Most important gear item

[Sean M]

Whelp, I didn't have much luck tonight at the REI garage sale granted I had very specific wants but by the time my number was called most of the stuff was picked through pretty good. However that doesn't change my thought process too much, still hope to get a stove and/or a sleeping pad but would appreciate any thoughts on which I should go for or any other thoughts on my process to get outdoors. Thanks

[Ian]

Hi Sean,

I have the Soto ODR. I didn't see it on REI's website the othter day so I'm not sure if they are still carrying it or not. I read the other day that they might have a new stove rolling out. If you ignore the microregulator hype, you still end up with a nice stove. It's light and I've never had problems with the pot stands. If you want to do more than boil water then this is a nice option from REI (assuming they still carry it.) Don't buy this stove unless you are willing to buy the SOTO windscreen as well.

The Snowpeak stoves seem to have a nice reputation but I haven't owned one. I've read some complaints on this forum about the Micro Rocket.

I only boil water. The Jetboil Sol Ti is much more efficient with fuel and only weighs an extra oz over my current system (I use a ti pot with the Soto & windscreen). I can only milk 14 16oz boils from the Soto vs the Sol ti which can achieve (by reputation) 20 16 oz boils. (EDIT with a 100g canister) I wish I bought this system instead of the Soto.

I've mentioned it before but I only use the gas stove when I'm with my kids. When I'm solo, I use Esbit. This is a cheap, effective, and lightweight option. My Esbit kit is less than 1/2 the weight of my canister setup.

[HkNewman]

I would say a good sleeping bag. In the treeline in normal weather, hikers can get away with a cheap tarp, cheap blue foam pad, maybe some netting, and if warm enough, even sans stove. Without a good bag, it's going to be an unpleasant night (though wearing all your clothes and maybe filling a garbage bag with dead leaves and pine needles to add insulation would help).

[Josh Brock]

Tough one you want the gear but dont want to spend the money.

Im pretty sure you can count on replacing your gear no matter what you get. Most of us have a grass is always greener mentality. Especially as we try to find that balance of light and comfort.

I like every ones suggestions. Just pick which one you like the best. I would get a aquamira frontier pro water filter.

[Dena Kelley]

I agree with those that are suggesting you buy once. When I first joined the forum, I kind of went crazy and would go buy something because I read something good about it here, and then next thing I know I was wanting the next best thing. If I'd just have spent a few months reading here, I could have narrowed it down to what was best for me without buying stuff I will probably never use again. Fortunately I'm part of a backpacking group and can use my extra gear as loaner items for newbies, but still. Would have been nice to just buy the best item (for me) the first time and not the third time.

And…Gearswap is by far the best resource I've found. There are better deals on Gearswap than on ebay, if you are discerning. Definitely do your research though, because not all Gearswap deals are deals. I've even seen people price used items for more than the item can be purchased new, although that's rare and usually due to the new item being on sale.

[Terry G]

This is a great goal.

You already have an excellent bag that you rightly suggest you will sell for something more appropriate. In my mind, the sleeping bag is the most important part of your kit so take you time there and get something right for you down the road and live with you overkill bag for now.

You need a shelter and stove still. For a shelter, my recommendation is to go with you gut and get a tried and true like the Half / Quarter dome but get it used off ebay or craigslist. This will allow you to get out there now and figure out what you want long-term. If you buy the REI tent used, you will be able to sell it for nearly what you paid for it later (or use it as a beater car camping tent as you suggest).

Canister stoves are cheap. You said you don't like alcohol (which would be my budget recommendation), so just pick up a snowpeak / primus / fire maple canister stove for not much money and don't think twice.

[Terry G]

Reading back over the posts, I have to give a +1 for Sumi's comments.

Good, practical advice.

[Loki Cuthbert]

You can cash out your dividend in July. Spend your dividend money on buying that tarptent you want.

-loki

[Jim Colten]

You can cash out your dividend in July.

WHAT? Wait until July to get new gear?

YOU are to BPL what the Grinch is to Christmas! he-he

[Sean M]

Thanks to all of the responses I think I have narrowed down some of my decisions. First off I will continue to educate myself through this forum, books, and most importantly personal experience. I just need/want to get out there and enjoy the experience that in turn will tell me what I need.

