Suggestions on BackPacks

Andrew:

Do you already have your other gear pieces — or at least the major ones like tent, bag and pad? What is your base weight and full pack weight on your week-long trips? Knowing what you've got will help narrow down the field of suitable packs.

Sorry for not being more specific, whenever i get new gear i get pretty excited and tend to jump around a lot. I have a good mummy bag already, i don't have a pad but the reason why i only have 100 dollars is because i am graduation high school and one of my aunts told me to spend 100 dollars max. I really wasn't expecting them to be so generous and i told them it was to much but they wouldn't budge. so darn i guess :-p.

My old pack weighed about 7-8 pounds alone with nothing in it. It was a bit old which i got from my dad when he used to go back packing. So i have been in real need of upgrading it, but it was just least on my priority list. Now that i have a little more money i was thinking i really should upgrade now. I already have a tent as well, and the camping i do is typically more roughing it. So i am not really looking into buying stoves or to many fancy gadgets… except a gps maybe =D I am first trying to upgrade the main essentials and than i probably would get a stove at some point. I am a 18 year old kid so i don't have money quite flowing out of my pockets yet.

When my pack is fully loaded it is normally pretty heavy but i just don't have the money to get the things i really want. I read what some people have on here for gear and it just makes me so jealous…. one day i to will have lighter gear and not have to carry around 30pounds of weight :-o. Thanks again!

i was actually looking at this one, but once again i am not very knowledgeable when it comes to gear.

http://www.campmor.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?productId=39201064&memberId=12500226

*truly sorry if posting links is not allowed in the forums*

Importantly,

You need to think of your gear as a system. Figure out a core system geared for 3 season use and work on summer/winter gear.

Seeing as you probably have a bit of time on your hands…you could make your own gear. ray-way.com or thru-hiker.com are a good place to start.

Depending on what you have now, what your budget it, and how you want to go about getting a pack.

Normally you buy a pack last but you could go against the grain and get it first and tailor your gear to the pack. If your my height/torso size (I'm a medium, 5'8" w/a 17.5" torso or so) I am selling a GoLite Jam2 and an old Camp Trails Denali. These are probably within your budget.

Most important though is understanding your fit, what you want to use your gear for, your budget and how you want to put together your system of gear.

Start with big three, the essentials like you said:

tent, pack, and sleeping bag/quilt

Now most people don't go from traditional to SuperUltraLight due to experience playing a factor in lightweight backpacking. Diligent research and due planning combined with getting out there and hiking/backpacking will be your best ally.

Can you list your tent and sleeping bag and approximate weight of each? Depending on what these are, how bulky, how much they weigh, etc. they will affect how far you can travel with your bag. What I'm trying to say is if you have a 4lb bag and 5lb tent it might be very tough to get 7 days of backpacking out of a golite jam2 for example.

I highly recommend reading Roger's thread on lightweight backpacking on a long distance hike: Traveling Europe (the title was something like that) from April I believe. His planning was very thorough and an enjoyable read.

Best,
Michael

Michael is right: fit and comfort are critical.

Mountainsmith is a good brand. My only concern with the pack you linked is that — at 3,600 ci — it's fairly small for a week-long or longer trip — especially considering that your gear aren't the lightest or most compact. Again, this points to the need for determining the right size by first looking at the gear that you've got.

One other thing. Don't limit yourself to just inexpensive new packs. If, after trying out various packs, you find the perfect one that's out of your price range — feel free to look into Ebay. A solid used pack that fits you perfectly is going to be better than a so-so new pack. Now, I am not saying that expensive is better — just that you shouldn't limit your choices to just the new and inexpensive.

Finally, one note of caution. If you decide on a used pack, make sure you have tested out the particular model at your local outfitter! You can return/exchange new packs at stores — but NOT on Ebay.

Thank you very much for your advice and before i go to those sites you suggested i thought it would be a good idea to post some of my measurements. Like i said i am just to excited so things slip my mind easily sorry. I am 6'3" i weigh about 200 pounds but i have played sports my whole life and camped/backpacking so i am not in horrible shape by any means. My waist is 32" ( normally i wear 34 or its a little to tight :-) being generous ) My chest is 40"s and my shoulders are 21"s

I am not sure if my shoulders is necessary but i added it. I am built pretty big i have broad shoulders and in general just a big boy.

sleeping bag – 3 lbs. 12 oz.- It is the Coleman Peak 1 Kokanee™ minus 10° Off of campmor.com *http://www.campmor.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?memberId=12500226&productId=39208202*

Tent – 10lbs – not sure of the exact kind but 3 season use

and i have already told you about my pack. Hope this helps some, and if i left some more important information out, let me know and ill get on it as fast as i can . Thanks once again.

