Seam Welded Gear

I guess several factors play a role. Cost is a first factor of course with the need for specialised equipment. Another factor could be the technological challenge. Although not an expert, I guess not every material currently is suitable for welding and I assume this applies also or even more to lightweight materials like sil-nylon, spintex or cuben.

FWIW, these AC2 packs from Arc'teryx are not welded (like everyone seems to believe), they're stitched. Parts which aren't stitched to the packs are laminated which is a different process than welding.

I'm giving it a year (or two) before it goes main stream. It is only the beginning of a marketing trend.
You'll see more water proof zippers as well.

Just like anything new out there, there will be an unsatiatable thirst for it.

It is only the beginning.

Doug

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The equipment to do seam welding is fairly pricey and there is no secondary market because the machines to do it are so new. That makes it very difficult for smaller companies to get products using seam welding into the market. For the larger retailers tooling up an entire manufacturing facility in these pricey new machines is a major capital investment and they have to make sure they can make money by doing so – again, that makes it hard to "dabble" in a new market since they have to ensure they can make enough volume to keep up with demand of a new product if it's a hit, but without investing insane amounts of money in equipment for a product line that might not be successful.

Whether it is "seem welding" or "laminating" the concept is to place two seperate pieces of material together without stiching. I am not too concerened with the terminology. I am more interested in the resulting functionality and weight savings.

I also think that the Arc Terx pack shown on the front of Backpacker sometime in 06 did NOT have a lot of stiching. That was the whole reason it was lauded.

I do understand the economics at play with ramping up production. It just seems that Black Diamond for example could use this technology for their ultralight shelters so there would no longer be a need for seem sealing…which adds substantial weight as we know.

It seems the real market for this technology is right here on this board. If you think of the companies that play big…Golite, Black Diamond, Montbell, it is probably reasonable to assume they are not packing huge stores of cash to unleash on risky business propositions…BUT what a payoff if one of these medium-sized outdoor companies took the risk. I have to think ounce for ounce you would have some of the strongest packs or lightest waterproof free-standing shelters around.

I have a pair of Patagonia Ready Mix pants that are welded. They are very cool. The only stiches are around the cuffs and waist. The thigh pocket has a water resistant zipper and is welded. They weigh about 10 ounces. I was suprised how much I liked the seams. Very flat and no binding. I wondered why we don't see more of this. I know they are starting to use it in sleeping bags.

I know it is just a detail, but this is what an Arc'teryx employee wrote about a year ago.

<< Hey guys
I'm an actual Dead Bird employee, so here's some of the skinny on the new packs:
We are running a bit behind on the Vancouver assembly line – there were some problems – pretty usual for the introduction of all-new processes and techniques. At least our factory is around the corner from the Design Studio (not on the other side of the world!), so it didn't take long to sort everything out. Good news is that the problems are cleared up and resulted in higher strength than expected on a couple of parts and processes. Bad news is the packs won't be in stores until late May (they were supposed to be shipped mid-April).
Let's correct something here – these do not use welded seams. We haven't been able to create a seam as strong as we want by heating the components. Unlike steel, where a weld can be stronger than the material arround it, we have found that "welding" material with the amount of heat necessary for bonding tends to weaken it. Not good. Nor are the seams fully glued. These packs are still sewn, and then a killer seam sealing process is used that further strengthens the seam and water seals it. So far it's the best process we have found. The pack material is the cool stuff – a urethane trilaminate. It allows components to be glued directly to it. A process we have found to be about 5 times stronger than bar tacking. >>

And about the difference between welding and laminating: although the difference look silly, it's still a difference which can have an influence on the weight. Laminating is a process in which two pieces are fused together by applying glue. Welding, otoh, is a proces by which two pieces are joined together by melting one of the pieces and than joining the two so no glue (and extra weight)needed. For a bunch of people like the members of BPL, who get exstatic when a tarp of 5 ounces is replaced by a tarp of 4 ounces, I guess every gram counts.

Just to clarify some things.

I appreciate the details now!

It seems overall the designers at Arcteryx did not abandon sewing…just "traditional" sewing. In a nut shell, they created a waterproof fabric, determined how to construct a pack with the least amount of pieces, and then sewed it together with glue. Hardly a weight saving/strengthening revolution that the likes of Backpacker and Outside claimed!

Just check out the write up below…or type in Arcteryx and "welded" on google and see how prevelant the false idea really is. Thanks for clarifying…I will stop waiting around for my ultralight welded products now!

>Similar to winning the Super Bowl and the World Series in the same year, the Arc'teryx Naos 55 backpack earned both a 2006 Editor's Choice award from Backpacker magazine and a 2006 Gear of the Year award from Outside magazine. Just like Arc'teryx's past design accomplishments with climbing harnesses, backpacks, and apparel, this latest round of innovations is sure to revolutionize how backpacks are made. To create the Naos 55, the designers at Arc'teryx abandoned traditional sewing techniques. Instead, they endeavored to bond every component, finally achieving this goal with the development of the 420ACT VaporTight™ fabric.<

>The welded construction is great for keeping out water, but it is also tremendously strong, reduces the number of load bearing seams, shaves weight, and provides an appealing, streamlined look.

Interestingly, this welding thing is something brough out by the press, not by Arc'teryx themself. From a pure technologivzl point of view (forget about lightweight for a moment), it's interesting that they can laminate all sorts of components tot the pack body making the manufacturing process easier (just glueing, not sewing anymore). Another point is the monoframe construction. It's not a frame sewed tot a pack, it's a frame inside a pack, bringing the pack and the center of gravity closer to the back. Those things are hardly mentioned in the press.
But I guess that's another story.