However for now I plan on getting a Big Agnes Air Core for a sleeping pad as I can get it fairly cheap and for the most part its fairly light. While sleeping on this I can then gauge what I like or dislike and determine from there. I do like the Exped products though as well as the new Q-Core but the dimension discrepancies scare me.
I also plan to get the Snow Peak Starter Kit, again I need the whole system and I like the weight, versatility, and ease of use this product allows me. I may convert later to alcohol and may even try it a few times as I go out but again the actual cooking experience will tell me what I need and how I usually cook in the outdoors.

As far as the tent I am going to take Ian’s advice and try to find the Hi-Tec V-Lite 2 for now, that tent appears to serve my immediate needs and its light both on the pocket book and in the pack. This will service the immediate goal of getting outdoors and again will allow be to learn what I want in a tent without putting forth a lot of initial money. Once I upgrade I could always use in other adventures or give it to a scout group or what like. If I am unable to find this tent I will just borrow or rent a tent for those times since I have that option.

I just wanted to let you all know my plan since you help in me determining it. Anybody have any experience with the equipment they could share, or other input about my plans?

[Loki Cuthbert]

@jim well I would personally take the money out of the rainy day fund and spend it now with a promissory note to put the money back when July comes around.

I was generally trying to say don't buy something that you don't really want when you can spend your dividend money on buying the TT you truly desire

Also I don't really see the point in having a light weight beater tent for shorter trips or car camping. You still will want your light tent for short trips and you would probably be better of with a giant palace of a tent if you where car camping.

-loki

[Sean M]

I just wanted to give you all an update on what I chose as well as thanks for all of the great ideas.

I came to the conclusion a heavy expensive tent was not what I needed so I decided on the tent Ian mention from Big 5, its light, roomy and best of all inexpensive which is exactly what I was looking for. I could use this tent so that I no longer have an excuse and if I don’t it was a relatively cheap purchase. BY using this tent it will allow me to determine what I like or dislike how I sleep/camp so that when I purchase a new tent I know what I want. As an added bonus I found a coupon online for 20% off a single item at Big 5 bringing the tent price down to $39.99 – for a 3lb tent, not bad.

As far as the pad I wasn’t to keen on sleeping on a CCF pad so I ended up getting a Big Agnes Air Core pad from REI outlet for $30.00 which I purchased with some of my dividend. I again figured for the price it will do its job and in the meantime I could find what I dislike or like about the pad. I didn’t need something with much insulation considering I will only be doing 3-season outings for now and my current bag is a little overkill anyways.

As far as the stove, I splurged a little more on this purchase, and initially was undecided between a few like the JetBoil or alcohol. I wanted something with flexibility as well as ease of use considering I don’t plan to have many complicated meals. I figured since I needed a whole cooking set and not just a stove that the SnowPeak Starter Kit with SnowPeak GigaPower and the Trek 700 pot/mug would give me the most options as well as weight and use.

I am happy with all of my purchase and a friend and I are already planning to go out to Wishon Reservoir in the Sierra’s here this weekend in order to try out my new kit. It’s actually just an excuse to get out and enjoy the outdoors which I hope to do a lot more, so thank you all I am sure I will have many more questions.

[Ian]

Sounds like you've made some great purchases and kudos to you for finding some great bargains. I have the Soto ODR and have never owned the SP stove. It has a solid reputation and I'm sure you'll be happy with it.

Happy trails! BTW if you ditch the bag and the tent pole (replace with trekking pole), the tent will be closer to 2.5 lbs. It looks like they changed the vestibule so I'd be interested in seeing what you think of it.

Edit: Do I understand correctly that these tents are now taped and do not need seam sealing? If so then wow!

[Sean M]

Thanks Ian.

And Yes, it specifically said tent has its seams taped. I think I said Wow too at the weight/price. How has the vestibule changed? I will report back after this weekend with my initial thoughts.

[Ian]

I'm setting mine up this weekend. I'll take pictures of it and post it on this thread later. It's been a few months but if memory serves, the vestibule on mine comes to a point (only requiring one stake) whereas yours is flat and appears to need two. (Edit: disregard. Looked at it again and no changes)

I find this shelter is spacious when I'm sharing it with one of my kids and the vestibule has ample room to shelter our gear.

