New Mont Bell Single Wall Tents

Jon,
No apologies necessary, this manufacturer, and these specific tents are probably news to many people browsing this website. I am a big fan of Montbell, and own many of their products, including sleeping bags, a bivy, packs, etc.. However, I chose not to buy the freestanding version of these tents.

I analyzed these tents vs. the competition, and It basically came down to a tossup between the Black Diamond Firstlight and the Montbell Mightydome 2. The BDFL was 270 grams lighter, $100 cheaper, had the poles on the inside (for inclement weather setup), has aftermarket carbon fiber poles available to save a few ounces if I choose to buy them, and will probably have a higher re-sale value because it is a known entity with lots of mountain experience. The MB has .2 more square meters of internal space, and from my in-store inspections seems very well constructed.

I would like to hear from anyone who has a MB tent and has an opinion one way or the other?

Click here for the solo version. It’s in Japanese, but the dimensions information is useful. Solo aside, there are also models for 2, 3 and 4 people. MB also has a companion English-translation site, but for these tents, the site only shows product name and picture — pretty worthless.

Wp/b fabrics work best when it’s cold and dry outside. Is Japan dry in the winter — or still relatively humid? Wonder how MB’s Breeze Dry Tec laminate performs in real life???

Jon, thanks for bringing these tents to our attention. I've been using the double-wall version of the Diamond since spring of 04 and really like the design. Good to see your posting again; Ive missed you over at TLB.

I thought Breeze Dry Tec is waterproof. At least my rain pants and bicycle rain jacket are. No problem even in heavy downpours and breathability a little less so than eVent. I would think the Breeze Dry Tec tents perform better than Mont-Bell's earlier Gore-tex fabrics, especially because in summer when it is very humid in Japan (and for which most of the Mont Bell gear is designed) breathability is a big concern.

Japan is very dry in winter in most areas. Very little precipitation, except for snow in the mountains. So winter performance might be great.

The only reason I didn't buy the Monoframe Diamond is because I have a Hilleberg Akto, which has a vestibule.

Hey, Dondo, it's great to hear from you, too! Yeah, I miss everybody from TLB and here, too.

I've compared Breeze Dry Tec (yup, it's waterproof) against Gore Tex in a head-to-head test between two different versions of the Montbell 2 layer UL bag cover. I observed condensation in both (probably due to overheating), but the BDT version was noticeably better–and cheaper, to boot!

I still think the 2 lb. Terra Nova Laser Competition is the best (price aside) commercially-available lightweight 3 season solo tent around, but the new Mont Bell Breeze Dry Tec Diamond at least equals it in weight. The vestibule on the Laser Comp plus its double wall design make it preferable, in my opinion, for 3 season use in rain, but I of course haven't had a chance to use the new Mont Bell tents (only an earlier version of the Laser Competition, called the Laserlite).

Still, it is exciting to see a 2-layer version of air permeable Breeze Dry Tec being used in tents. The Dome tents might be really appealing for use in cold snowy conditions. The apparent lack of vents might be an issue, but then again, the air permeability of the fabric plus external poles might be enough to keep condensation at bay.

FYI, Mont Bell makes two differnt flies sold separately that can be used in tandem with the Mighty Dome. One is a full cover version. The other just covers the top of the dome and extends down the side over the door to form a vestibule. That adds about 10 oz. to the weight, but significantly increases the livability and perhaps breathability of the tent in rainy conditions.

Might we be seeing more 2 layer wp/b fabrics turning up in tents? I only wish! MLD for instance is using a 2 layer version of eVENT as an option in their bivies. I suppose this is what was being planned for use in the eVENT version of the Spirit tent that Ron once mentioned (but which sadly seems to have disappeared from the production forecast. I suppose Ron found out it was inappropriate in some way for that use, either because GE wouldn't let him do it, or because the laminate was too fragile for tent use???) Over at Montane, you can find statistics for vapor permeability for 2 layer eVENT that show it is about 20% more breathable than the most breathable 3-layer versions. Wow!

Of course, none of those 2-layer fabrics would US fire retardancy regulations.

Speakin' of which, one of the designers at Exped last year confirmed with me that they are still using eVENT in their Polaris Tent. They call it airVent now to avoid the legal hassles.

