Topic

Gear Primer for Newbies

  • This topic is empty.
Viewing 21 posts - 1 through 21 (of 21 total)
PostedJan 13, 2012 at 12:15 pm

Hey all,

This year I've started building up my first set of gear. I'm a single, full-time student on a budget. I've been camping my whole life, but never backpacking. I have a friend who backpacks and was my initial advisor, but his philosophy is traditional and I want to go lightweight. He also shops exclusively at REI and I have yet to come across an item of theirs in my research that is the best for the price. I like them, but it seems easy to find better gear for better prices elsewhere. I've done a lot of research and thus far have:

ULA Circuit backpack
Slumberjack Ultimate 20F sleeping bag
Montane Light Speed jacket
Petzt e+LITE headlamp

I'm considering the Tarptent Double Rainbow as my shelter.

I'm fairly at a loss as to where to go after that. The gear lists and articles on this site are incredibly informative, but as a newbie it's sometimes difficult to distinguish the core items that are required for any backpacking trip from those that are recommended but not necessary from those that are entirely optional. Some are obvious of course, but not all. Clothing especially seems to vary widely from one list to another. Since I've never really been out there, knowing — for instance — whether my Asics running shoes would be a good choice for a 3-day trip in the Sierras or would I have to buy hiking boots is tough to figure out. If I do go with my running shoes, what kind of socks should I wear (does it matter?) and what kind of terrain would I have to avoid (if any)? I've never used a sleeping pad; what do the different types feel like and what conditions are they each designed for? What are the practical pros and cons of paper maps vs GPS devices? Do the latter often have problems acquiring a signal?

I think that some kind of primer for newbies would be an excellent addition to the site. Something that breaks down each category of gear and explains the needs each piece of gear meets, which are necessary, recommended and optional(and why). An accessible guide that acts as a truly informative starting point for those just getting into backpacking.

Whaddya think?

Konrad . BPL Member
PostedJan 13, 2012 at 12:41 pm

Jason, there are a few primers existing on this site…but they are articles available only to subscribing members. I think it's well worth the $25 asking price, to save yourself all the time and frustration (and $$$) that comes with buying wrong/heavier equipment the first time around.

Likewise, Andrew Skurka is releasing his first book next month (roughly $20). He captures the essence of lightweight efficient travel, and I'm sure his scope of knowledge over the subject matter is ever-encompassing. I predict this will serve as an awesome manual for those looking to get equipped.

Mike Clelland also has a couple of really great books out there that will give you a good start and help refine your kit. I know his books have discussed every question you raised in your original post.

Between the articles and publications I listed, in combination with the free forums, you'll have all the primer knowledge you could ask for.

spelt with a t BPL Member
PostedJan 13, 2012 at 12:48 pm

The e-lite is expensive for the amount of light of you get. There are cheaper options like clip on/keychain LEDs that will give you the same amount of light, and also much more robust lights for not much more money.

http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/xdpy/forum_thread/44416/index.html

http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/xdpy/forum_thread/55285/index.html

http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/xdpy/forum_thread/53976/index.html

Edit: huge +1 on trolling (in the traditional sense) the forums and making liberal use of the search function. TBH, the primers I bought–dead tree books on lightweight backpacking–got one read and then went on the shelf, with the notable exceptions of Allen and Mike (Clelland)'s Really Cool Backpacking and Really Cool Backcountry Skiing books.

Eric Lundquist BPL Member
PostedJan 13, 2012 at 12:48 pm

Many of the gear lists you’ll find here start to look alike after a while due to a consensus as to what works best in the field for lightweight backpacking. I’d recommend purchasing some books about the subject. Mike Clelland has published a few good books which give you the essentials to backpacking and his reasons for bringing a certain item and reasons for not bringing others. Andrew Skurka’s newly release book would likely have similar content and opinions.

Clothing seems to be one of the more difficult things to figure out. For me, I don’t mind sleeping in my hiking clothes. Other people want a pair of pants and a clean shirt to sleep in. Its a personal thing.

