gear weights

My WM Ultralite was 28.7ozs, or 0.3 ozs lower than their spec, when I bought it last year. I was disappointed in its warmth and have since had it overstuffed. I think if it had come to me slightly heavier, I would have been more content with it.

In fact, it is common knowledge that certain WM bags are slightly heavier than advertised, and even a little more than 5% in the case of the Versalite.
It wouldn't bother me.

An under-stuff might bother me if I was intending to be pushing the bag to the limits.

I ended up picking the Alpinlite, and it was essentially right at the published weight.

Something like a backpack — I would be pretty upset if actual weight is >5% heavier than spec'ed. The additional weight doesn't really add anything… except additional weight.

Something like a sleep bag, however, I could at least console (fool) myself that I got a warmer bag…

"The additional weight doesn't really add anything… except additional weight."

The gram weinie asks, "What else is there in life?"

A backpack is slightly different. Most of the time there are excess straps that can be trimmed to make it right. I've never trimmed a sleeping bag. I think that is a moral sin against the goose down gods.

–B.G.–

Unless something is custom made, I expect it to be pretty darn close. Items are usually made from patterns and it is easy to weigh the down before stuffing. A great variance would indicate poor quality control or sloppy work. 5% would be a maximum. Lets say a 20 oz quilt comes in at 5% heavier, that is 21 oz. 5% under would be 19 oz, and I would wonder if the down was 5% under (or 1 oz off), which would tick me off.

My WM Ultralight, Nanatak Arc Specialist, and Epiphany all came in right at the expected weight… sort of. The Epiphany was shipped from Minn, and it lost almost 1/2 ounce after living in the desert for a year.

High-end Down-filled articles I would expect to be pretty darn close, as the shell fabrics will be pretty consistent and the manufacturer has a strong incentive to get the down fill weight right (because the down is expensive and they buy it by weight). Synthetic insulated articles are going to be more variable, since the batting itself is not that consistent. Some manufacturers have mentioned this in their product info in the past – saying that actual weights my vary by 5% or something like that. tents and packs I would expect to be pretty close, because again you are dealing with fairly consistent materials. But I would say anything within 2 or 3 percent is likely within the variations of the material. I can't think oanything I've bought that has been outside that.
What bugs me, though, is how rarely you get weights for the various sizes of clothing. The listed weight will often be a medium, and who knows what a large weighs? and since in some cases I might fit a medium and in others a large, comparisons can be hard to make.

I've definitely had this concern. When I got my MB down inner it was nearly a full oz lighter. I wear a small which accounts for most of that but I definitely worried that I may have lost some down. I've since been content with it's warmth.

So yes, I think in the case of down, heavier is usually acceptable (assuming it's within reason…not like Nunatak's jackets consistently coming in an ounce or two more than their very detailed spreadsheets would lead you to believe…). Lighter is worrisome since we pay for down. If we could have a bag/jacket of pure down held together by a magnetic field, we would all be happy!

Synthetics get a pass as a previous poster mentioned the inherent variability in the batting.

Everything else should be spot on or lighter for the size given by the company. Anything else appears dishonest and borderlines on false advertising.

"Anything else appears dishonest and borderlines on false advertising."

Or else poor quality control.

I just purchased a down beanie, and it showed up underweight.

–B.G.–

True on the QC, I'm just used to climbing gear where they spec ultra-conservatively.

Wouldn't that be something, if companies posted the mean weight for a size and the standard deviation (or at least the third std dev above the mean) …not just the weight of their prototypes!

Shame about your beanie, though hopefully it will be warm enough for your purposes still.

"A backpack is slightly different. Most of the time there are excess straps that can be trimmed to make it right. I've never trimmed a sleeping bag. I think that is a moral sin against the goose down gods."

No, not the way I see it. Before I decide on a pack, I already have definite ideas about what and where to trim. So, a pack that is xx ounces overstated will still be xx ounces over my expectation, post surgery. Not good — esp. if manufacturer dishonesty is involved.

"Shame about your beanie, though hopefully it will be warm enough for your purposes still."

10% underweight. I haven't tested it for cold yet.

–B.G.–

As an easy example of the inherent variation in materials alone: I’ve bought a variety of silnylons recently, all listed as 1.1 nylon with coating, total weight 1.4 oz a yd. Some are 1.35, some are about 1.6, some could be 1.45. Varies widely. I can actually tell now by feel which is which, had to a use a good scale to determine that what I was feeling was reality. It was. Tents particularly use a lot of material, so even a small variation in the fabric weight makes any listed weight only an estimation.

Noticed this first on a stuff sack I made, came out several grams heavier than it should have, was the difference in per yard weight of the allegedly 1.4 oz silnylon. At this point, I’d only trust weights after weighing a sample patch of the material. Turned out to actually be 1.6 oz.

See a Norwegian listed Ringstind Light

Weight tent (+/-10%): 1,5kg

Notice the +/- 10%? They have to do that, it’s called truth in advertising, ie, it’s a law, nobody can promise that much material cut by humans and sewn by humans with variable weights in the fabrics can be x grams, but you certainly can promise it will be +/- 10% x grams.

Personally I really wish cottage manufacturers would adopt this type of weight reporting. I saw this 10% variation in my rainbow, in my case, was +2oz, ie, about 7% or so if my math isn’t off. Zero ground of complaint, it’s reality. Or, as a test, cut the same pattern 4 times, weigh the totals each time. Doubt it will be close.

So no, I don’t expect what can’t be delivered, I just wish that fact would be accepted and weights listed more accurately as plus or minus x percent.

I think re sleeping bags, I’d definitely want it heavier than listed than lighter as a rule, lighter can always mean they got the down or fill slightly off, but again, the shell can be off, fabric weights varying etc.

I would guess that when stuff is made in larger production runs, the weights will be closer, since the cutting is probably more automated, and the sewing more consistent, and the materials were sourced and supplied with a bit more control than most cottage people can manage. But I don’t know that for a fact, it’s just a guess that would seem to fit with what I see buying stuff on my own re materials.