Laboratory tests under controlled conditions matching perhaps just one possible temp/RH condition one might actually encounter produce the following numbers which may or may not actually be indicative of one's actual situation when in use:

SD DriZone = 28000gm/m2/24h
eVENT = 27826gm/m2/24h
MB BDT = 15000gm/m2/24h
GTX XCR = 13500gm/m2/24h
MB DLT (driLiteTec) = 12000gm/m2/24h

[seems like all but the eVENT numbers are prob. rounded (up???), but i don't know this – just assuming here]

under the fixed controlled conditions each was tested under (were they even the same conditions, or just the condition that gave the best number???) BDT is ~54% as breathable as eVENT.

how these numbers apply to real-world situations, as well as many and varied conditions is unknown (at least to me in a quantified sense).

pj, those are really convincing numbers on the benefits of eVENT. Id like to be able to quote them when I discuss the benefits of eVENT, so may I ask your source please? Thank you.

Brett, my sources i did not notate in my own notes fr/whence the figures came.

However, i do recall some sources. BPL wrote an OnLine article on fabrics – some number probably came from there. The MB numbers come from the NA MB website – this i am sure of. I came across on the web the diffs b/t diff "flavors" of GTX & took that number from there. The SD # came fr/the SD website last year.

Sorry, i can't provide links. However, i assure you that they all came from Manufacturers websites or the BPL article. I also collected WP #'s for most of those same fabrics at the same time i collected the 'B' (i.e. MVTR) #'s.

Alan Dixon’s BPL article

Brett, look close at the table in the article. XCR has a ~50% higher number than i found on MB website (that’s where the BDT, DTL, & XCR #’s came from).

Notice, too, that there are diff testing methods producing diff. results. This is impt for Epic treated fabrics. They perform poorly in cp. to PTFE/PTFE-PU in some tests, but much better than such in others.

I’m going to reread that article, but i guess the old questions i had, after reading it the first time, will come back again. Wish we had an “Ask Al” chat box, or at least a PodCast on fabrics.

I’m also wondering about the current GTX “flavor of the day”, viz. Respiration+ (postive). How close to eVENT is it really in these tests & in real-world use?

We need a second edition of Mr. Dixon’s excellent article (either from Al or DrC) which will ALSO cover some newer fabrics/versions-of-fabrics, as well as keep the older ones in the discussion for comparison purposes. BPL, Any chance of such an article?

pj, you have probably seen these numbers, maybe even posted them in the past; from an Army study. Cant find the link right off, but Ill edit the post if I find the study..

Summary: Goretex is inferior. eVENT is 4 times more breathable than Goretex XCR at 50% humidity, and is many times more breathable at lower humidity levels.

I've seen it, and some others like it (which have eVENT higher up on the chart – 'bout mid-way, but above GTX XCR). I have your chart saved on my older laptop's HD, but on this one that i'm currently using.

It seems that some fabrics do better on one (or more) test(s), and worse on other tests.

I really don't know much about this area & so just defer to other more knowledgeable individuals on these matters, and follow their advice/suggestions.

Am I correct that all the configurations have only one door!?! How much can an additional zipper and door flap weigh? Maybe 2 ounces? That would be a pretty insignificant increase for a 2, 3, or 4 person tent, but would add much more livability…

MontBell USA carries the now-familiar Diamond and Hexagon tents… their Japanese HQ now offers single-wall counterparts:

In both instances, the single wall versions shave off 5 ounces.

Hi Ben, nice find. I couldn't locate the single wall versions on the Montbell North America site. Could you point me in the right direction? Thanks.

Actually, it's OP (Jon Solomon above) who found these and posted. I merely added the photos. Alas, these single-wall versions are not sold in the US — hence their total absence from MB America's website. I re-read my post above and realized I was causing confusion. I have now edited the wording. Sorry.

If you really want one, you might ask the "Good Samuraitans" on this Forum to buy and ship to you.

If anyone wants a MB tent, I'll ship one for cost plus shipping; and a few bucks for my train ticket and an Asahi beer. :)

Here is the lightweight tent page.
https://www2.montbell.com/japanese/asp/products/Spg_itiran.asp?cat=1204
You can click on each tent to see the weights in g, and divide yen by 120 for dollars. Estimate $10 per 200grams for airmail to the US.

For example, the single wall, floored and enclosed Diamond, weighs 920g,(exclusive of packaging), has a nice big vent at the top, and costs about $206.

Take your time thinking about it; Im not going anywhere..:)

Curse you, Brett, I am trying to break free from the spell of the MB Mighty Dome 1 and I don't need this from you! Um, you wouldn't mind hand carrying one on April 1 to save me some postage would you? (heh heh).

