Durability of Patagoni Houdini ?

From my experience and to answer your question directly:

(Background info: 2006 shell model, wear from mostly a Gossamer Gear Mariposa)

Pack Strap wear: yes – not too bad. You'll get some pesky (but slight) sweat stains more likely. Hip belt area near iliac crest becomes a little more thread bare than the shoulders.

Snags from tree branches: It is pretty durable for what it is (Remember it IS a lightweight shell). Doesn't do all that well pushing through manzanita (the one time I had to) … but it's totally unreasonable to expect it to.

Now, unsolicited advice:
IMHO for a lightweight wind shell (keeping that it mind & treating it as such) it is very durable for the type of shell it is … you'll be happy with it and have many years of use. It is a great piece. When my shell finally dies, I will get another.

Interesting point… Allow me to diatribe…

I look at wind shells like that as disposable. I got the Mountain Hardwear Ghost Whisperer on sale, and unlike the rest of my pieces, I wear it extremely sparingly. If I'm biking and it suddenly gets cold, I use it. if I'm on a peak, I use it. Otherwise, I tough it out.

It's just not an everyday jacket like my other pieces. I'll use a fleece with a windproof liner for everyday use first.

I've been using mine for the past 4 years for both 3 season and winter backpacking- one small, easily fixed tear on the arm where I snagged it on a sharp metal tab. Otherwise, no real signs of wear from straps etc. In monkey poop yellow, it's too ugly to die.

The houdini is one of my most tried and true backpacking pieces, and I expect it to last for many more years.

It's a super light piece so it's not going to have the same durability as a hardshell. I use it primarily for hiking and backcountry skiing [the skinning part] and it's performance is excellent. Would I use it grinding up a granite spire or bushwhacking through devils club – probably not. Mine has a few nicks here and there [especially around the hip belt buckle], but it's been an invaluable piece. I rarely carry a gore-tex shell now and rely on this. I find that gore-tex is a lot more breathable in their labs then in reality … I just can't wear the stuff skinning-up the side of a mountain. The DWR is pretty darn good on the Houdini and I re-treat frequently. Worn with a base-layer and some soft-shell pants it's the perfect system for backcountry skiing in the PNW.

The houdini is durable enough for regular use. For regular trail hiking I wouldn't be concerned at all. If you want it to last for a really long time, you cut put some tenacious tape over the shoulders where your pack straps touch.
I wouldn't take it on an overgrown trail. When I do off trail bushwackin stuff I bring my houdini and a dri-ducks jacket. I layer them underneath a long sleeve button-up. The long sleeve shirt is a sacrificial layer to keep everything else protected.

I do have a cheap windbreaker (got it from a thrift store) that could hold up to bushwacking. It weighs 10 ounces.

Mine is from 2009 and it's in perfect condition. It's stood up to carrying skis over the shoulder, crack climbing, bushwhacking, and even getting caught in my belay device when rapping.

Unless your pack straps are carved from granite, NO, pack straps do not "destroy" houdinis. Tree branch snags can blow a hole or stitch on a pair of jeans if you catch one just right. So, yes, be careful wearing the Houdini if you plan on walking into the briars and brambles.

My super rad stealth mode all black Houdini from a few years back is still ticking just fine. DWR needs a refresh in a bad way, but it's great at what it does and holds up to my neglect and use.

The durability is neither good, nor bad. It is what it is really. There is nothing exceptional to the Houdini's ability to withstand typical wear and tear, whether that is hiking, climbing, trail running, etc. I'm sure if you ask around you'll find someone who has torn the hell out of a Houdini on a single outing.

Hiking to Panamint City, lots of brush, no problems. Like Eugene said, if a branch catches it just right, it's gonna rip it. No pictures of of any of the brush over my head though.

For it's weight and thinness, because it's tight-weaved nylon ripstop fibers coated with silicone, it is quite strong and durable (quite high tensile strength). But yeah, thorns and the like would do major damage pretty easily.

What we really need, are windshirts and rainjackets made out of UHMWPE fibers (like dyneema, spectra, etc). Such garments would be truly bomb proof and ultra, ultra light weight. To put it into perspective, nylon which is considered a rather light and strong/durable textile for it's weight has a specific gravity of 1.13 and UHMWPE is .97 i believe. Nor would it ever require a DWR coating to work well. It would make the Houdini or any other current windshirt look like a chump. Would totally change the game.