My clothing setup for the Sierras (3-Season):
Worn – Nylon hiking pants
Worn – Synthetic boxer-briefs
Worn – Longsleeve wool shirt
Worn – Sun hat
Worn – Quick drying running socks
Worn – Trail runners
Packed – Down jacket
Packed – Long underwear (midweight)
Packed – Extra socks
Packed – Lightweight liner gloves
Packed – Warm hat or Buff

Take a look at my gear list for what I carry. There is a remarks category that explains most of my choices.

Some hikers find that regular running shoes to be adequate for off trail hiking, but I find that the trail-running variety to have a better grip. For sleeping pads, it kinda depends on your comfort level first. What do you use when you go camping? I find that an inflatable mattress is more comfortable and therefore I sleep better. A lot more people don’t need the extra cushion and go with a thin foam pad. Again, I feel this is a personal thing. Purchasing a pad at REI would be a good idea as you could start with a blue foam pad/Ridgerest/Z-Rest and see if it is comfortable for you to sleep on. If it isn’t they have a good return policy and you could try a different model. As for the GPS, if you’re on established routes and can read a map (you should know how to read a map) then I wouldn’t bring one. I would only consider bringing one when going off-route, going in winter, or where visibility would make map reading impossible due to fog/clouds.

Tony Wong BPL Member
PostedJan 13, 2012 at 1:21 pm

Jason,

Welcome to BPL & the Forums!

Great suggestions and hopefully the BPL staff will make changes later this year to have a better way to access all the key information that a newbie would need to get started on their lightweight transition from traditional gear.

Maybe this might help when it comes to the issue of clothing: The layers of clothing you might want to have and when to use them vs. a list of specific gear to buy. Theory of Clothing?

1. Base Layer/next to skin for sleeping in and light enough to hike in on cold days
Example: light weight merino wool thermals

2. Outer layer: Synthetic, Hiking Pants and Synthetic Long Sleeve Shirt
Light weight, quick drying and durable: Lots of REI options

3. Insulating Layer for Warmth synthetic or down based on your location/weather
Example: Light weight jacket for in camp or taking a break on the trail; fleece
Optional: Insulating pants for shoulder season/winter trips

4. Optional: Windshirt for warmth while hiking when Insulating layer would be too hot
Negatives: Typically not breatheable, not waterproof- could overlap rain gear

5. Rain Gear/Waterproof Layer: Tops, Bottoms- optional: Rain Mitts & Pack Cover

6. Insulating Accessories: Hat, Gloves, Sleeping Socks (optional)
Example: Fleece gloves and hat….wool or down socks for sleeping

Basically, think of your clothing as 4 or 5 layers that you can mix and match as conditions warrent.

Base Layer

Outer layer

Insulating layer including hat & gloves

Waterproof Layer

Optional Windproof Layer

Hope this helps.

Others may have other ways of doing it, but this is my understanding of layering up and what works for me.

+1 on buying a subscription. With limited funds, you want each dollar to count and a subscription will go a long way to help you avoiding making bad purchases and wasting money.

P.S. Hiking sock, I consider standard clothing like hiking pants and shirt.

-Tony

James holden BPL Member
PostedJan 13, 2012 at 1:29 pm

the problem is that no one will agree as everyone has different budgets, usages, conditions an opinions

there are some here who would blindly recommend packs/shoes without even worrying about the fit, others who recommend tarps and bivies without regard to conditions, and others clothing without regard to price … etc …

what i WILL say is that unless you are supremely lucky, you will likely make gear missteps along the way … what works for someone else may be unsuitable for you …

buying from somewhere like REI, although it can be a bit more expensive, allows you to avoid having missteps cost you an arm and a leg … witness all the lightly used gear on gear swap going around, not that you can post there anyways as you arent a member …

the only "usable" advice id tell you … is that dont buy stuff unless you REALLY need it, ask yourself if its really necessary … and if you arent sure make sure you can return it easily ….

and that its often better to spend yr money honing yr techniques, skills and knowledge rather than gear … whether they be trips, courses, guides, etc …

for clothing try mark veber's excellent site … http://www.verber.com/mark/outdoors/gear/clothing.html

Michael Ray BPL Member
PostedJan 13, 2012 at 1:30 pm

The paper I just finished for Scouts may be of use to you. Most of your questions are covered, and I try to keep costs to a minimum. I break down what I consider required vs optional (for Scouts, of course – you can decide differently). See Appendix A for a full gear list.

