Two-way radios

We've done some 22-mile Trans-Sierra dayhikes, and we like to keep one radio at the front of a group, and another one at the back. In case of a sprained ankle, the back needs to warn the front.

There are other options, but we've used GMRS radios (162MHz). There are several good brands and many models. Some will quote a range of ten or twenty miles. The rule of thumb is that you reduce that quoted range by 90% to get a practical range, so here we would be talking about 1 or 2 miles. Even then, terrain can block the signal completely, so you have to be wise about where it is likely to work. Lots of these radios weigh around 5 or 6 ounces each when fully loaded with batteries. Cost is all over the place, maybe $50 per pair plus batteries.

Although you can have a discussion about the antenna, most of them are built with only the standard factory antenna and you can't change anything easily.

–B.G.–

Thanks, Bob. Everything I have read agrees with your range estimation method.

I've done a bit more research, focusing on radios made by Motorola, Uniden, Midland, and Cobra. The reading I've done is disheartening. First, it is very difficult, and often impossible, to find the weight or the wattage for any of these radios. Shipping weights and "maximum range" are the only values available for most of these, and those numbers are useless.

I've skimmed a large number of reviews, and it seems that two-way radios are just not a practical way to communicate in the backcountry in most situations (the scenario Bob described is one exception). If the terrain is mountainous, a good whistle or a deep breath and a shout will carry a distress message over a much greater distance than any two way radio smaller than a toaster. I'm surprised by this.

Also, using the higher powered GMRS channels requires an expensive FCC license, so using a $50 set of radios on GMRS channels actually costs $220 for two people (a 2010 proposal to eliminate the license requirement is still pending).

Despite all of this, I am still considering these models:

a) Motorola MB140r____2.5oz___("10 mi range")
b) Uniden 1636________?_______("16 mi range")
c) Cobra CXT125_______2.50z___("16 mi range")
d) Midland LXT380_____3.2oz___("24 mi range")
e) Midland LXT490_____3.2oz___("26 mi range")

I will probably decide to abandon the idea, given my recent reading, but I would welcome any input about these models.

The GMRS license is $85 for 5 years and can be obtained online.

" d) Midland LXT380_____3.2oz___("24 mi range") "

This is the model that we selected for the last trip. You will find that the listed weight is the 'empty' weight, and then you add batteries, so you are carrying about 5 or 6 ounces per unit. On previous trips, we have used older models with shorter maximum range.

You might ask the question of how or why they get different maximum ranges. The electronics are similar. The antennas are similar. The receiver sensitivity is similar from unit to unit. It turns out that some of these use maybe three AAA batteries, and others use maybe four AAA batteries. You get different power from those battery systems, and that is one of the primary factors toward the maximum range. Some use a proprietary battery system, and we decided that we didn't want that.

Yes, when you are just walking along on a forest trail, expect to get no more than one tenth of the maximum range. Maybe not even that. We did one of these in Death Valley one November. I was high up on the Telescope Peak ridge, and the guy I was talking to was way down on the desert floor. As the crow flies, that had to be over 10-12 miles, but there was nothing but free space between us.

–B.G.–

Although it may be overkill for your situation, have you considered obtaining FCC Amateur Radio Licenses? The Technician (entry level) class only involves a 35 question multiple choice test (mostly basics in radio theory, regulations, and a good understanding to get you on the air) and cost very little or nothing to obtain.

The benefit of Amateur Radio is that you have much more capability and choice of equipment, including less restrictions on transmitted power. For example, many handhelds are dual band and can utilize both VHF and UHF and have up to 5w output. There are even thousands of VHF and UHF repeaters (which are kind of like cell towers for 2 way radios) across the country to extend the range if you can "hit" them.

My experience is that VHF is more reliable in mountains, such as the 2m 144-148MHz band. Lightweight radios such as the Yaesu VX3R may be ideal for your application.

EDIT: Better "Aftermarket" whip and even external antennas are an absolute yes for Amateur Radio handheld transceivers.

Ryan, this is an interesting alternative. I know nothing whatsoever about radio, though. Tranceivers like the Yaesu VX3R can be used just like two-way FRS/GMRS radios to communicate between two people in the mountains? That model is 4.6 ounces including the battery, which is in the same weight neighborhood as the lightest FRS/GMRS radios I was considering. It is five times the price of those others, though. It would cost $400 and require some study to obtain and use two of the Yaesu radios.

My principal complaint about the FRS/GMRS radios is their short range. An investment in something like the Yaesu would only be justifiable for me if it offered an enormous improvement in range over the FRS/GMRS radios. Can the Yaesu (or similar tranceivers) offer this?