Thinking maybe i should get a better tent first =( i was really excited about a back pack but ill do more research and fitting and see. If you guys have more suggestions or any advice, all of it will be greatly appreciated.

To the extent you can… yes, do get everything else first. Then, when you are happy with what you've got, then find an appropriate pack to haul them. Buying a pack first is kind of like putting the cart in front of the horse…

Best of luck!

Andrew,
Congrats on your graduation! Although I cannot offer too much advice on which pack you should buy (I am a 5'6" girl) I can offer some insight and concur with what some of the guys have mentioned. If you aren't in a hurry to buy your pack, I would certainly recommend researching and trying on several packs (fully loaded) to see what you like, what features, what pack will hold all of your gear, etc. Then search for it on ebay and the clearance sections of many on line websites. Also, check the "Gear Deals" forum on this site as it will often have coupon codes for different online stores which can save you a few bucks as well.

Also, if you are open to suggestions and a pack is not the piece of gear that you absolutely must have now, I would probably recommend looking into a lighter tent first. You could probably save 5 pounds by getting a lighter tent and then the next time you have money you could invest in a pack. At that time you could probably get away with getting a smaller (lighter pack) since you have a smaller/lighter tent.

As Michael mentioned, many people focus on getting the pack last and working on the sleeping bag and tent/shelter first. But, if your pack is unusable, uncomfortable or unsuitable in any way, then by all means search for the pack at this time. My recommendations would be to research, research, research and try it on loaded before you buy it (and walk around with it on for a while in the store). Then scour the used gear and gear deals forums, ebay and the clearance sections of the online sites. Get the best deal you can for the pack you want. Good Luck and Happy Trails,
NITRO
p.s. Ben kind of beat me to the message in my post and significantly less long winded. Well done!

Andrew,
Because you are just starting out in your conversion to light weight gear, you will probably be changing your tent, bag, pad, etc.. a few times. Each time, the size of the required pack to hold it all will get smaller. This is why people suggest buying a light tent, bag, and pad first.

If you do not want to spend a fortune on gear, buy whatever you can from REI. If you never use it, or even if you decide to upgrade to something lighter, you can get your money back and buy the lighter option. They will sell it again to someone else.

I read that you want to buy your pack first, and I think I understand why, it is symbolic of your change to UL, and it is the only gear you and everyone else will see while hiking around, it identifies you as an UL hiker.. Changing a pad for foam somehow isn't as satisfying has having a nice new pack on your back..

So anyway, I suggest the Golite Jam2. Golite, and this pack have a great reputation here at BPL. At 50 liters capacity it is big enough for your 10lb tent and bag. At 1 lb 5oz, it is truly a light pack, and it is $100 at REI. When your gear gets lighter and smaller, the Jam2 can compress down while still being a light pack.
I own a Golite also, the smaller Dawn, and I like it.

Go for it! Next thing is replace that tent with a tarp or poncho-tarp!

The Jam
http://www.rei.com/product/750359

I wont lie part of the reason i want a new pack is because of how cool it would look. However my main reason has always been because my current back pack is really old. My dad used it…. 15 years ago. So when i say its pretty old, and pretty heavy. My whole thought process was the back pack was the core, and from there you could add on. However with me being new i found i was well.. pretty wrong about this hah. I have slept outside many times in wiki shelters, and just ones i have made so i am not against tarps and all of that. However my girlfriend will soon be joining me in my back pack excursions so i didn't think a tarp would be good enough for 2 people. So in the end i am really not sure what i should go with first but i will have to keep doing more research. Thank you for your advice thought and that pack looks.. very nice!

so now i am in a tough situation of… tent,back pack, or some kind of tarp… I am not apposed to sleeping without a tent what so ever.

*about the ul hiker, sorry if that seems a bit dumb to you. Still newer to back packing you could say so, so yes i am ignorant. i wont deny it hah.*

Thank you also, i really should go down to a sporting store if i choose to go back pack first. As i just said in the post above i am in a tough situation were i am not sure what to get now :-p. I will defiantly take your advice on whatever i do decide to pick, i will look on ebay and places for good deals! thank you also very much!

* i should go back to bed now =( had to see one last time if any one replied. i am to hyped up to sleep now anyways *

I know getting up off the ground is very important since you lose a lot of heat from sleeping on the ground. However is a pad that important? i noticed you guys are making it more of a big deal, so obviously it has to be for a reason. Would you say its more important than a tent and pack though? my sleeping bad i think is good enough for now anyways. I posted it above its 3 lbs… so not to bad. Not UL you could say but its not horrible i think. Alright i am going to try to go to bed. thanks everyone

I think there are a couple topics here, intermingled. First, what is a good pack for your situation. Second, what is the biggest "bang for your buck" as far as losing backpacking weight. You might want to search the forums a bit as I think both of these topics have been addressed fairly recently.

