Brooks-Range Mojave Down Jacket

If they're willing to refund/replace the product and are standing by their specs than maybe you just got a dud. The first runs through any manufacturing plant always have hiccups.

And yes I've seen those reviews (and similar from other sites). Looks like people spouting marketing material in exchange for free gear. They nearly ALL say the same thing, or close enough that it'd flag a plagiarism checking service. I don't buy the immersion tests as valid because as shown on another thread, prolite gear is doing some testing and demonstrating that the water proofness of the DWR downs is marginal at best. Basically down has builtin lanolin that does the same job and the new downs are only better in very specific and not very real world situations. Plus immersion or rain tests actually tax the shell fabric far more than the down itself (and remember rain only happens around and above freezing, temps that should make you roast in such a filled jacket).

While I'm still not convinced it's a true 9oz down jacket since many people say the rab neutrino endurance (8oz) is warmer even though it's fully sewn through, albeit longer cut. Look at the Feathered Friends Helios with 8oz of down. Put on a person they look so much puffier than the mojave.

My guess is that it's 9oz in the largest size offered but in the mediums it probably drops down to the 6-7oz range. Assuming that there aren't two versions floating around Since it's 800fp this would put it on par with say a MB mirage (5.3oz 900fp) or the MHW Hooded Phantom (but with DWR down). Those are warm jackets for sure, just not deep yellowstone winter warm. I'd definitely get a replacement. At the very least they'll probably make sure you get the loftiest jacket in your size that they have in the warehouse and then you will have a nice fluffy DWR down jacket for yourself, regardless of what they sell to everyone else.

I have had a think about it and if I was sending it back I would take the refund as looking at pics online mine has similar loft.

This may be true, but it sounds an awful lot like what every salesman says when one complains that a product doesn't do what it promised. A more constructive attitude, on the part of the company, is to realize that for every person who complains, there are x people, where x is around 5, maybe more, IIRC, who have the same issue but haven't complained, either because they're too busy, or haven't stressed the item to the point where the flaw shows up.

More generally, a lot of our gear is virtual gear, in that what we're really buying when we purchase it is a sense of possibility — "Wow, I could actually survive a blizzard now" — but then it may never leave the closet. I'm as guilty of this as anyone, and I actually get out a quite a bit. So, if you're a manufacturer, the temptation to shade the truth, since so many of us are influenced by stated specs, must be large.

Hi Jim,

It is very possible that I am the first person to complain but they did offer to make it right, it is a shame as I was looking forward to trying out Dwr down.

Anything that comes in to my house get tested out and if its not to scratch it gets sent back if new or if second hand sent to gear swap.

Stephen,

I think your concerns are justified. Take a look at this page:

http://brooks-range.com/Mojave-Down-Jacket.html

It appears the Mojave may contain only 6 oz of down, which would certainly appear to be more consistent with the perceived loft. It also conflicts with the "Specs" tab under the product description.

Is it possible the salesperson you spoke to was simply quoting from Specs?

In any event, the jacket itself doesn't appear to be lofty and warm enough for the reported quantity of down.

Cheers,
A

Hi Andrew,

6oz would seem about right for the amount of loft in the jacket, I have looked at that page many times and it always said 9oz.

When I called Brooks Range yesterday I spoke to the General Manager who also designed the jacket and he swore there was 9oz in it.

Strange…

Steven, I've also checked frequently since they've announce the mojave (and especially since we've discussed the misgivings) and it always said 9oz for me. So it looks like the 9oz is a typo (or they're slowly coming clean). They still claim it's their warmest jacket yet…however others have said the alpini was a tad bit warmer.

Well the alpini has 7.7oz of down, lighter fabric, half zip, and simpler/lighter sewn through construction. It weighs 15 oz.

So take a 15 oz with supposedly 7.7oz of down and bump that exact same jacket up to 9oz. That would give us a jacket of 16.3oz total with zero design changes beyond extra down. Now add partial box baffling, increase the zipper length, and use heavier fabric…that all adds up to probably a 19+oz jacket. But our jacket in question weighs 16. Where did those extra 3 ounces go? Oh they went into the profits column (or the profits of the contracted manufacturing plant which then it's not entirely their fault but still doesn't absolve them).

It has the exact same specs as my 180g (6.4oz) fill weight MHW Hooded Phantom which also weighs almost exactly 16oz.

I think at this point it's safe to assume it's a 6oz fill power jacket with DWR treated down weighing in at a total of a pound. So from 56% down it drops to a realistic, and below average, 37.5% down. Look at the competition, the FF Helios is ~49% down (based off their specs and they're known for lowballing total weight), the impressively warm/light MB Mirage is 41.4%, GoLite Bitterroot is 40.5%, and the Rab Infinity is 43.75% with a 10d pertex quantum fabric.

As a major manufacturer, it seems that sewn through down jackets max out around 50% down and baffled max out somewhere in the low 40%s. Going above that requires using the lightest and most fragile of fabrics and dropping a lot of features that makes the jacket less marketable and not economically viable products (not enough people willing to compromise so much for economies of scale to kick in).

The ONLY parkas I've seen that can actually claim more than 50% down (in the .75 to 1.5 lb total weight range) have ALL been custom made MYOG or Cottage manufacturers. Goosefeet has this capability but notice it's not even hinted at on the webpage as an option. We just hear about these fantastically underpriced custom pieces as members post them.

Unfortunately looks like another case of misleading product specs. It's a shame because if it weren't for the shady specs it'd still be a nice jacket with DWR down at a reasonable price for the category. Instead it's a stain on the integrity or quality control of the company. Hopefully they take care of you!

There's really only one solution. It involves a scale, scissors, and, of course, thorough documentation.

Hi Dustin,

If the Mojave weighed about 370g or had half decent loft at the specced weight it would be a keeper, but when I compare it to my Goosefeet Parka that weighs the same it pails in comparison as it is is fully baffled and 54% of that weight is 900fp down.

I am going to use the money from the refund to get Gooses feet to make me a baffled hosed pullover, it may even replace my Parka which free cash will free up cash for the new winter pack I have on order.

Happy days.

Hi Avery,

I would be up for that if 300 Bpl members sent me a dollar each via PayPal :-)

Yeah, I love your GooseFeet Parka actually. It almost makes me want to leave the desert and move to the cold just so I have an excuse to get one myself ;).

Having Ben make you a new jacket in line with what you need makes more sense. It's hard to argue with custom fit and specs that are lighter than anything available off the shelf.

Well make sure you post the new pullover when you get it. We always love to see more of Ben's work put to good use!

It saw great service this year in sunny Michigan, I managed to use it down to -13f and was still warm in with a pair of box wall down pants.
I say I should have the new one in mid May, if it works out as planned my existing one will be on gear swap.

I have decided to give the Mojave another go and try it out on another trip, if it does not work out then I will definiltey send it back.

Folks,

I forgot to report back I was spoke to Brooks Range about my concerns of the lack of loft and they offered me a refund so I took them up on it.