Thanks for the suggestion, by the way. I'm interested in this idea.

Yaesu VX3R and similar ham radios work nicely if you are in an area with 2-meter repeaters. So, before committing to such a solution, you might investigate whether 2-meter repeaters exist in the areas where you might be hiking.

–B.G.–

The benefit of using 2 meter radios or any amateur radio for that matter, is that you are not tied to repeaters only or simplex only, and you have a greater bandwidth available to your communication needs. The radios are significantly better as well.

Colin, Amateur Radio is a very versatile tool and can be well worth getting the basic license, whether you use it strictly as a means of communication or grow to find it is an enjoyable hobby. I use it both for tactical communications and for fun, such as talking to other people around the world on HF (Shortwave) radio.

Regarding performance over other systems, the nature of VHF and UHF signals is generally line of sight with the longer VHF wavelengths having better ability to "bounce" off objects such as terrain. UHF wavelengths are more easily absorbed by vegetation and terrain thus reducing the effective range. This is why I prefer VHF in hilly areas, it seems to work better.

Regarding Simplex vs Duplex: Simplex is using a single frequency radio to radio. Duplex is using two frequencies, such as for a repeater that has input and output channels that is usually automatically accounted for by the radios. In the mountains, you will probably find that repeater coverage can be good to nonexistent and will usually need to operate simplex, radio to radio directly. Being up high on a ridge above average terrain will increase your range tremendously as it may be line of sight. This works no matter what type of VHF/UHF radio device you are using.

There are many other lightweight Amateur transceivers out there with varying costs and feature sets. Some can even be had used if you look around on auction sites and ham radio forums.

And I would for sure agree with Chris that Amateur Transceivers are better radios than their unlicensed counterparts. Some of them are actually commercial grade put on ham frequencies with different stickers.

"Amateur Transceivers are better radios than their unlicensed counterparts."

Ryan, I believe the discussion was Amateur versus GMRS. Both are licensed.

–B.G.–

I'd look at the power of the transmitter as opposed to the advertised "range". GMRS radios typically come in 1,2, or 5 watt versions. Find one that can send at 5 watts. Some even have selectable powers, to transmit at a lower or a higher power. (In Canada you don't need a license but the maximum transmitting power is only 2 watts).

Try to be smart with using them. Typically transmitting is the largest power draw. If possible and convenient, try find higher ground and/or better line-of-sight to where your recipient is standing, hold the device so that the antenna is vertical. Take a moment and compose yourself and think of what you are going to say before saying it, press the button down firmly, wait a second, then say your message slowly and clearly. No need to talk to loud, just clear and slow.

I do a lot of geological field work with these radios. When people just lackadaisically hold them in one hand horizontally far from their mouth, press the transmit button at the exact same time that they start spewing a rambling message at the pace of a rapper and then do the exact same procedure when you ask them to say again it is quite frustrating.

Sorry to create confusion Bob, you are indeed correct that both are licensed. By unlicensed I should have specified FRS with it's effective radiated power limitations compared to other options.

Yes, FRS was sort of one choice some years ago, but its power is not great, and that translates in range.

Many years ago I was an Army comm chief, and our FM radios worked over 30-75 MHz. If we had a long range to cover over mountainous terrain, we switched down toward the 30 MHz end, and we tended to use the 75 MHz end for much shorter uses. Now, of course, Amateur bands are higher than that, and GMRS are much higher.

I guess we will all end up with satellite phones for this purpose someday.

–B.G.–

That is neat Bob, I have seen some guys playing around with old PRC-25/77’s and PRC-68’s on the Amateur 6m (50-54MHz) band. That stretch of wavelengths has some interesting characteristics, VHF LOS for short distance and long distance hops by F layer reflection when ionospheric conditions are good. Many modern Amateur handhelds have 6m FM but we don’t use it very often, mostly due to the inefficiency of portable radio antennas at those much longer wavelengths. Amateur FM on the higher end of 10m (29MHz) band can be fun when propagation permits, crystal clear quality over thousands of miles at times!

Regarding transceivers for the OP, here is an inexpensive but decent VHF/UHF dual band Amateur handheld that has become popular in recent years. They may not have the big name brand of their Japanese cousins (Yaesu, Icom, Kenwood…) but have proven to be reliable at a fraction of the cost. I have a similar model that weighs 9.6oz with a better antenna.

"PRC-25"

Yup. They don't make them like they used to.

One day, the ionospheric conditions set up, and the "skip" came booming in from thousands of miles away. Almost scared the krap out of me.

Carrying that kind of heavy military equipment on my back is what prepared me for a later career as a backpacker. In fact, my total load now is about the same as what one PRC-25 weighed back then.

–B.G.–