for their ergonomics and efficiency in the petrolium fuel, or alcohol domains. (The Trek900 was dead last in Sharon's analysis but it is my favorite pot for a long list of reasons*)
*OK, you are bored enough to want to know why..
– Volume markings on side
– Lid holds 300ml when inverted and placed back on the pot
– Lid can be a fry pan or drinking cup
– Circumfrence of the pot is small enough drink from, yet big enough to hold a large fuel canister
– TD makes Calderas for the pot AND the lid
– 900ml is just right; enough capacity to boil water for a double meal and two hot drinks
– Handles are easily removed and replaced with no damage
– Nests inside the Trek1400, and the other Snowpeaks nest inside the 900. If I were hiking with a group I could fit 8 titanium pots/cups in the space of the 1400.Jul 24, 2007 at 6:32 am #1396310
"PS I have that very bowl sitting gathering dust in my 'pot basket'. Its too small and does not fit any existing Caldera."
*whistles* Untrue… untrue… one of the TD guys is a huge fan of the TiBowl (can't remember if it's Rand or Russ)…
Ah, found the email I got from them. According to Russ, the AGG 3-Cup Caldera Cone works just fine with the SPTiBowl.
Gotta agree on the props you give the SP900, great piece of kit, for all the reasons you gave.
Just a note, I may have stumbled on one that trumps it in some categories… the Montbell Titanium Cooker #1. Same weight / volume, lower cost, better dimensions (low / wide). Can't tell if it has measurement hash-marks from the pic, but most of the pics of the SP900 don't show the hash-marks either. Also, it's obviously not popular enough, yet, for the TD guys to make a caldera.Jul 24, 2007 at 7:29 am #1396320
*hangs head shamefully* I should have tried that. Sure enough, the Snowpeak bowl (aka handled bowl from the 3pc cookset) fits the Caldera cone, and it fits the AGG 3-cup pot lid and cozy.
Removing the handles from the bowl gives a net savings of 17 grams over the AGG pot (which has slightly more capacity and the better cooking properties of aluminum)
I wonder what other combinations from company to company I have overlooked in my gear closet?
Jul 24, 2007 at 9:12 am #1396333
What lid is that in the pic? Is that from the AGG Pot? I've been curious whether the AGG lid will fit the SPBowl (BTW, I never noticed that the one from the Three Piece Cooksetit is the same as the SPBowl without the handle brackets)
Sharon,Jul 24, 2007 at 9:22 am #1396337
Neil JohnstoneBPL Member
I have an identical pot to the Brasslite 900 and I am very impressed with it. 3.5oz complete with the lid, and 4.5 in diameter, so it fits well on stoves without the handles getting too hot.Jul 24, 2007 at 2:30 pm #1396359
Just out of curiosity, has anyone found a good SUL lid option for the Snow Peak 600? I'm just using foil, which works, but I'm not satisfied…possibly because I'm just too lazy to keep making new ones!Jul 24, 2007 at 2:48 pm #1396360
Ben 2 WorldBPL Member
@ben2worldLocale: So Cal
I've posted this before so you may already have known — and passed on my lid — but just in case not… click here. Below is a photo of my SP700 and SP600 with homemade lid:Jul 24, 2007 at 3:12 pm #1396362
Thanks for that post Ben. My IMUSA mug needs a better lid set-up. By the way, the lid handles on several homemade lid photos on this forum appear to be plastic caps used to cover rudimentary electrical wire splices covering two wires twisted together. See the SP 900 pot in the Bushbuddy photo linked to the home page. Whether they are or not, I tried it over the weeked by removing the handle on my grease pot lid and replacing it with a plastic cap cover for electrical wiring. I merely unscrewed the handle and replaced it by screwing the cap onto the small screw. In the case of the grease pot I don't believe I saved any weight but did discover, I believe, an effective handle for homemade lids.Jul 24, 2007 at 3:24 pm #1396364
If I'm too lazy to cut out tinfoil how can I be expected to do all that! I kid…thanks for the suggestion.Jul 24, 2007 at 3:28 pm #1396365
@dangLocale: Pacific Northwet
The Firelite 500 lid works pretty good on a Snow Peak trek 700 pot, which comes with a heavy steel lid.Jul 24, 2007 at 7:03 pm #1396384
Yes, that is the AGG 3-cup pot lid on the SP bowl.
Regarding the SP600 lid people want, actually SP makes a titanium french press with lid, same diameter as the 600 cup.
But, knowing now that the Brasslite mug comes with a lid; I would have chosen that one instead. At the same diameter it would have nested with my others.
I like the lid the previous poster made and will try to find a compatible sized containter to sacrifice.Jul 25, 2007 at 1:56 am #1396411
Your titanium comparison table was selected as one of the more interesting new threads for mention in the BPL newsletter. Not bad for a new member!Jul 25, 2007 at 6:42 am #1396423
"The Firelite 500 lid works pretty good on a Snow Peak trek 700 pot, which comes with a heavy steel lid."
Really? I never would have thought of that one…
PS, Brett, thanks for the confirmation on that AGG lid. Makes the SPBowl even more useful.
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