BTW, the Double Rainbow is a LOT of shelter for 1 so I assume you’ll be having a partner most trips.

James Marco BPL Member
PostedJan 13, 2012 at 3:37 pm

One thing that binds everyone here is their love of being outside and backpacking, particulary light weight packing. From there you get into a LOT of opinions. I'll give you mine, for what it's worth.

The gear you have mentioned is typical of inexperience and lack of good knowledge. It is good gear. But you could do with a lot of different selections and a lot better choices for the same money. Except for the E+Light, more later. That pack is HUGE. I carry about 2500-2800ci for about a week out. The Rainbow is Huge. Nothing wrong with it though. Just bigger than you need for one or two people. The synthetic Slumberjack is cheap, OK, maybe you cannot afford better, but it will only last a few seasons.

Theoretically you should buy the pack last. I would say go ahead and get your pack. But limit it to 3200ci or less. This will work for you for all but extended trips. For more than a week, you want another pack. You will have two packs…so? One for trips up to a week, one for longer trips,ie, two and three weeks. The difference in weight between them will be quite a bit. Around 1pound-1#8 for the small one (handling loads up to 25 pounds,) and, 3#-5# for the larger one, handling loads between 30 and 50 pounds. If you are working, you may not get that much time off. Soo, go with the smaller one at first. The Circuit is 2#4. Trying to be both a light weight pack and a 30 pound weight lifter. Compromise never works as well as specifics.

Synthetic bags loose loft relatively quickly, especially if compressed. If you get one, DO NOT compress it, or, compress it only lightly. 3 or 4 to one by volume. It might last 5 years that way. Once will destroy the loft, loosing about 10F of warmth. And it is heavy at a bit over 4 pounds (4#3.) But the cost is about 15% of a good down bag. Cheap down bags are about the same as good synthetics. Look at Western Mountaineering, Feathered friends, Nanutuk, here in the states. Marmut SS bags are OK. All run about 350-400. All will last a lifetime. Figure out wich is worth it over a few years… Good down is far lighter. About 1/2 or somewhat less. My 0F bag weighs less than 3/4 of your proposed Slumberjack 20. And it is lifetime guaranteed. Your bag will be the single largest expense. If you cannot afford a good down bag, Go with a cheaper down bag. They are more compressable at least. These usually cost about $100. If you are broke, then by all means…go with the slumberjack, just assume you will replace it as soon as you can.

I like E+lights. At 3/4ounce, 24-45 hour run time, they are a good choice. Light and good enough light for young eyes. You do not need 60 lumens of beamed light that can let you see for 40 yards. At night, in the woods, you will get a lot of flash back ruining what remains of your night vision with larger lights. Cheap, they work pretty well. They are water proof down to about 10 feet, so rain isn't a problem as it is with a lot of smaller lights. They cost about $25. You can strip them by removing the strap and whistle/buckle, simply clipping them to your hat or on your pack strap for night walking. A spare set of batteries is recommended. A secondary light, like a little 15g impulse(lots of these out there, just make sure it is water proof) lets you work around camp. I clip this to my wrist with a hair tie. I never seem to loose it that way. ABout $10.

Stoves? A cheap homemade alcohol stove, aluminum foil wind screen and K-Mart grease pot works. About $10. I eat right out of the grease pot. Cutting the edging off the lid and clipping the nub off the handle saves a bit of weight. For another $35 you can order a special Caldera Cone for them, but specify one WITHOUT handle cutouts.
A ti spoon, about a table spoon, works. These are about $10. Ethanol and methanol are common fuels. Canisters are the most expensive. White Gas is about the cheapest to run.

A 9×11 tarp will be plenty big enough. Cost should be about $65. Or make your own for about $35. The screen tent should be two person to match your size spec. These run about $80. Again, you can also make your own for about half that.

Water bottles and fuel bottles are reused soda and gatoraid bottles.

Stakes are difficult. Ti stakes are expensive…about $2 each.

