which tent to get

Paul –
I can’t tell from looking at the warmlite.com site. Do the Stephenson tents come with mosquito netting? There was no mention of this in the description of the tent.

Thanks.

Not sure. Don’t own one. I think this question should be addressed to & ans. by Donald.

gotta put my two bobs worth in here! ;) My self (6’1″, 187lbs) and my lusty wench (6’2″, 157lbs) are in the great position to walk in Europe (Swiss, France, Italy and soon Norway), New Zealand and Australia. After converting to lightweight ideas and trying a few tent/sleeping arrangements out, we have settled for a Hex 3 (w walking poles), a BMW bivy and I use a Marmot Hydrogen w down vest if needed. Bug proof, very rain and blown rain resistant, when pegged out it is amazingly quiet in a big blow but the best thing is versatility. We can have just the bivys in nice weather, the bivys as groundsheets for the bags in nice weather and no mossies, the Hex is very roomy for those rainy mornings where you are cooking inside and it is no bother to be there for awhile if the weather closes in while you are watching Ibex at play! what a winner!

OK I m going to weigh in here, too, even though you have a lot of good advice coming your way.

I owned for about 2 hours the BD Firstlight tent. Got it because of the extensive review that This site gave to it. I am 6’3″ so right away I had a problem. I am too tall for this tent, but if I were 5’8″ as you are this would have been my dream tent. Very Light, easy to set up, easily 4 season but great for 3 season. Lots of head room and good ventilation flow through. THe problems with wet through that have been addressed here on this posting are interesting. But I would ask you: How many days are you going to be backpacking where you will encounter 9 hours of rain? Is this a “real” problem?

Look, read the extensive review on this site and I believe that you will find it an excellent tent with great capabilities for your intended uses. There is no perfect tent. But there are good compromises that meet most of your needs.

Good Luck and let us all know how you faired.

9hrs of rain? depends upon where you live. 9hrs is not exactly unusual where i live – Southern New England.

in fact right now as i write this (1538 EDT), the skies have let loose starting ~15min ago. T-storm ~1″ to 2″ per hour rate w/lots of air-to-gnd lightning – it’s let up a little now – large drops closer to perhaps 1″ per hour rate. obviously, it will lighten up a bit once the T-storm passes. T-storm will pass soon, unless another cell rolls in, but rain may continue until daybreak tomorrow according to the online weather forecast for my zip code. if so, it will be ~13.5 hrs of continuous rain.

addendum…

…this just in…rainfall is no longer getting lighter, it’s really started to come down now (1553 EDT) – even harder than shortly after it all started. glad my house isn’t made of Epic (…look, i really like Epic fabric & use bivies, pants, & windshirts made of Epic. however, i’m just not sure how long i can trust it to not leak in mod-to-hvy rains.) maybe if i had more guts or less sense, i might take the time to personally conduct an experiment with me as the guinea pig.

final entry…

…it’s getting interesting now (~1614 EDT) boys & girls. rain extremely heavy (a torrential downpour) – worse than my bathroom shower nozzle. looking south, the sky is gettin’ that characteristic color i’ve only seen perhaps 10 or 12 times here in CT – greenish-gray. we don’t get many tornados here – at least not big ones except for a couple of times. in one my sister’s old house lost the entire unattached garage & an 80′ tall oak tree right next to it, but the house, just 20′ away was unscathed – EVERY tree along a “path” or swath in the neighborhood left only ~15′ high – very funny looking driving through the neighborhood a few days afterwards once all of the downed power lines were cleared.

final edit of final entry…

i should clarify: it appeared that the funnel touched down at an intersection of two streets & proceeded down the street – trees lining on both sides of the street gone above ~15′ AGL (above gnd level) & all leaves stripped off of remaining branches. appeared to make a hard ‘louie’ between two houses (one being my sister’s) & straight on over the garage & the oak tree, leaving only the concrete slab behind – no debris whatsoever from the garage or oak tree. then, magically vanished as no damage beyond that point. oh…BTW…1st T-storm passed now (!1637 EDT, so only 70 or so minutes of activity for the first one), rain lighter (maybe half-inch per hour or a bit less), but another cell is now gettin’ closer.

Don’t think that Epic could survive this one by the time it’s over – eVENT, now that’s another story. However, there still is a place for Epic in my gear arsenal.

Second the above. Nine hours of rain isn’t uncommon.

Say it’s only 5pm, but it’s pouring and your buddies have stopped to set up camp. Your EPIC predicament: Do you set up camp now — and risk your tent wetting out (5pm to 6am is 13 long hours!) — or do you delay and play it safe?

Sorry,I can’t let this be the last word on some of the most impressive tents out there. The 9 hours of Benjamin’s experience w/ an Epic tent is not necessarily what everyone will experience. For example, my BD tent has yet to wet out and has been subjected to considerably harsher real world conditions. I don’t feel the need to strategically plan when I’ll set up my shelter. In fact I’ve only gained ever increasing confidence in the use of these Epic canopied gems.

But this has all more or less been said before by me. Possibly on this very thread.

