Longer lasting alternative to Vivobarefoot Breatho? Traction a must.

[Rusty Beaver]

I love the Vivo Breathos…and was very happy to have found a shoe like them. I can't justify a shoe I can only get 75 miles out of though before the lugs are gone….and that's mostly on trails with little rock! I emailed Vivobarefoot about this long ago and never got a response.

Anything out there close to this shoe that I'm overlooking? I had a pair of Trailgloves but they didn't work out….and I prefer more traction. I would like something thin (sole) with no heel rise too. The Breatho would be almost perfect for my tastes if the sole was more durable.

[Justin Baker]

Have you tried the regular neo trails? I haven't been using them for long but they seem very durable. The uppers are made from a really tough material, I chose them for off trail stuff. Of course they don't dry quickly.

[Mark Verber]

just 75 miles? Never had a shoe that would die so quickly. Have you tried a second pair to verify that it wasn't a one time issue. I would be tempted to send vivo a physical note indicating your experience, tell them that if this the the durability of the shoes you will have to switch to another company, and then ask them to send you a replacement pair to demonstrate that they will last longer than 75 miles.

As to alternatives, I would recommend checking out the Inov-8 TrailRoc 150. I only have 200 miles on mine so far (got them at the same time as some Luna Sandals which have been getting most of my feet time). Based on wear so far, and experience with other Inov-8 shoes I expect them to last between 400-600 miles.

–mark

[Rusty Beaver]

Justin,

Haven't tried the Neo Trails. They appear to have the same rubber compound. They were a tad heavier than I wanted too….plus I like the idea of having something more breathable.

Mark,

My first pair still appear to have lots more life left in the shoe itself…..but the sole's heal are bare. Smooth. No lugs left. What's left of the sole is extremely thin. The lugs on the rest of the sole are very worn…particularly on the balls of my feet. Some lugs ripped right off. I have less than 25 miles on my second pair and many of the lugs are beginning to tear away from the sole. At least one has ripped off entirely. I might get 75 miles out of this second pair…or maybe 100. I don't know.

I sent Vivo an email explaining this. No response. I may be going to the summer OR show in SLC in a few wks. If I do, I will talk to them then.

Thank you for pointing out the Inov-8 TrailRoc 150s. They look promising….though the colors loud. Whoa! :-) The Bare-Grip 200 looks good too…maybe too much height on the lugs though.?…?? Wow, they look like cleats!

What do you think of the toe box on the Bare-Grip 150s? Good room or more like a conventional running shoe?

[Sean Passanisi]

I was just about to pull the trigger on the Breatho. I'd be happy to try the Neotrail if the durability is better.

Does anyone have any longterm experience with the Neotrail?

Edit: FYI, I'm looking for an all purpose on/off road minimalist travel shoe in black.

[Justin Baker]

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[Justin Baker]

I've put about 100 miles in my neo trails.
Yep, the lugs are wearing off super fast.
Such a shame, hopefully they fix this is the future.

[Rusty Beaver]

I finally spoke with Vivo and showed them my worn soles. They told me I had earlier models with soles made partially of recycled rubber and that the new models were made of a more durable compound.

[Justin Baker]

I remember some talk about the recycled rubber trails. If I remember right, the recycled rubber had a speckled pattern. That was a while ago, it sounds like vivo is stringing you along here. If there really is a new, new model that is more durable then I would be happy. I'm very hesitant to buy anything from vivobarefoot now other than their sew-on soled leather shoes which have held up for a long time of casual use.

If they have really fixed the problem, I would appreciate a free replacement from them. It's the least they can do for selling a $100+ shoe that becomes unusable after less than 100 miles.

Either way the lug design is bad. I would like to see the trailroc lugs on the trails.

[Rusty Beaver]

"…sounds like vivo is stringing you along here. I'm very hesitant to buy anything from vivobarefoot now other than their sew-on soled leather shoes which have held up for a long time of casual use. If they have really fixed the problem, I would appreciate a free replacement from them. It's the least they can do for selling a $100+ shoe that becomes unusable after less than 100 miles."

I hear ya on all accounts! I'm more than a little put off by Vivo. However, I will give them the benefit of the doubt and try them one more time. I spoke with and showed two people at Vivo my worn shoes. One said to contact him later and he'd give me a "screaming deal" on another pair. Since there was no offer to replace, I'm hoping it's a genuine "screaming deal"! Otherwise, it's off to the Inov-8 TrailRoc 150. Not exactly what I'd like but they're the closest thing next to the Vivo's.

[Justin Baker]

If you try them out again, I would love to hear how they hold up. If they fixed the problem I would be very, very happy. They are my favorite shoes besides the durability issue.

I have a merrel trail glove and new balance minimus (both were discontinued models for screaming deals on ebay) coming in the mail which should hold me off for now.

I've felt the trailroc 150 and it seems like an awesome shoe. If only they made them in different colors.

[Rusty Beaver]

Yes, if I get another pair, I will post how they hold up. It might be a while though as my summer/fall plans have had a curve ball thrown in.

Re the colors on the Trailrocs, the new Breatho colors are very similarly hideous. Seems to be the trend in shoes right now. Gack!

[David Chenault]

I have a pair of the Trailroc 235s, and like them a lot. The traction is excellent, and I'm confident the upper will die before the lugs wear down. If anything, I'd like a stickier rubber. Traction on wet rocks is merely passable.

