Neutral vs stability trail runners–how critical is the difference?

Rafi, it really all depends on how critical the stability is for YOUR foot. Some people could use a bit of a stability shoe to compensate for some weak arches (that would be your posterior tibialis muscle) or weak hip external rotators (which help keep your entire leg from collapsing inward when you stand on it) but it's not a terribly big deal…

Some people have seriously floppy feet that all the strengthening in the world isn't going to help any longer…they NEED that stability.

Then there is everyone in between (on the stability side of things).

For you, my questions would be a) how unevenly worn are your regular street shoes (look at the soles) – if not too bad, then score one point for neutral runners. B) do you ever get knee pain walking down stairs, or down hills, or at the end of a hike? If yes, then score two points for needing stability shoes.

Without actually seeing what your feet are doing it's impossible to specifically answer your question.

How unhelpful is this, eh?

"Some people have seriously floppy feet that all the strengthening in the world isn't going to help any longer…they NEED that stability."

My wife is one of those people and would firmly disagree. The ligaments in her ankles are so lax she can roll her feet over to the point to where she could just about stand on top of them. She hikes/backpacks/walks/works (as a DPT) in the Merrell barefoot line. Since going to more minimal footwear she's had far fewer occurrences of her ankles rolling accidentally.

I do agree what you need in regards to footwear depends, a lot. If you truly overpronate (keyword being over) then stability shoes could help that, at least when running. I don't think it's nearly as important when walking. Most people see any pronation as overpronation though, and I think too many people wind up in stability shoes that don't need them. Knee pain can come from so many different things (weak/tight quad(s), weak/tight hamstring(s), weak/tight calves, various instabilities, etc.) that prescribing a type of footwear based solely on that is just plain nuts.

I'd lean towards trying a neutral shoe first. I was once put in a stability shoe, and because I'm neutral I wound up supinating. After one run I had bruised the outsides of both feet and strained the peroneus brevis on my left leg. That cost me a month of running.

Hi Jennifer,

Thanks for your response. In answer to your questions:

a) my shoes do wear unevenly with the outside part of the heel wearing more quickly (e.g., the right portion of the heel of the right shoe wears more quickly than the left portion of the heel of the right shoe).

b) After an extended descent, I do get some discomfort in my knees.

I guess that means I should really try to find a stability shoe…

Thanks again.

rhz

"After an extended descent, I do get some discomfort in my knees."

That has nothing to do with your choice of footwear. Far more likely to be a muscle imbalance or just plain lack of training, presented as overuse.

> Far more likely to be a muscle imbalance or just plain lack of training, presented as overuse.

+1

Cheers

"After an extended descent, I do get some discomfort in my knees."

That has nothing to do with your choice of footwear. Far more likely to be a muscle imbalance or just plain lack of training, presented as overuse.

Sure, that's true. But the OP asked how much it mattered if he actually bought stability shoes or neutral ones – at this point it doesn't necessarily matter WHY he has that imbalance, he is going to use those shoes NOW and he has to function with his muscle imbalance. Usually the knee pain with descending is because of weak hip muscles allowing the entire leg to roll inward…but guess what? It usually takes 6 weeks for the effects of training to show up. In the meantime he should own a pair of shoes that will help him NOW… Stability shoes will not matter in the least at this point in terms of limiting his ability to train the appropriate muscles. But it can mitigate the internal rotation of the entire lower kinetic chain, which will ease the aberrant forces through the knee.

I know you guys love barefoot and minimalist shoes, but seriously, there is no one size fits all prescription for foot performance out there. Shoes can be a tool both to train (minimalist), and to help to prevent injury or to protect joints and allow them to heal (not minimalist).

In my own case, for example, I have significant cartilage tears in both my hips, one of which has gone through 2 major surgeries to try to fix. I have a heck of a time maintaining strength in my hip muscles and consequently my R hip rolls all over the place…if I wear a slight motion control shoe I find I can walk all day without my hips acting up. If I walk in my vivobarefoots…which I love, by the way, for more than a few hours I literally can't move by the end of the day. In my case it's not my feet or ankles, which are strong as can be…but further up the chain.

"there is no one size fits all prescription for foot performance out there".

100% true, but that goes both ways. A stability shoe can cause as many or more problems for someone with a neutral gait as a neutral shoe can for an over pronator.

Since Rafi has mentioned getting knee pain with his current footwear, I'd be curious what that is? But, given he's asking if neutral shoes are ok I'd bet its some kind of stability or other corrective footwear. Treat the cause, not the symptom.

Rafi – can you post of a photo of the bottom of a well-worn pair of shoes? Wear on the heel means nothing since both pronators and supinators show increased wear on the outer portion.

I run in neutral shoes, so when I started backpacking in trail runners, I used neutral shoes. This worked well for me for several years, including on my PCT thru hike.

This year, I did the CDT, and I couldn't find any neutral trial runners that fit well. I ended up using stability shoes. The result? No injuries or other problems with my feet on the whole hike.

So, I would suggest that the difference between stability and neutral shoes probably applies much more to running than to backpacking.

Hi,

As per Chris' suggestion, I took a couple of photos of the soles my shoes. They do show more wear along the _inner_ half of the sole along the middle part of the foot. Does that pattern of wear mean I should go for stability shoes?

Thanks,

rhz

What kind of shoes are those?

Again, it's tough to say without actually seeing your feet in action, and I do wholeheartedly agree that trails add an element that road running doesn't have. This can either make things worse for someone on the wow-do-you-need-stability spectrum, or as you mentioned, even things out for just about everyone else.

If I look at that wear pattern it looks awfully normal to me…good lateral heel wear, good big-toe ball-of-your-foot wear…exactly what is supposed to happen. If I were you I'd probably try the neutrals and see how you did. Based on what you have said so far (and this is, of course, very superficial), it sounds like you'd be fine with whichever shoe fit best.

Hi Jennifer,

Thanks for your comments. Those are just regular street shoes.

The stabililty shoes I was considering are the Brooks Adrenaline ASR 10–which seem to be sufficiently narrow for my feet. However, these shoes are "maximum support" according to this site:

http://www.runningwarehouse.com/descpageMRS-BAS10M1.html

I wonder if they may be "too stable"?

R.