Personally, you’d have to pry the Lighthouse out of my dead,stiff, frostbitten hands before I’d give it up. You should be so lucky. (insert a big old smiley face with tongue sticking out,here)

Hi Kevin:

No need to feel tense over it. The Firstlight is an absolutely fantastic tent — light as heck and easy as heck to set up.

There are many places where rain is intermittent — I am thinking of rapid-moving fronts in desert areas, for example. There, Epic will more than hold its own, and its lucky occupant will get to enjoy minimal (if any) condensation — a problem that plagues all users of waterproof tents!

But my personal experience is a damp tent with small puddles of water after nine hours of rain. Indeed, I have read user reviews of wetting out after just five hours! This doesn’t mean that the tent will always wet out within those time frames, of course, but it is at least a probability.

Given that, I believe it is important for prospective buyers (esp. those who use down bags) to know that when they use this tent under the rain, there is a clock ticking, even if the alarm is set many hours away.

Ben–Intermittent rain ? Desert use? I find that somewhat risible. Especially given the workout my tent has had in the 2nd wettest Spring up here in the Northwest since the 19th century. Tempting fate,to an even greater extreme, I use a down bag.

But experiences will vary.

I often find myself in agreement with your equipment assessments in other posts and forums, but we do rather diverge on this.

Pax

Yup, like ‘they’ always say — your experience may vary.

bene e pacem.

Anulos qui animum ostendunt omnes gestemus!

and on that note–good night.

To Kevin & Ben,

Were both of your Epic shelters seamed sealed? If not, could this acct. for the diff in pers. exper.???

I own a BD Lightsabre. One of my favorite bivy shelters for obvious reasons. However, i don’t use it if i know heavy or long duration rains are in the forecast. Yes…i do carry a poncho tarp as rain gear, so if i wasn’t so abysmal at pitching it properly, i could count on the p-t to keep most of the rain off of the LtSbr.

I do find that, when wearing my Epic windshirt, my arms almost never wet through when extending from my poncho even after hours in the rain. However, that’s my forearms. I don’t mind if they get wet. My bag, gear, & body is another story.

Last night’s rains ended early. Only ~6 hrs of rain & some light sprinkles for a while afterwards – don’t know how long – fell asleep, but rain had stopped by 0315 when i got up for work. Just during the heavy part we got 4″ in just a tad over 4hrs & a bit over 4″ total. result = a bit of flooding in low areas & some road closures in low areas due to flooding.

I’m a little leery of finding out if the LtSbr would have survived wetting through under these conditions via a field experiment w/o some input fr/more knowledgeable & experienced individuals like yourselves. i think i know what Ben will say, but not sure if Kevin feels the Epic fabric employed in the LtSbr would have survived such heavy rains. Do y’all think my seam-sealed LtSbr could have survived? Please give me you input. I’d appreciate it.

Kevin,

not sure what you meant by this. are we still playing nice with one another?

the latin teacher in high school was quite knowledgeable (he was so old, latin might have been his native tongue!), i however am not. my latin is very rusty (& so is my greek for that matter, though my greek is quite a bit better). ‘anulos’ can be translated a few diff ways, & so could give rise to very diff. meanings. also, when coupled with ‘animum’ might take on a very bad modern day slang meaning – Jerome or Augustine of Hippo would never have intended it that way however. if this is what you mean by it, then a better word could have been used than ‘animum’ perhaps.

‘gestemus’ (had to look this one up for it’s conjugation & meanings) = 1pers pres act subj for “wear” (“i might be wearing/”i might wear” in english, perhaps), “bear”, or “carry”. this is the part of the sentence that confuses the entire meaning for me. i know that i’m not the sharpest tool in the shed, so what am i missing here?

not sure of the meaning of the sentence, would you care to translate, or should we just have the BPL editors remove your post due to its possible meaning? they could then trash mine (i.e. this post) also to preserve “thread continuity”.

of course, another possible understanding does result in a very nice proverb. i’m not real clear on a precise translation of this understanding either, but get the general idea. are some of the words are not inflected properly? could this be what is confusing me?
(“what fetters [not the best xltn of anulos] the mind/spirit reveals all/every weight” – is this what you’re saying? i’m not going to give the alternative more vulgar translation.)

bona nox [both vocative case, so xlt’d “good night” (…”to you”, implied by the vocative case)].

p.s.

if you feel both Ben & i are missing the boat on Epic, then perhaps the following would be appropriate:

“Si coecus coeco ducatum praestet, ambo in foveam cadunt” which means “If a blind man a blind one leads [or leadership exercises], both into a pit fall.”, or in better English: “If a blind man leads a blind man, both will fall into a pit.”

Here’s a Latin slogan for all L/UL trekkers, esp. y’all out west who sometimes (most of the time???) actually risk your lives/well-being in the high Rockies in inclement weather or are exposed to conditions which at times are not compatible with human life unless you know what you’re doing (…me…i’m just a wimp. i generally don’t take risks any longer. i do, however, truly admire what y’all do in terms of the terrain y’all traverse, your unsupported treks, and the like.):

between your gear & your skills, y’all are (or should be):

Nunquam non paratus!!!
Never……..not…prepared!!!