[Adam Rothermich]

Sounds like you found some great deals!

As far as the cookset goes, I also started with the SP700 and Ti spork and still use them. I really like that it has graduations on the inside to measure volume. That alone makes me grab it over the MSR Titan kettle most of the time. One tip: The lid is way heavy, replace it with some aluminum foil.

Regarding the tent, that Hi-tec reminds me a lot of the Eureka Zeus 2 I started with. Man I hated that thing! Nothing I tried would alleviate the condensation inside it. Even sleeping solo in it with the vestibule open. But the humidity here plays a large roll in that and I have to deal with condensation in pretty much every shelter I've tried. The thing that made the Eureka so miserable was that with two people inside it was so tight you couldn't help but touch the walls and soak everything. But the important thing is that you've finally got everything you need and are planning a trip! Let us know how it goes!

Adam

[John S.]

http://loomisadventures.com/gear/hi-tec-v-lite-2-tent-review

[Ian]

Adam,

I only lived in Missouri for one year but I certainly don't miss your humidity. It's quite a bit drier here and I haven't had any condensation issues with this shelter yet. In fairness, it only sees limited use when I'm camping with my kids but I find that it's ventilated well. MMMV if I were in your neck of the woods though.

Edit: I agree with the OP on the link above that there is some sag but I was able to mitigate this by adjusting the guy lines. I also have only used it in light rain and not what the author was describing. When I purchased it, I realized that I was buying a $50 tent and kept realistic expectations. I plan on using it during some rain storms this spring and I'll report back on my experiences with it.

v/r

Ian

[Sean M]

I can confirm that yes the new, or current model does have the twin stake out points for the front vestibule. I too will take and post some pictures from this weekends use and let everyone know.

Adam– Honestly that was a huge selling point for me as well (measurements). Its more efficient to only use what you need as far as time and fuel goes. I am happy to hear that it has served you well I too hope its a staple of my kit, so far I like it. Also thanks for the lid tip. I'll definitely update the thread upon my return and let you all know how it went.

John– I haven't used the tent so I really can't comment too much however for my planned use; solo, summer/fair weather use it was difficult to pass up this tent. Obviously due to the price my expectations are realistic. But I don't plan to use with another person so that will alleviate me hitting the walls and as far as the pitch I will mess with it in hopes of negating the sag but even with it I don't expect much of any rain during my uses. Also condensation won't be much of a problem here as well since its normally not too humid here.

For what its worth I will use and report back with my findings hopefully the tent has been restructured and works better but I am confident it will preform well in the conditions I plan to use.

[Adam Rothermich]

I should have mentioned that I have absolutely no experience with the Hi-tec tent. The general shape sort of reminded me of my first backpacking tent and I just rambled on from there :D Its hard to imagine any tent designed as poorly as the Eureka Zeus. They're still suckering people into it today by calling it the "Classic"!

Come to think of it, Missouri in the summer months is probably the ideal place to see if a single wall tent has effective ventilation. Henry Shires, if you need to test any new tents let me know!

Adam

[Sean M]

Well, just to give a general update I did happen to make it out this past weekend although it was more of a base camp situation rather than backpacking I did take all of my backpacking gear to 'test' in a safe environment. Overall everything worked great, the temperatures were in the mid 30's at night and mid 60's during the day so I was able to find my comfort spot with clothing.

I also wanted to report back regarding the tent as I said I would as well. After initially setting up I didn't have an issue with sagging at all. I was however slightly disappointed with the size inside. The tent is described as a 2-person tent and while that may be possible I didn't find it would be the best case scenario with my given needs and size. I am 6'3" 195 and I'll be the first to admit I do like my space. My only other complaint was the interior usable space; since the slope of the tent from the center pole to the rear is so steep it doesn't leave much room to move around. For instance the height at the rear is about a foot high where the apex in about 43 if I remember correctly. Therefore the back half of the tent is unusable with out laying down granted that is where your feet will be but I found that a tad restricting when entering and exiting. I did have a little bit of condensation during the evenings that rubbed on my bag, due to the low height of the rear, but for me not much of an issue.

Overall I was generally content with the tent as my expectation were realistic and given the price and weight think its a good beginning tent and suits my needs. I enjoyed my trip and look forward to other outings soon.