[Rusty Beaver]

Hmm…I'm not sure why I don't recall seeing the 235s at the OR show. They look to be the 150s but with a thicker footbed (6mm vs 3mm). Is that correct, David?

[Justin Baker]

On birthdayshoes they have a comparison between the vivobarefoot neo trails and 235's so they must be similar.

[David Chenault]

The sole thickness is different, and I think the mesh is a bit different than the 150 (I think).

Quite taken with them thus far.

[Rusty Beaver]

Thanks, guys.

Justin….I didn't see the comparison you were referring to. I probably just overlooked it.

David…..have you tried the Vivo Breatho and if so, how does the thickness of its sole compare to that of the 235? I tried on the 150s and they felt thinner than even the Breathos without the insole.

[Brendan Swihart]

I don't have any experience with the Vivos or 150s but I've been using the 235s and while not ideal, they're probably the best shoes I've used. The key is getting the newer blue ones (rather than the yellow ones), which is a completely different and much better mesh (unless things have changed). Like Dave says, the rubber kinda sucks. Unfortunately it's neither very sticky nor very durable. I'm kinda over thinking that the perfect shoe is out there (although it seems so obvious and easy–just put the damn roclite sole on them) so I'm settled on them for the time being…

[Lars Laird Iversen]

I've got the Inov-8 150, and they are a good shoe – but with narrow toe box. If it fits you, go for it. Personally I would have liked them wider.

[Javan Dempsey]

I agree, the Trailroc 235s are the best option out there right now.

I bought two pairs of Breathos and I hated them. I had to hike out a couple miles barefoot because they raped my feet so bad. The curved bottoms cause me to hyper pronate like crazy, and the footbeds feel like concrete on them.

Chris Wallace turned me onto the Trailroc 235s, and I've always hated Inov-8's Geisha foot optimized "perfromance" last, so I was hesitant, and the toe box looked narrow, but the mesh has a lot of stretch, and once broken in, I find these to be the most comfortable high traction zero drop shoe on the market.

Altras work pretty good for me also, but I dislike the huge stack height. The Inov-8s without the insoles are the perfect combination of cushion flexibility for me, with just enough insulation to be viable most of the year.

I'm pretty pissed at TerraPlana, the original Aquas are some of the most comfortable shoes ever made IMHO, but they seem to constantly be trying to reinvent the wheel, instead of figuring out what works and evolving it.

It's going to be a long time before I give any Vivo's a try again. My feet are still hurting.

[Justin Baker]

"I'm pretty pissed at TerraPlana, the original Aquas are some of the most comfortable shoes ever made IMHO, but they seem to constantly be trying to reinvent the wheel, instead of figuring out what works and evolving it."

+1 I have a pair of the old school suede aquas that I've almost worn into the ground. They are like wearing socks now.
I can't hike in them anymore because the traction is worn off. I really liked their sewn on soles. You would never have an issue with the sole delaminating and you could repair the stitching.

Terra/vivo has really gone downhill. Their casual shoes are still great though (ra's gobies, ect.)

[Justin Baker]

On vivo's UK site they have a new neo trail selection with 2 new colors (the old ones are on sale right now). I wonder if these are the new ones that are supposed to be more durable?
I've also been seeing the trails on steep and cheap lately, maybe the are finally phasing out their old shoes to bring in improved models. I can only hope.

[James Ayres]

I have a pair of Vivo 'The One.' These fit me better than any other shoe I have found, wide toe box, and no rocker, actually flat. However, mine too are falling apart with less than 60 miles on them. After reading the comments above I'm hesitant to buy another pair. And, like others, Vivo has not replied to my email message informing them of this problem.

Can anyone suggest a shoe with a similar fit: wide toe box, no rocker, and with a tad more cushion under the foot. These are fine when I'm not carrying a pack. But with even 15 pounds on my back sharp rocks make themselves felt, even not so sharp ones.

The Inov 8s are WAY too narrow in the toe box for me. The Merrill Trail Glove has a rocker that feels like…I don't know, a rocking horse? Can't get toes and whole foot on the ground for solid stance. These are the only other zero drop shoes I've tried. An yeah, traction is a good thing.

Any suggestions much appreciated.

[Javan Dempsey]

James, have you tried the TrailRoc 235s? They're based on a different last than all other Inov 8s, and while they don't look as wide in the toe box as the Vivos, they break in extremely well and stretch as much as necessary due to the mesh uppers. There are the *only* Inov-8's that are even remotely wearable for my feet, but they're exceptionally good.

Believe me, I'm the biggest stickler for wide toe box, any toe compression causes me to have major knee problems. I've never been able to use Inov8s previously, and was *VERY* skeptical about these, but after trying them out, I'm very happy.

FWIW, these are zero drop, medium cushion, low stack height, great traction (but the rubber is slippy on some things, fine on wet rocks, horrible on wet wood), super quick drying.

I also can't stand the Merrells, the first thing I noticed was the arch crap.

[Justin Baker]

My issue with a lot of minimalist shoes is they are too tight around the midfoot and I have a ton of room in the toe box. I must have wide feet. And I can't fit anything more than a thin liner sock in some of them which sucks for winter hiking when I want to stick in heavy wool socks, neoprene socks, or goretex socks.

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