Jacob,… this slogan would also apply to you since you ‘walkabout’ in a place where anything that bites you could kill you (such is my uneducated, naive impression of your great Country & its fauna…hey…even some of its flora can be downright nasty if it rubs up against your skin, right?!).

PJ–we are absolutely playing nice with each other.
That little latin tag was an attempt at a humorous non sequitor in a case of escalating latinisms.
Translated–” Let’s all wear mood rings”
I could have just as easily have written “Nunc est bibendum”–now it’s time to drink.

Can’t comment on the Light Sabre as I have not used it.I have used goretex bivy-tents and based on those experiences,I would be concerned about continually coming into contact with the shelter material and causing leakage (thru wicking? stress on seams? oil contamination?) in the face of heavy precip.

My fortunate experiences may be attributed to pitching tauntly, keeping tent clean,not touching sidewalls,and decent seam sealing inspected before each trip. In short,good sense.

Perhaps there are manufacturing variances in the production of Epic ‘malibu” fabric that can account for our differing takes.

But enough of this–it’s time to fetishize another piece of gear. Lets.

A little off topic.

Your absolutely right PJ, We do seem to have extremely disproportionate numbers of dangerous little beasties here. Something like 9/10 of the most deadly snakes and spiders are about the same. Plenty of plants too will give you a nice bite if your not careful (though just out of general knowledge the antidotes for these plants usually grow within a few yards of the plants). I’ve seen a few people using leaves as TP and having a not so pleasant surprise.

However having said this, maybe its not all it’s made out to be. I understand these features of Australia become general knowledge and assumed truth in most countries, as do American aspects displayed by hollywood in other countries. I grew up in the bush (Aussie terms for backcounty) and I’ve been barefoot for quite a while. In all my times wandering I’ve never encountered any problems. In fact the only bad thing in this context that I have seen was on a 2 week long training week for cadets (our version of ROTC). A kid was hit by a snake and had to get help. Luckily we were on a huge military base/ training ground. ( Actually I remember hauling those huge army packs around, I packed mine light and used to carry some of my friends gear to get a little pocket money.)

One of the most valuable things for hiking amongst all that I learned in the years I spent in the cadet corp was first aid for use in the field. They taught us first aid every week for years. Whilst I didn’t enjoy it so much then it has paid off in the long run. Since then I have done first aid certificates and increased my skills. I think if anyone wishes to hike that a first aid course is a must. The reason I take so few first aid items is because I feel like I know what I’m doing if something went wrong. Thankfully I haven’t had to use the knowledge for anything more than a splinter removal yet.

Kevin,

“rings” is a good translation of “anulos” (both “anus”/”anuses”(pl. sp.???) & “fetters” are also correct, but perhaps not as common)

i’m a bit skeptical of some of the rest of your translation though. yours is a pretty “loose” translation of some of those Latin words. no offense intended, but your latin appears to have accumulated more rust than mine. though your sense of humor is obviously better developed than my weird sense of humor.

also, your gear/backpacking knowledge seems to be of a much higher nature though (and far superior to mine).

…and on this website, that’s what is important (not Latin).

thanks for replying and giving me advice.

i think we’ll just blame steve irwin (sp???) & paul hogan for givin’ us the wrong ideas ’bout the “Land-down-under”. ;)

Verndal Lee

There’s not any netting on the door except at the upper and lower vents, that’s why I think it is is best to get the Side Windows. Great Tent though, Mine weighs in @ 3/lbs on my digital scales.

Paul:

I sealed my tent inside and out before exposing it to the rain.

Thanks Ben. good to know. guess, i won’t be takin’ any chances then.

PJ–you are too kind. My Latin is indeed a rusty west coast geek latin. “anulos” was indeed meant to be “ring” and nothing vulgar. But in the interest of clarity,in future I will stick to living languages!

citius altius fortius…et linter

higher,faster, stronger….and lighter

and now back to Tents.

Kevin,

that one i knew w/o the xltn (i’ve watched the Olympic Games also). like your addition, though, but “linter” is, if i am not mistaken, a small boat like a dingy. instead, try…

citius altius fortius…et levius (light/lightly or nimble/nimbly, depending upon the context, i.e. used as an adj or adv). also, to adhere to your latin word order, translate it “swifter, higher, stronger …and lighter”

we get our english word levitate/levitation from “levius” & its cognates.

why should only major universities have all the fun with Latin slogans?!! but then…hopefully, we’re grads of Dr. J’s BPL U.

bona fortuna,
pj

akkk! a senior moment at 40 ! of course it’s levius.
that’s enough levity, now, back to our sponsor.

Um, once again showing my ignorance, pray tell, what are “mood rings”?

Back in the late sixties, early seventy’s (can still be found though) you could get a ring with a stone in it that changes colours based on your body temperature. Amount of moisture may have been taken into account as well. Along with the ring came a card that explained the different colours meaning, i.e. black=bad mood, blue=cheerful, green=sensual or whatever the code was.