The general rule of thumb for backpacks is to get your backpack last. The idea behind this is to not get a backpack that is inappropriate for what you are carrying. For example, I bought a Gossamer Gear G4, while I was still carrying about 25 pounds of stuff. This worked surprisingly well, but it was not ideal. I have since changed to a Granite Gear Vapor Trail, which is about 2 pounds. This isn't a perfect pack by any means, but I really like the waste belt and the simplicity of it. I will probably stick with it until I can get my pack weight under ten pounds. I would encourage you to get a similar pack (if not the same one) as it will serve you well for a long time (as you slowly lower the weight you carry). This doesn't follow the "get your pack last adage" but your current pack is really heavy. I think you can find a pack that is just as comfortable for a lot less weight (although it will have fewer bells and whistles and will probably not be as durable).

As far as the general question is concerned, there are a lot of cheap ways to save weight. The cheapest is often to make your own gear, but that isn't a requirement. At the end of a discussion about the high cost of ultralight gear (http://tinyurl.com/39e46u) I made the point that there are lot of cheap ways to save weight, so I won't repeat myself too much here. I really like the suggestion by Brett, to compile a list of gear, with weights and price tags (of things you might buy to replace the items). Displaying that list and asking for suggestions on this site should help. Personally, I consider the following to be my big improvements in weight savings (ranked in order from cheapest to most expensive):

1) O2 Raingear instead of Goretex.
2) Closed cell foam instead of inflatable (I bought Gossamer Gear NightLight, but I would also recommend Thermarest RidgeRest).
3) Alcohol stove instead of canister.
4) New backpack.
5) Tarp Tent instead of traditional tent.
6) Down sleeping bag (the budget killer).

You could grab the first three for a lot less than $100.

Andrew,

A pad is trememdously important for staying warm. Even a top-of-line sub-zero rated sleeping bag won't do much to insulate you from below. As you lay in your bag, you compress the insulation under you almost flat. Flat insulation has almost no ability to keep you warm as it cannot trap warm air next to your body. Think about fiberglass insulation in your attic. The thicker it is, the more effciently it insulates. If you're on a budget, a blue foam pad from Walmart or any outdoor store will do just fine for most temps. This will only cost you a few dollars. Most of the folks on BPL will usually cut the pad down to mirror the mummy shape of their bags and often will cut it down further to just cover an area from the shoulders to below the hips, using an empty backpack for insulation underneath the legs. This would provide you with a fairly lightweight budget solution. Other closed-cell foam pads (closed cell meaning the cells in the pad hold air and don't need ot be inflated to provide loft) are readily available and usually provide more insulating ability and comfort than the blue foam jobs, but at a higher price.

About the pack purchase- if it hasn't already been said, buy your pack last, after you have your other gear in place. Your pack needs to have sufficient volume to carry everything, but not so much that you've carrying extra pack around for no reason. That's just extra weight. If you're set on buying a pack now, make sure you get one that will hold everything.

You've chosen a great place to get information about lightening your gear weight but don't forget that the important thing is to get out there. We do a lot of ruminating about gear here on BPL but gear should be the means, not the end. People have hiked millions of miles, all around the globe with equipment less appropriate than what you probably have in your home right now.

One thing to realize about pads and cold weather camping is that the amount of insulation needed is determined more by the soil temperature than the air temperature. You'll want more pad at 10F late in the winter when the ground is frozen deep than at 10F during an early winter cold snap when the ground is relatively warm just below the surface. Never has YMMV been more true!

I'd say this:
At minimum go to Walmart or similar and buy a cheap blue pad to sleep on. It will insulate you, give some padding and it is under $15.

Then…you want a good pack for cheap? Start asking here! Lots of us have gently used packs that are collecting dust.

For instance, I bought a Kelty haiku pack (low 3,000 ci), below 4 lbs at an REI garage sale for $20. It was returned because "it was too light". I kid not! The pack is essentially brand new. I'll never use it (the torso is too big-it is for a man), but I couldn't pass up a nearly new pack for $20! It was a pack that cost $160 or so I think when it came out.

Andrew,

You are getting good advice here. One thing I will add is this: if your tent really weighs ten pounds, then you won't be able to carry it in a 1-pound ultralight frameless rucksack. Seriously — it won't fit inside, and you won't be able to strap it on the outside without dragging the whole pack over backwards.

You may be able to score a much lighter tent from this board or elsewhere (check Whiteblaze.com and the forums at TLB (http://www.backpacking.net). Look for a Henry Shires Tarptent Virga or the original Squall; these are sub-two pound single-wall tents with full bug netting and (optional) floors.

Good luck, and happy trails!