Kidding aside, I got the Marmot Ion windshirt replacement just today. This 2007 model is a completely different animal:

1. 100% poly with DriClime wicking technology
2. Two-tone color – mine is "stellar blue / tempest" (blue/dark blue)
3. Improved breathability and rain resistance (per Marmot)
4. Weight (L): 5 oz

The weight went up! But the fabric feels really good against the skin, unlike the older one with the "nylon ripstop / faux Pertex" plasticky feel. I can overlook the weight increase if this more comfy jacket is also truly more breathable and more rain resistant.

Hi, Brett. Your pimpin' outfit almost has me sold but I must decline your generous offer. I've used the double wall version of the Monoframe Diamond for the past few years and really like it and am curious about the single wall. But I'm not obsessed enough to shell out a couple hundred to save 5 oz.–yet!

Ben, I saw the feathery-light goodness of the Montbell Mighty Dome 1 at the Montbell outlet in Ebisu recently. All I had was my cellphone camera, but I took a couple pics with a 1 liter bottle as a reference. You can see that the tent sack is just a little bigger than the bottle, and in fact, as I squeezed and fondled its packaging, I determined it could squash down flatter at the bottom of your pack. Pole bag is also shown for reference; it is probably best placed in an exterior pack pocket.

As you suggested, I can hand-carry one of these babies back on 1 April to avoid the international shipping charges. Domestic shipping on a free standing 1.26kg tent(!), 1.55kg packaged weight, wouldn't be much, maybe $5?

You still have time to consider it.. muuu haa haaa haa!*

*best attempt at evil laughter

By the way, the MB branded bottles are a great deal at $7!

That dome tent is rather short though huh?…at 79 inches length. If you are anywhere near 6 feet tall you will be touching at both ends unless maybe you sleep on the diagonal. It's even shorter than the BD firstlight.

By my calculation, the MD1 is about 78" long; but its walls join the floor almost perpendicularly, so that's all usable space. I choose the Firstlight, which is 82" long with a similar profile. I don't know how tall "space hog"(his words) Ben is, but maybe he always sleeps curled up in a fetal position clutching his well-worn Montbell catalog? (I know I do ;)

My impression about Montbell tents, based on my experience with the Monoframe Diamond, is that they are designed for people who can fit into the Montbell regular sized sleeping bags, that it, people up to 5'10" in height. This isn't surprising because they were designed for the Japanese market. The average Japanese man is 5'7" tall, so 5'10" would cover a good chunk of the right side of the bell curve without adding additional size and weight. Of course, any of us 5'10" or shorter(I'm 5'9") can take advantage of that fact and enjoy the weight savings and smaller footprint. But if you're a "space hog" you may want to go larger.

Howdy Brett:

Thanks for the pics. The MB sure does pack down small. How come you didn't have one set up and taking a picture of it? :)

Truth be told, I don't do much (any) winter camping. I hate cold weather. But I am always looking for that elusive light and simple tent: single wall solo dome with vestibule weighing 3 lbs or less — that can be used in all seasons.

I've tried the SD Solomente, but its breathable fabric wasn't enough to control condensation in 3-season use. I wonder about MB's Breeze Dry Tec fabric?

I am also looking for a simple solution to tentage; for 3+ season use. Primarily 3 season with maybe one snow say a year.
Each of my previous tents had a flaw, the quarterdome did not have a footprint/fly option, the Halfdome was too heavy, the SD Lightning had no vent (thus it was a sauna), etc.. and I just dont feel comfortable in a tarp; too many experiences with tics, chiggers, fleas, spiders, fire ants, snakes, etc.. Call me a coward, but I like a couple mils of nylon between me and my 0 to 8 legged distant relatives when Im trying to sleep. Especially the 3 inch diameter spiders which swarm over the backcounry of Japan in autumn.. eeeaagghh..
Of course I want this tent to be as light as possible, and free-standing so I can set it up in seconds, move it out of a puddle, find a comfortable spot, set up on bedrock, ice, sand, snow, or anywhere else where driving stakes is inconvenient or impossible.

The firstlight, and similar single wall tents such as the Bibler, MightyDome, and other BlackDiamond offerings seem ideal.
The firstlight is my first single wall tent, and I am hopeful it will become my go-to tent. I dont know yet if the Epic fabric is waterproof 'enough', but I am hopeful.

You don't need a winter tent evidently, but these single wall tents set up in seconds (literally), and are about as light as you can get.
Sorry to blabber on; you know all this. If you dont have a single-wall tent yet, pull the trigger and try one when your budget allows it?
I could not set up the Mightdome because they were about to close, but the Shibuya location has one set up I think; Ill wander over there after work one day..