Only if some company made them! Hell, i'm thinking of buying some bulk Chinese no name UHMWPE fiber and finding someone who can weave well, especially tight weaves and having some prototypes made–possibly with some hand calendaring experimentation with the fabric.

Pure dyneema and spectra clothes are already made, but just not in the form of windshirts or rain jackets yet. They are usually made as highly protective gear for things like, motorcycling, hockey (socks), police work, etc. However, these are usually looser weaved with larger diameter/denier fibers. What is needed is tight weave with more micro sized fibers (doesn't have to be true microfibers though), and again perhaps some minor calendaring like for example what nylon fabric often goes through and is common in the outdoor fabric category for things like down proof fabric. Calendaring does weaken the fibers and overall fabric some, but with dyneema, if done right (would need to be done at a lower temp than with nylon), it will still be crazy, crazy strong.

Just think of a windshirt that with just basic care would last you easily 10 years no problem… weigh around 1 oz or less, never need DWR coatings, and is highly thermally conductive (but of course will still block wind and trap some warmth via fine denier fibers). It's a backpackers wet dream come fully true. And i just don't get why i'm the only one excited by this idea??!

Cottage manufacturers please take note..i would do it but i lack funds, connections, resources, and time.

"Just think of a windshirt that with just basic care would last you easily 10 years no problem… weigh around 1 oz or less, never need DWR coatings, and is highly thermally conductive (but of course will still block wind and trap some warmth via fine denier fibers). It's a backpackers wet dream come fully true. And i just don't get why i'm the only one excited by this idea??!"

I would be excited but I have a hard time believing you. It seems to good to be true. Hopefully it's not.

The idea is not without some issues Justin. If a big name company grabbed a hold of the idea, and say these used the more expensive "name brand" Dyneema or Spectra instead of the cheaper Chinese no name UHMWPE fibers, then chances are this would be a *very* expensive garment.

To give you a very rough idea, i recently contacted a company that makes protective clothing out of pure spectra fibers, and there was a long sleeved shirt with a turtle neck on clearance. I asked how much, and they said, 180 dollars and yeah, that's being a relative no name company. Part of that expense is the speciality nature of weaving and sewing such fabric and part of it is them using the name brand (spectra) version of the material.

Just think how much Pattagucci would charge for something like this! This is why i would like a cottage manufacturer to apply the idea and preferably NOT use the name brand UHMWPE fibers (but make sure they use stuff with UV inhibitors like these brands do). Sewing the stuff may be problematical, especially if it is in a tight weaved form, since the material is so strong. Gluing and bonding it would be even more of an issue. However, i don't think these issues are insurmountable, and for a company with deep pockets probably no problem at all.

And yes, some of what i was saying was very hypothetical as far as "lasting 10 years". I probably shouldn't give an exact time like that, since i really don't know exactly how long it would last for, but i know Dyneena and Spectra fibers are pretty much bompproof and very long lasting so why wouldn't a windshirt or WPB jacket made out of same not be similar?

The ultra light, no need for DWR (because so hydrophobic), uber strong and durable, highly thermally conductive, etc stuff is all true and based on what is common knowledge about about this material that's been used for awhile now.

6 years, worn almost daily. The zipper wore out and I replaced it. The drawcords disintegrated. The material became silkier, as well as fragile from UV, maybe. Tears more easily now. Numerous patches. Ounces of seamgrip. I still wear it when I expect blood, smoke, grease, etc. Really a good investment. The new cut doesn't fit me, though, so I've switched to the Marmot Trail Wind Hoody.

Why would a woven dyneema shirt not require DWR?

Because like polypropylene its extremely hydrophobic. When you use say Dri ducks, frogg toggs or the like, you don't need DWR coatings and its because of how extremely hydrophobic the material is.

Yes I see now. I wonder if there is an issue with weaving dyneema because of the very low melting point.

I don't know. Regular clothes are already made out of it, but because these clothes are for protective purposes, they are large gauge and somewhat coarsely woven or knitted fabrics.

There is an issue with the extreme slipperiness of the material, but there are different ways to get around this i think.