The New “Worlds lightest cannister stove”?

> Do the jets get clogged only when canister is inverted?
Well … I have to say I have never (as far as I can remember) had a blockage when operating with the canister upright and stable.

But I have certainly had several different blockages with an inverted canister. I believe there have been two causes for me, although I do know of a common third one which applies to non-inverted operation as well.

1: Dirt in the canister. Not usually a problem with good brand canisters (ie from Western companies), but a Chinese canister which was co-branded with Primus was appalling! A very fine brown dust, in quantity!

2: Poor purity in the gas, leaving some complex paraffins there. The paraffins are dissolved in the butane/propane and would normally remain at the bottom of the canister. They don't boil off. But they do get to the needle valve when the canister is inverted, and can gum it up.

The Coleman PowerMax may be off the market now (sob!), but those canisters were RELIABLE.

The third method of getting a blockage is letting dirt get into the Lindal valve or into the base of the stove. I know this happens when people are just not aware of the need to be careful.

The guy in the video? Dunno. I would need to strip his stove down to see. But betcha the filter is dirty.

Cheers

I thought I remember you saying that Roger

It sort of takes away from a canister being so simple and reliable compared to other stoves

But, if you know how to clean your valve/filter maybe not so big a deal

> if you know how to clean your valve/filter maybe not so big a deal
See our article on Stove Maintenance
It is really pretty simple.

Cleaning the valve in the canister is dead simple. Just pop the valve open for a second – OUTSIDE of course. Blast any much out. If a persistent problem, do it upside down to get a puff of ‘washing’ liquid out.
What to use to poke the valve? Try the hook end of a Ti wire stake. That works wonderfully.

> It sort of takes away from a canister being so simple and reliable compared to other stoves
Well, not really. Keep stove and canister clean, always put the plastic cap back on the canister after use, and you might go for years without needing any maintenance. That’s simple!

Cheers

You should probably know how to clean it out anyway, so if it gets clogged in the field you can fix it.

There's this little pin that keeps the valve from coming out. I tried pushing it out with small nail (brad) and pliers or hammer but it's pretty solid.

Danger… about to break stove… better stop…

From your article "In some cases there is a tube-pin stopping the valve from being removed. To remove that in the field is very hard; you might want to remove it at home and leave it out. Come on, you are not going to keep opening the valve up in the field until it falls out of the stove, surely?"

I tried squeezing a bit of nail into the hole with pliers – got pretty good force on it – won't budge

Put stove back together and it still works – maybe I should quit before I break it : )

I've ordered a 300T. Has anyone else used one on a trip since this thread was started?

It presses out fairly easily. I have done many. In fact, I always do it before taking any stove into the field so I can field strip the needle valve and clean it.

Select broken drill bit of the right size (ie slightly smaller in diameter), mount in chuck of drill press, place stove on a support of some sort which a hole in the middle, and press out.

I use a short off-cut of tent pole tubing as the support.
Do not have the drill bit too long as that might let it bow and break.
Press out from the side where the pin is recessed.
Nails are, I think, too soft for this. On the other hand, a miniature pin punch (if small enough) would be super.

Cheers

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Added later.
If you go to the first post in this thread you will see the stove. The shiny top of the pin is clearly visible. In this case, you push the pin out from underneath. The pin is not full length, so you can nock whatever you use as a push rod in pretty easily when the unit is upside down.

As Roger said. Note however that the pin will usually press out more easily in one direction than the other – one end of the pin often has a serrated pattern pressed into it and this is the end you want to come out first. I don't have this stove so I can't tell you which end this is, so you will have to try yourself. If you can get the pin moved so 1/8" is protruding and this end is smooth, try pressing in the other direction.

Tracksterman's latest video on the stove is interesting, is it a dud or is it a design problem?

Tracksterman Video

Edited by rogerb on 12/06/2012 12:40:25 MST.

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The jet need to clean.
I think the jet was clogged.

Roger Caffin wrote: Forgive me if I sound biased, but my personal opinion is that the Pocket Rocket is a really good stove to avoid! Any of the latest generation of stoves would be miles better. (eg ones from Snow Peak, Fire Maple, Kovea …)

Cheers

Here, here. I’ve never quite understood the devoted following the PR has. It’s just not that good of a stove. It’s an older generation. The stove world has moved on.

HJ
Adventures In Stoving

Tracksterman clearly has a dud. Other FMS-300T’s (Roger’s) appear to be working fine, but I do worry a bit about Chinese stove manufacturer’s quality control in general.

When I see stoves from Kovea, Snow Peak, MSR, etc (possibly all of them actually made by Kovea), the fit, finish, and design are much more advanced, which inspires greater confidence in me.

Still, the Chinese are doing interesting things in terms of lightening stoves up and trying new designs, and for that I commend them.

HJ
Adventures In Stoving

My pot slid off a Coleman Exponent F1 Ultralight once, but that was my own stupidity. I now have a windscreen attached to my pot, which aslo prevents it from sliding off.

I've been using my Pocket Rocket for a while.

