Best kind of alcohol stove to sometimes actually cook with

[Jason Johnson]

I usually just boil water, but my kid is wanting to go with me more and more so would like to be able to cook a pan of some beans and rice or something that's not in a bag. What would be the best stove for both?

[Hikin’ Jim]

Jason,

The Trangia burner with it's highly adjustable simmer ring has a good cooking reputation. The burner is brass, so it's not exactly UL, but still it's an alcohol stove, so many consider it light enough.

It can be used in the Trangia 28 configuration, which I have not tried or in a Clikstand which I have tried and like.

If you're just doing relatively simple cooking (instant rice, noodles, etc.), I've had very good success with the Flat Cat stove and it's (non adjustable) simmer ring from Flat Cat Gear.

HJ
Adventures In Stoving

[Dean F.]

There's also the FeatherFire alcohol stove, from Packafeather:

http://packafeather.com/stove.html

[Dan Yeruski]

I have a vested interest in this stove as my full disclosure.

The GOTO stove has full simmer capabilities as seen in the video and photos.

The GOTO Stove at zelphs-stoveworks

The GOTO Stove review on youtube

.

[Zorg Zumo]

Definitely the trangia burner. Doesn't matter as much the cooking platform, but the simmer capability and the fuel capacity are huge factors. The esbit-version is pretty well regarded if you want a compact all-in-one solution that is a little lighter than trangia's cooksets.

[Stephen Barber]

I agree with Jim and Zorg: Trangia is great for not just boiling, but actually cooking! No, it's not the lightest alcohol stove by a long shot, but for simmering, frying, etc, it can't be beat! I use it in a click-stand, which works very well indeed. Unlikely to spill either in the click-stand. and the Trangia can be turned off immediately by dropping the closed simmering ring on top of it. Other than weight, it's got it all!

[bjc]

I thought I might be alone in my admiration for the Trangia in a Clikstand. For cooking it is easy to adjust, very stable, and burns for a long time.

[Dan Yeruski]

I agree, it's more stable than the GOTO set-up. Go with the Trangia and Clickstand.

[Hikin’ Jim]

Another option, one that I have not tested, is to use a Trangia burner in a Caldera Cone. I've seen posts here on BPL that have indicated it works, but as I say I haven't tried it personally. Perhaps others can comment.

The one drawback to the Clikstand is that it's "cottage" gear and is a bit pricey. I have a friend who swears by a Trangia 28 set up, but you would need to supplement the "out of the box" set up with a windscreen. There's also the Westwind stand that I know some people like, but again you have to provide your own windscreen. The advantage to a Clikstand is it's integrated windscreen/stand set up which makes for greater efficiency.

HJ
Adventures In Stoving

[D C]

I have a few stove from Tinny at Minibulldesign. Two are Carbon Felt wick stoves which allow full boil, simmer, and dry baking levels of heat. It does require some practice and attentiveness to maintain a low level of heat output.

My preference is the M80 with a gravity cap feed for fuel.

https://www.minibulldesign.com/productcart/pc/viewPrd.asp?idproduct=211&idcategory=3

Check out the youtube channel for more info and to see the stoves in action.

Good Luck

[Mike Megee]

DC what's the weight of the MBD M80?

[Nick Gatel]

Get a Snow Peak GigaPower or similar and let the kid carry the canister (or both)

;)

[James Klein]

Jim, if I remember correctly, you have cooked with a trangia and a packafeather…Care to compare them on their cooking merits?

[Delmar O’Donnell]

I just received a Packafeather XL (1.4 oz) and have started to test it. It concentrates its flame centrally so is appropriate for small pots. The adjustment screw runs through 5-1/2 turns. On first test, full open, it boiled 2 cups of room temperature water in an MSR Titan Kettle in about 7-1/2 minutes (on an 80 degree day) and flameout on 3/4 oz alcohol was 9 minutes. Turning the screw down 3 still gave a heavy boil; down 4 gave a low boil; down 5 got a minimum boil which was more like a few small air bubbles escaping to the surface from time to time. Seems to run very efficiently when closed down. More info as I get it.

One advantage of the XL is fuel recovery. Very easy, as a cup sits under the stove. Just snuff the stove and pour it back into the alc bottle.

PS: I've made plenty of rice dishes on a simple SuperCat stove that only boils and then flames out. Instant rice just needs 5 minutes in a cozy afterward.

My goal is…pancakes!

[James Klein]

Thanks for the info Delmar.

do you know how long it burned at 5 turns?

[Delmar O’Donnell]

Hi James, I'll find out. I want to know how long is a 1 oz burn, if you bring to a boil, then throttle back to a low boil. I think that's the realistic scenario for most back-country cooking…high to get it to temp, then low to maintain the temp. Stay tuned.

[Hikin’ Jim]

Get a Snow Peak GigaPower or similar and let the kid carry the canister (or both)

Ha!

In all seriousness, when I want to do real cooking, I pretty much bring a canister gas stove. Adjustments are easy and take effect quickly. There's generally a lag with alcohol stoves; it takes a minute for adjustments to kick in.

HOWEVER, alcohol stoves are notably lighter, are dead simple, and are highly reliable. With respect to the Clikstand/Trangia combo, it's not perfect, but it's a really solid, workable piece of gear. Of course it's a compromise, but it's a reasonable compromise, which is what you want.

As for real cooking: get aluminum. In particular, I've found non-stick aluminum is the best. Stainless steel and titanium burn too easily in my opinion and can be a pain to clean. Non-stick coatings have to be "babied" a bit, but they're worth it in my experience.

HJ
Adventures In Stoving

[Delmar O’Donnell]

> There's generally a lag with alcohol stoves;

About that. Interestingly, Packafeather claims that the HEAT adjustment is nearly immediate, but they say that the flame size lags 30 seconds or so when turning the heat down.