You need at least one dry bag for food. This keeps water out of your food. Bear line is 1.5mm line. Smaller cuts into tree bark. Larger is heavier than needed. A small #1 niteize biner works OK. About $10-$12.

Maps or GPS? Well, I prefer a compass and a map. Sometimes a GPS is nice, but generally, I have rarely found it necessary…once in 40 years we missed our mark by about 100ft… Anyway, Thompsons waterseal on paper works well. The little pliers makes a good tool kit…optional.

Lighter, soap, AquaMira, knife, pencil, some paper, a few fire starters, 2-3 bandaids, duct tape, tooth brush, batteries, etc, miscelaneous stuff goes into a small dity bag. This is usually expensive to buy. So, I would say about $30. No, toothpast is NOT necessary. For a few days, no problem.

Camp site selection, bear bag tree selection, general camping lore, well, that would take more words than I know, I'm afraid. Stay on hillocks, or slight mounds, generally. Stay off ridges, rather camp on the leeward side, below a ridge. Don't camp in valleys in colder weather. Use heat reflectors on your back, first. Choose a tree with strong branch, 16' high, 4' away and drop the bag 3'. Avoid eating in camp, unless it is an old, well used campsite. Don't walk on rattle snakes. Don't sleep on scorpions. Keep moving when confronted by bug clouds.

Well, it is a start anyway. Lots of people will disagree…mu opinion only.

Bob Shaver BPL Member
PostedJan 13, 2012 at 7:34 pm

I read most of your paper Michael, and it looks right on. I am a scouter and started backpacking in the 1960s. I don't think there is any wasted word in that paper, and you nailed it. I do carry a pump water filter, a camera that is heavier than it needs to be, and fishing gear. Mind if I send that paper to scouters in a backpacking class for scouters I am teaching?

Bob Shaver
http://www.backpackingtechnology.com

Bob Shaver BPL Member
PostedJan 13, 2012 at 7:38 pm

One of my strategies to keeping my pack light is to get my son to carry the heavy stuff. He is 15 now, and strong as a horse. Hey Jim, you gonna fish. Here then, carry the teflon fry pan would you? And this container of cooking oil. You want to take the dog on this hike? Here then, you carry her sleeping bag please and bowl.

Luke Schmidt BPL Member
PostedJan 13, 2012 at 8:17 pm

Jason if you're on a budget Golite is currently having a big sale, but hurry I doubt it will last long. For someone in your position I would recommend their Pursuit pack instead of the Circuit. Its cheap (for now), yes I now there are lighter packs but the Pursuit is a good pack especially if you are just getting into ultarlight. Since its cheap at the moment you can replace it with something else later if you want to go even lighter. If you want to jump feet firt into UL you could get the Jam or the Peak pack instead. For a shelter I'd buy the Shangri La 1 since its only $80 at the last moment. Those two together save you a lot of money over the Circuit and Tarp Tent. I'd invest the savings in a nice down 20 degree bag.

Dustin Short BPL Member
PostedJan 13, 2012 at 11:58 pm

Jason, I've been there and I know how overwhelming it can be and I have "good" news! It does not matter! Why? Because of this nugget of wisdom that you should take to heart:

No matter what you do, you will be cold. You will get wet. And you will suffer.

(you should probably re-read that last line)

As much as these forums pretend otherwise, Lightweight, UL and SUL are more about skill and experience backpacking than they are about gear. You can only shave weight as you learn how your body responds to varying climatic conditions. Also as you learn how your body works, you find ways to cope with seemingly unpleasant weather better. Like being cold at night can be fixed by either having a warmer (and expensive) down bag or by learning to eat fatty dinners instead of carb dinners, staying hydrated, warmer sleep pad, hot water bottles, crunches, etc.

Until you learn these tricks (and suffering wet and cold nights is a PHENOMENAL way to be taught) all the gear in the world won't help you. That said you do need gear (well at least to practice LNT ethics, else we'd all be bushcrafters a base weight of 1lb for a sweet knife!). Most the gear mentioned on this site is great for long distance thru-hiking, but since you're just starting out and in school I'm assuming most of your trips are going to be fair weather overnighters or 2 nights at most. In these conditions you can usually get by with less durable or less protective gear as long as your willing to cut at trip short if your safety is jeopardized.