Roger says the flame is too concentrated in the center. Now, in one way, it doesn't matter, it spreads out from there so it doesn't matter. I just boil water. Except, I simmer oatmeal for just a bit before I turn it off, and sometimes there's a burned spot at the bottom if I don't turn it down and stir it vigorously. But the Exponent was almost as bad. Next time I'll get a different stove.

The fact that it's old technology is good in a way. Proven. PR weighs 3 ounces. Other stoves weigh 1.5 or 2 ounces so that hardly matters. Efficiency is identical.

I just glanced at the new lighter weight Pocket Rocket and it appears to have the same burner that's concentrated in the center.

I was thinking in terms of pot stability and compactness as well as the durability of the pot supports. There are so many stoves that are SO much better than the PR.

In terms of efficiency, I don’t think you’re going to see a drastic difference unless you use something like a Jetboil.

HJ
Adventures In Stoving

Does anybody have a good source to buy the Fire Maple 300T? All the ebay ones come from China and I need mine by April 05.

If you can't find the fire maple 300T, their next lightest model the 116t aka monatauk gnat(1.69oz) is on sale $47.96 @ campsaver.

The snow peak lite max(1.9oz) is also on sale $50.96

Thanks I ordered the Gnat

That’s a really good price on the Lite Max which is a much more compact stove than the Gnat and has really good pot stability.

HJ
Adventures In Stoving

I've been having an issue with the hornet on a few trips. After screwing it to the canister (as tight as it will reasonably go) and lighting it, the flame sputters and grows low after about 30 seconds. I checked the thread and found that I was now able to screw it even tighter. Thermal expansion of the titanium or aluminium canister?
This allowed the stove to burn as normal for another 30 seconds or so before the flame dropped again.
I don't think it's a blockage, or it would surely be present every time I use the stove.

Hi AD

Don't screw the stove on too tight. You will just strip the thread on the stove.

Dying flame – that's not 'sputtering. That's a blockage in the jet.You need to remove the jet and clean it, carefully.
Read http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/essential_stove_maintenance.html

Cheers

thanks Roger.
If it were a blocked jet, why would the stove return to a normal flame on the next usage and then suffer the same problem?

I had one canister do that with pocket rocket.

Comes on fine. 30 seconds later gets low so I screw it tighter, then it's okay. Then 30 seconds later same thing. Then it works okay from then on.

Other canisters work just fine.

Must be some tolerance thing with lindal valves on different canisters and the pin on the pocket rocket.

When I remove the outer washer on the pocket rocket, then I can screw it tighter and there's no problem.

After reading Will's recent review I decided to order the Wasp. It was $58 (free shipping) and I ordered it on March 13 from a Hong Kong Ebay seller and received it March 25. That's sooner than expected and they threw in a free Fire Maple shorty titanium spoon. I just weighed it on my scale and it's exactly 45 grams as advertised. I did one burn on it with absolutely no issues.

My first impression was "WOW this thing is super tiny and light". Almost half the weight of my MSR Pocket Rocket (45g vs 84g) and much smaller. Pot stability was "as expected" for such a small 3-point contact stove. I do not think it is any worse or better than the Pocket Rocket's stability. The Wasp is shorter, which makes for a lower center of gravity. My next impression was "this thing sounds like a jet engine". It's louder than the Pocket Rocket on full blast. I was a bit worried that the low stove height could potentially warm and overheat the canister but no issues there. A few folks commented they are worried that it's made in China. I'm not. The Toshiba laptop that I'm typing on says "Made in China" as is probably 90% of what's in my house and most every other U.S. household.

I was perfectly happy with my Pocket Rocket but I think the Fire Maple is a keeper and could become my go to UL Canister stove. Only a long-term field test will tell if I go back to using my trusty Pocket Rocket.

Thanks for posting more pics of the Hornet (it’s the Hornet, right, not the Wasp? Or ??) Looks tiny next to a PocketRocket (which is actually pretty big, but good contrast).

HJ
Adventures in Stoving

Purchased one of these from AliExpress which is frustratingly flawed. The tabs on the three armed ring, just below the burner, are all bent downward where they're supposed to make the vertical turn to hold the pivot to which the pot support arms are attached, completely screwing up the pot support geometry. As result, the pot supports contact the underside of the pot only at their innermost points; the serrated edges extending radially are all bent downward, and hence completely useless.

There's no way this was shipping damage, as the package arrived in good shape, and all three arms are bent–there's no force that could have bent them all, without also crushing the burner assembly

Amazingly cynical behavior on the part of the manufacturer, to ship something this defective.

It's too bad, because otherwise this looks like an excellent, or even an amazing, stove.

The only other potential glitch is that the underside of the block which houses the valve contacts the one canister I tried just about when the inner o-ring is being compressed, limiting further tightening. So if the distance from the top flange of the fuel canister to the inner o-ring seat at the bottom of its well is not precisely controlled, one could get an incomplete seal. On the other hand, if that parameter is well-controlled, the contact is probably a good conduction path for some heat from the burner to reach the canister.

Have managed to separate the damaged ring, and will attempt to re-flatten it, perhaps in a vice.

Does anyone have any suggestions for cold-working titanium?