Patagonia Encapsil Belay Parka Reverse Engineered

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What an amazing amount of intrigue over a *jacket*. I worked in a major pharmaceutical research facility and got an inkling of the paranoia regarding industrial espionage. Clothing seems so mundane.

This little episode has been very educational about the marketing of outdoor equipment and the relationship with the Internet and the review process.

It stikes me as anti First Amandmendment to suppress information, and more so after the product has been announced and obvious that retail versions were circulating, to the point that a salesperson could write an order and have the item shipped to a paying customer. It had to be in the retail sales computer system. Note there were assumably 27 other jackets floating around.

I'm trying to imagine what kind of club Patagoinia had to wield after their sales blunder. Weird.

"They publically justify the CO2 washing as being more ecological sensitive than a conventional washing machine wash"

That's pretty funny Richard – marketing people taking a negative and spinning it as a positive

So after I pay $700 I have to send it in to have it washed twice a year or it becomes a 'normal" $700 jacket?

its generally in the interest of those selling "premium" products to control the message …

one would expect that for 700 smackaroos you would at least know the amount of down fill …

the interesting question i have … is what happens when should you wash the jacket like any other down jacket ;)

Eric,

Silicone coated down (Encapsil) will, theoretically, slowly degrade in loft to the original 800 fill level and water resistance do to microscopic exfoliation of the silicone from wet flex cycles such as movement or stuffing. Avoiding the use of washing machine will dramatically reduce the number of wet flex cycles and extend the garments useful life.

Most of the other down DWR products use fluorocarbons (Downtek, etc). They will, theoretically, more quickly degrade in water resistance do to the chemical spikes getting knocked down from dampness and/or abrasion. You can reactive them a limited number of times by washing without detergent residue and drying via approximately 140F temps and 1/2 hour duration.

The major manufacturers who have chosen not to incorporate DWR down in their products most frequently cite these justifications:

-DWR related loft reduction (initially for fluorocarbon or with use for silicone)
-Unacceptable DWR degradation with use
-Although the treated down is water resistant, it will eventually wet-out, leaving you to ask, "Why don't I just wear a hard shell over it?"

hmmmmm …

a jacket that one cant wash normally … thats "improvement" for you ;)

i wonder if the degradation of regular DWR down is a huge concern … with how often most people wash their down jackets

i wear and sleep in my down vest and jacket daily in the winter to save on heating costs … i wonder how fast the down or the "encapsulation" would degrade with daily use

Hi Richard,

I'm wondering how you're extrapolating these values. Seems that 1000 FP down should be 25% warmer per weight than 800 FP down. 5.56 iclo seems pretty low for this jacket given your other measured values. For example if the MB Permafrost has 255g of 800 FP down and iclo of 5.29 surely the 247g of 1000FP down in the Encapsil should add much more than 5% extra warmth. I would guess that the Encapsil should have an iclo of about 6.4.

JC,

I am currently in Bali and only occasionally have an Internet connection. I will make this brief; your assumption that iClo improves proportionately with fill power is wrong. The algorithm I use for fill power differences is from actual lab testing of identical items with different fill power down.

Is there any new news on Encapsil? Is Patagonia going to make any other products using this technology. Seems strange. If it is so great, why are we not hearing about other new products in the works?

From the ISPO artiocle: "Rab is a launch partner for Nikwax hydrophobic down"
Nikwax built an empire on hydrophobic stuff, do they know anything others don't know?

Fall 2015….. you're gonna see the return of Encapsil to the entire down line.

Bobby,

I wonder will all these items have to be returned to Patagonia for cleaning.