I'll try to put up some pictures I snapped as well. Thanks again everyone.

[Paul Magnanti]

The most important gear item is what is between your head! :)

I may get banned from this forum and have to turn in my Real Outdoors Person (TM) membership card, but gear is the least important part of backpacking.

When I started backpacking, I had an old external frame pack, a Campmor Hollofill II (synthetic bag), a Eureka Tent with fiberglass poles, an old cookpot, an acrylic sweather and a Coleman 1 burner propane stove (which I still have and use! Great for truck bivvy's before a backpacking trip at the trailhead)

If you notice the gear, it is heavy and bulky, but serviceable. I knew enough to not wear cotton jeans, but at 22 yo was in no position to buy "real" backpacking gear.

I hiked the White Mountains with a buddy and then solo. And learned to love the wilderness.

Two years later, I was on top of Katahdin with a smile on my face as I just thru-hiked the AT.

And after THAT I moved to Colorado.

Over the course of the years, I started getting the "right" gear and clothing that fit the style of backpacking. I learned to appreciate the lightness of down after I saved my pennies. And that aluminum poles work a lot better than fiberglass!

It is laudable to buy the "right" gear but frankly you won't know what is the "right" gear until you use it and gain experience. A tarp may not work well for you. Everyone loves inflatable mattresses..except for Luddites like me who can't stand them. :) An alcohol stove IS light and cheap..but maybe you want to cook more? You get the idea.

A good sleeping bag is well, a good investment. Other than that? Too easy to get gear paralysis and not actually gain the experience and love for the outdoors you need.

Try using things you may already have. Buy a few choice items you know won't change too much (again, like a sleeping bag)but don't sweat the gear too much. Just get out there and go hiking! You'll learn far more from getting out there than any REI gear sale. :)

Finally, I wrote an article for going on the cheap. You won't want to follow ALL the ideas..but they are still ideas that may help:
http://www.pmags.com/300-gear-challenge

EDIT: Maybe I should have read the whole thread. :) Looks you are getting out there..coolio.

[Stephen M]

Well said Mr. Mags :-)

[Phillip Asby]

You've met your primary goal – which is getting (back) outside!

I'm a newbie – learning to camp/backpack right along with my scout son. There are all kinds of rabbit holes you can lose yourself in when starting/restarting and I've gone down plenty of them. You've already avoided the first real mistake I made which was buying stuff on the cheap not knowing any better that is now much too heavy/bulky for anything other than car camping and is not really worth trying to sell.

I agree with all the comments about how personal this can be. I backpack with guys who seem to happily carry overstuffed Baltoro 85 packs that have to weigh 40-50 pounds without food/water. These guys literally pack in bags of charcoal to cook (4-5 pounds at least). Talk about commitment. This past trip my base weight was 19 and change which is not any feat around here but still not bad considering where I started (and I had some luxuries folks here would put me to the guillotine over!). I've tried 3 pads, the third being an Exped Synmat 7 (not the UL) which changed my view of what a good nights sleep could be in the outdoors. Some folks are fine on 1/2 of foam. Etc…

Personally – I think the choices you've made are good ones. Even if you go to an alcohol setup that 700 pot will almost always be worth using. Same for the spork. And I use my Gigapower regularly – just a great all around stove and easily sellable if you find it collecting dust. And the inflatable pad for me at least is the answer over other options at least for the moment. I'll only give up the Synmat 7 for a lighter insulated pad…

I think shelters are the trickiest for me at least to get right. You have to have one and at some point no pun intended start putting stakes in the ground and getting some data points. Sort of like a stove I don't think a decent light double walled tent is ever a bad investment as there will likely be some conditions in the future you may want one (ex. shift to hammocks but not a full over/under quilt setup and want to go to the ground in colder temps – a few guys in our troop do that).

I've spent far too much time pondering and fretting – sort of my nature admittedly – with gains not necessarily proportional to the mental energy I've expended.

[Nick Gatel]

"The most important gear item is what is between your head! :)

I may get banned from this forum and have to turn in my Real Outdoors Person (TM) membership card, but gear is the least important part of backpacking."

Well said. I hate those trips when I accidentally leave my brain at home. I once did a long hike with with Levi's and am still alive to tell about it.

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