First you need to give us an idea of your preferred hiking environment and seasons. When I first started backpacking my second or third overnighter I was able to go SUL, but I live in AZ where climate is very amenable SUL. Without that knowledge I'll assume the standard 3-season desires that work for most the lower 48.

1st: Scrounge anything you can find out of your closet or your friends and family closets. Free has an infinite oz-saved/$ ratio!

2nd: If you can make it, do so. It doesn't have to look great just function. Fancy Feast alcohol stove. Tyvek anything, or learn to sew. This route with cheap tyvek or 2nd quality nylon can save a lot of money (but costs time).

2nd purchase: Trekking poles. Used for many shelters and great for saving your knees on downhills. Personally my hiking days became far more comfortable when I started using poles (I could hike longer, faster, and with less pain from ITB issues than without them). Also trail runners, but any running shoe will work on maintained trails really.

3rd: Shelter, sleeping, pack are the specific gear needed to sleep in the backcountry. Your desires WILL change the more your backpack and as you dial in your gear system.

3a) Spend as much money on a sleeping bag/quilt as you can if you can't borrow one or don't have one already. Quilt vs Bag is simply a preference, I'd recommend bag because it's a safer purchase (ie less likely buyer's remorse than a quilt if you can't stand drafts).

3b) A big blue tarp from REI, not the lightest but definitely cheap, will probably work for most situations. A MYOG bivy can be made using tyvek and tyvek tape to provide a bit extra water protection in really bad storms. Any backpack big enough to hold your gear will work. Spend real money when you get a system dialed in. A sleeping pad is critical for staying warm at night (most newbies overlook this, I know I did) so I'd suggest at least a thermarest SOLite for 3 season. There are lighter, better options but the SOLite is also thick enough to be decently comfortable until you learn more about how you sleep outside.

4) Insulation. Fleece is heavy and bulky but you probably already own some and it is warm. This is where I would suggest spending your money first on a down hooded jacket that will work in 3 season use (especially if you find one on sale/used). Keeps you warm in camp and makes your sleeping bag warmer for those unexpectedly cold nights. It provides one of the most significant VOLUME reductions for the money.

5) A windshirt. People love them for a reason. Very light but great for keeping you warm in the day and depending on the DWR will keep you dry during a brief sprinkle. They can also be found somewhat inexpensive.

6) Sleeping pad. You should by this point have a better idea of how you sleep. If you find you're usually warm and comfortable then getting a GG Torsolite and thinlight may be a very cheap but huge weight savings for you. If you find you're a side sleeper and often wake up achey and cold then getting a properly warm and comfortable pad will greatly improve your sleep (neoairs, a down air mat, etc.) Not as much weight savings from standard CCFs but comfort definitely goes up which may be important.

7) Now things get iffy. Depending on what you've scrounged or made now might be the time to drop some serious cash and get a high quality down sleeping bag/quilt (you can make a synth quilt easy enough). If you're MYOG handy then a down quilt is an option too. This should be a lifetime purchase that will handle the vast majority of 3-season situations around the globe. A quality 20F bag will usually fit that bill (you'll need supplemental insulation if you live in colder climes) but at this point you'll know better.

8) A pack. Whatever fits your gear, is light, and comfortable for your style. Whether more traditional like an Osprey, or frameless like a bazillion cottage manufacturers. People seem to swap lightweight packs a lot so I'm not sure they're worth spending too much money on, but I'm a heathen and like a light framed pack.

9) Shelter. again your style comes to play. If at this point you hike in groups maybe a bigger pyramid is merited, or if you're usually solo and masochist maybe the tiniest cuben fiber tarp will become your go to shelter.

10) Everything else like fancy baselayers, a couple $300 rain jackets, winter gear, titanium swords…etc

This is again a very biased guide but I tried to incorporate the fact that your preferences will change dramatically over a short time. Personally I wish I had followed this order because it would have saved me a lot of money.