Here it is, page 5 of their instructions:

"Please note that we emphasize Heat Control. That’s because you‘re adjusting air flow NOT air pressure. The first one or two turns downward will definitely lower the heat output even though the flame size might not visibly seem to get much smaller. The most noticeable change in both heat output and flame size will be from about 3 turns down to fully closed. Also be aware that as you’re turning the stove down, the heat output will decrease almost immediately even though it typically takes about 30 seconds for the flame size to fully decrease to a given setting. When turning the stove up, heat AND flame size respond almost immediately."

http://packafeather.com/XL.pdf

[Elliott Wolin]

I've had reasonable luck with a Caldera Cone with the default 10-12 stove plus a simmer ring that cuts down the airflow to the stove. The simmer ring is just a strip cut out of a soda can, split so it can be wrapped around the stove in such a way as to cover or partially cover the air vents (holes) around the outer circumference of the stove. By covering all the air vents you get a very low flame, suitable for simmering. Raised a bit the ring only partially covers the vents and you get a stronger flame.

It's not as good as a having an adjustment knob, but with a little fiddling you can get what you need.

The simmer ring weighs about 1g (yes, one gram). I posted a picture in a review of the Caldera Cone on the BPL user forum a few years ago.

[Hikin’ Jim]

> There's generally a lag with alcohol stoves;

About that. Interestingly, Packafeather claims that the HEAT adjustment is nearly immediate, but they say that the flame size lags 30 seconds or so when turning the heat down.

Actually, it's a little of both, but there is definitely a lag in the change in heat output.

Recall that vaporization is a big part of how hot an alcohol stove is going to burn. When the stove is hot, the alcohol is vaporizing more rapidly, and the stove continues to burn hotly. It takes a minute for the overall reaction to abate, vaporization to decrease, and the heat output to commensurately decrease.

HJ
Adventures In Stoving

[Hikin’ Jim]

Jim, if I remember correctly, you have cooked with a trangia and a packafeather…Care to compare them on their cooking merits?

I have used both although I definitely have more time with the Trangia.

The nice thing about the FeatherFire is that the cable extends out from under the windscreen and you can adjust on the fly.

The tricky thing about the FeatherFire is that it sometimes "burps" when you adjust it, and there's that lag that we've been talking about. You have to be patient and adjust it gradually in my experience. The majority of the control occurs in the range where the simmer ring is nearly fully shut.

The Trangia on the other hand is a little more responsive since you're controlling not only air flow but flame area via the simmer ring. But the pot has to be removed in order to emplace or adjust the ring. Actually, particularly if the stove is really running hot, I find it better to remove the windscreen so that I can emplace the ring fully from the side rather than drop in from the top. So, a bit of "fiddle" there. And if you get it wrong, off comes the pot again, and you adjust the ring with the point of your knife or a stick or something.

Which is the better arrangement? I think this is an issue of personal preference. I think that if you spend enough time to really learn the FeatherFire's nuances, then it can be a really good cooking stove for an alcohol stove. The Trangia is more robust and probably a bit more intuitive with a shorter learning curve.

HJ
Adventures In Stoving

[Derek M.]

Jason,
I've already commented on this subject a few times in past threads, so I won't beat the proverbial dead horse here…

But with that said, whenever anyone on the forum asks what the best stove is to perform any sort of cooking beyond simply boiling water, I feel the obligation to bring up the obvious (at least obvious to me), which is that the most lightweight cooking system with excellent heat control is a small cooking fire.

A cooking fire might not be an option for you, for all sorts of reasons, but if it is possibility given your circumstances then I'd encourage you to try it out. Just be sure to be safe and to minimize the forest fire risk by utilizing best practices in fire building and extinguishing.

You had mentioned that part of your impetus for wanting cook more complex meals was your kid's interest in backpacking with you and participating in the process. For this reason alone, I'd recommend using an open cooking fire because making a fire with another person can be a very natural bonding experience. Your kid will have fun (because let's face it: making fire is awesome), and you'll get to enjoy sharing a valuable skill with him/her. Seems like a win-win to me.

Oh, and it'll cost you $0.
:-)

[scree ride]

Here locally:
"You could be issued a violation notice for failing to adhere to current Forest Use Restrictions. You may also be charged for wildfire suppression costs. Violation of these regulations are a Federal offense punishable as a Class B misdemeanor, by a fine of not more than $5,000 for an individual or $10,000 for an organization, or imprisonment for not more than six (6) months or both. 16 USC 551, and 18 USC 3559 and 3571."
I love campfires, bonding with friends and family, ghost stories and even burnt gear, don't like smokey forests and I hate surreal forests devoid of down wood not to mention major fires.
Cooking fires, while it is an obvious choice, aren't always the best. Our kids need to develop a new view with different expectations than we had of the outdoor experience. I know too bad. There is just too many people out there and everybody wants a fire.

[Gerry B.]

The Etowah II Stove from Etowah Outfitters (etowahoutfitters.com) is an amazing (though not lightweight) alcohol stove for actual cooking, especially for a small group. It weighs a hefty 4.9 ounces but will burn for a full 30 minutes on just 1 1/2 ounces of fuel. I saw an impressive demonstration by "Chef Paul" Fitzner at last year's Backpacking Arkansas Fall Gathering where he cooked two separate dishes (with two stoves).

It is not a stove I would use for solo use. He has a solo version but there are a lot of lighter options for solo use. But for a group of three to six using an alcohol stove, the Etowah II is definitely worth considering, especially considering the fuel efficiency.

[Hikin’ Jim]

Gerry,

Do you have photos of your Etowah set up?

HJ
Adventures In Stoving

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