One last piece of gear buying advice, buy gear only for a trip. By that I mean if you have a trip planned, then buy a gear that will directly benefit that trip (maybe you'll need a warm bag, maybe you'll need rain gear, maybe you'll want to test tarps…). That way when ever you just want to buy more gear, then plan a trip first. It gets you outside far more often ;)

Michael Ray BPL Member
PostedJan 14, 2012 at 7:45 am

Bob,
Thank you for the kind words. That makes me feel better that I nailed it in at least someone's mind other than my own. :) Feel free to share it as you see fit, and let me know how I can improve it. I'd like to extend it for the whole lower 48 in any season, too.

Link . BPL Member
PostedJan 14, 2012 at 7:58 am

Same post I put in your other thread but here it is again,as others have said you could learn a lot from Mike Clelland's books and free videos

watch these and get his book it could really help you save some weight and money

http://ultralightbackpackintips.blogspot.com/2011/07/video-tutorials.html

more free videos

http://gossamergear.com/wp/support/videos

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fWbYnTRBfww

http://blackwoodspress.com/blog/topics/backpacking-videos/

this one is $5

http://gossamergear.com/etc/books-dvd/lighten-up-dvd.html

Michael Ray BPL Member
PostedJan 14, 2012 at 8:27 am

Jason,
Dustin has some good advice though I haven’t been cold or wet yet. I did do LOTS of research here first before my first trip and since then though. I’ve been blessed with only a few thunder and hail storms though.

Anyway, as someone else who also started out on the cheap (for the most part), I’ll explain the rationale for my choices for main gear even though you have everything except for pad and shelter at this point. Knowing I couldn’t afford to buy multiples of most gear, I wanted something that could handle ANY situation I might be in. That ranged from hot, humid summers to 0 F, solo to Scout treks.

Thus, since I had no pack, I went with the Golite Pinnacle. Fairly heavy at 34 oz (I’ve since reduced it to 28) but capable of taking 25-72 liters, can handle lots of abuse and was only $90 on sale. I’ve been very happy with it for the most part. Struggles past 30 pounds unless you modify the suspension (sleeping pad burrito or add corrugated plastic panel).

Bag I knew it had to be down and my weight limit was 2 lbs. Found the REI Sub Kilo 20 F on sale for $120. Been very happy with it also. I use it as a quilt mostly.

Shelter I chose the SMD Lunar Duo. I hoped eventually my wife would be with me and doubted she’d go for floorless (though I honestly didn’t ask – tsk, tsk) so I wanted a roomy, fully enclosed 2-person and it was between this and Double Rainbow you’re considering. I’ve been happy with it though I hardly ever use it. I did a MYOG solo shelter so now the LD only goes when I have one or both boys with me, which will start happening more.

Pad I knew had to be an inflatable as an aging side-sleeper. This was the hardest for me as I didn’t have a lot of time to research. I knew it had to be somewhat insulated but couldn’t afford the cost of the better ones so I ended up with a POE X-lite Thermo knockoff from campmor. Heavy (24 oz I think), but only $50. I’ve since upgraded to a used small Neoair.

My clothing all started with whatever cheap synthetics I could find at Walmart, Goodwill, BigLots. Shoes were cheap running shoes from Walmart.

They are long, but I made a series of videos on the gear I used (or changed) for all 3 of my major trips. They may be of use to you to see what I took and why. The first one is GSMNP Gear Part 1.

I hope to make a pack and newer version of my shelter and maybe a true quilt as some point in the next 2 years. Then I’ll easily hit the 10 pound base weight mark.

Have fun on your adventures, and welcome to BPL, too!

diego dean BPL Member
PostedJan 14, 2012 at 9:03 am

Michael,

That is an excellent piece of work. Would you mind me sharing this with my father who is a leader with a local troop. I'm an Eagle Scout from the 90's and I wish I had this information at the time.

Great job!

Michael Ray BPL Member
PostedJan 14, 2012 at 10:45 am

Diego,
Please share it. I am making a few minor revs as we speak so you might wait another day to get the latest version. Let me know if there's anything I should change ASAP. :)

PostedJan 16, 2012 at 10:48 pm

Thanks for the replies everyone. I have been reading the posted links and am getting a lot of much needed information. I'm very glad I found this site.

Viewing 21 posts - 1 through 21 (of 21 total)
Loading...