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Minimalism


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Viewing 11 posts - 26 through 36 (of 36 total)
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  • #1824932
    James holden
    BPL Member

    @bearbreeder-2

    all i need is a platinum card … nothing more UL than that ;)

    #1825298
    James Moughan
    Member

    @jamougha

    Minimalism often seems like just another excuse to obsess over gear.

    #1825356
    Dale Wambaugh
    BPL Member

    @dwambaugh

    Locale: Pacific Northwest

    Miguel,

    I guess there are always issues with a famous person's life. It comes to mind today thinking of Martin Luther King Jr. It is still surprising to see this photo when considering the impact that Gandhi made on the world. Think of a similar photo for Bill gates or Paul Allen.

    #1825774
    Kenny R.
    Spectator

    @k1t0r5

    Locale: Florida

    I agree with much of what's been posted here and agree that it is all to easy to fall into the trap of accumulating possessions. With that said, I do feel like I need to play devil's advocate and point out one glaring thing – having minimal *physical* possessions does not mean that one is living a minimal lifestyle.

    For example, the young man in the original post is carrying a laptop and apparently runs a business using it. If you took away that laptop and made him carry the analog equivalent of all the tools and documents contained within the laptop, all of a sudden he has tens of thousands (if not millions) of things. It is his calculator, mailbox, pen & paper, television, library, and a million other possible things. You can just as easily over-analyze and agonize over how you organize and access digital possessions as you can over how to arrange your gear closet.

    As much as we forget it, a computer desktop is conceptually the same thing as its physical namesake. I thought about this the other day while working. My actual desk at work literally has nothing on it except for my computer and the analog devices related to it. No pictures, business card holders, stacks of papers, or any other typical desk items. If you judged my work environment by just looking at the desk, you would think I'm organized and efficient, while refusing to put things on the desk just for the sake of putting them there. Yet, I thought about how sifting through the endless clutter of folders and subfolders to find certain documents and files on my computer is no less mentally taxing and draining than searching for physical files. Yes the computer allows us to access these things much faster, but to keep an accurate mental model of where everything is on your computer and how to go about accomplishing a certain task using it is just as mentally taxing and draining as having large amounts of physical clutter. A lack of physical clutter does not mean a lack of mental clutter.

    If you think about it that way, the main difference between the young man's lifestyle in the OP and the lifestyle of most young men his age (myself included) is that he is simply using other people's things to live a complicated lifestyle, rather than using his own things. I guess my point is that minimalism in the sense of physical possessions does not equal simplicity. Just because he doesn't own a bed, cooking utensils, car, etc doesn't mean he's not using these things every day.

    This is pretty much echoing what Ben 2 World said, but is it truly a minimal lifestyle if you're still living with all the modern conveniences and interacting with thousands of objects everyday just like anyone else does?

    EDIT: I'd like to add that, personally, I can certainly appreciate reducing the number of physical possessions so long as it helps simplify my life. I regularly load up trash bags full clothes and other things I don't use so that I can donate them. Getting rid of things I don't use or things I think I need helps to simplify my life. I would never get rid of something just for the sake of getting rid of it if that would necessarily complicate my life in some way. For example, I could certainly get by with 1 or 2 pairs of underwear instead of having 12 of the same kind, but to me it's much simpler and easier to do laundry once every 1-2 weeks instead of having to hand wash something everyday. Also, doing something drastic like ditching my bed and my apartment would require that I constantly search for the next couch to sleep on or hotel to stay at. That doesn't seem to simplify things for me.

    I take a similar approach to lightweight backpacking; I'm all for reducing my pack weight, but I draw the line when further reducing my weight on an item would necessarily make things more complicated. I guess you could say I look for the sweet spot of minimal weight with minimal "fiddling".

    #1825822
    Dale Wambaugh
    BPL Member

    @dwambaugh

    Locale: Pacific Northwest

    James wrote, "Minimalism often seems like just another excuse to obsess over gear."

    Indeed! That is why I call it hypermaterialism. It takes the moral high ground I think, because it emphasizes quality over quantity, and if practiced more universally would alter our lives in a positive way. That goes for home and office as well as hiking.

    Social conventions definitely add to our clothing. We have our hiking clothing, casual town stuff, and more formal items like suits. There are all the corresponding accessories like belts, socks and shoes to go with. If you go to a less formal lifestyle, you can easily chuck half your clothing. The UL parallel is having extra changes of clothing or sleep-specific clothing.

    In the home, it isn't unusual to see several sets of dishes, one for everyday, maybe one for party stuff and yet another more formal "heirloom" set. And there are accessories to go along with each. You can easily overwhelm your kitchen with gadgets, just like your camping gear. Going to the workshop or garage and you can see the same.

    Consumer electronics seem to be trending to smaller, more multi-function devices. I could get by quite nicely with a laptop and USB television tuner. It struck me the other day that sales of high end audio must be dropping. I'm guessing that the big amplifiers and speakers so coveted in my younger days are not as much in demand with computers and TV with surround sound and DVD players that do audio as well as video. Of course the whole Ipod/Smartphone trend has totally changed the music industry.

    As to the fellow who is traveling with a minimal kit, I don't think he is "cheating" by couch camping. If any of us were traveling, we would be staying in friends homes or rented rooms and eating in restaurants. The point is that you don't need to travel with a ton of stuff and three big suitcases. Look around at the ticket counters in any airport and you will see people bringing in stacks of luggage. A very few savvy travelers will have one carry on and nothing else.

    #1825837
    Ike Jutkowitz
    BPL Member

    @ike

    Locale: Central Michigan

    I really enjoyed this link and the excellent discussion that followed. It's a topic I've put a lot of thought towards in the last couple years, though with a wife and two kids, it can only go so far for me.

    While this guy has a fair number of detractors, I think some may be missing the point. It's not so much about the number or type of possessions he's got, but the freedom that comes from living with less. It's not that he "has" to couch surf so that he can claim to be a minimalist, it is that he is able to experience new locations, people, and adventures, to come and go freely, because he has less. He doesn't need to work 80 hours a week to pay for his possessions and lifestyle choices.

    I don't think he's being a sponge either. I think the people he stays with probably consider it a fair trade to host him and share conversation about his experiences, much as most of us would be happy to put up a fellow backpacker and enjoy the conversation that ensued.

    It sounds like it's an experiment for him, and I'm sure that one day the pendulum may swing and he will settle down in one spot. But when he does, I bet he maintains a different perspective on home and possessions, much like Hig and Erin, or professional thru-hikers.

    It's great that people like this exist, to get us talking and thinking about other ways of doing things, whether or not the choices they make would be the right ones for us.

    #1825917
    Anonymous
    Inactive

    "It's great that people like this exist, to get us talking and thinking about other ways of doing things, whether or not the choices they make would be the right ones for us."

    +1 And I enjoyed your entire post, Ike. Very thoughtful.

    #1830868
    clay stewart
    Member

    @reluctantwaterhauler

    http://andrewhy.de/minimalism-project-update-39-things/

    I noticed an update. The moral of the story might be, don't take a job at a dude ranch, don't take up backpacking and never, never sell a friend a car on the nothing down, nothing a month plan, or you'll end up with the car again.:)

    #1832401
    Chris Arnold
    Member

    @christopheractual

    Locale: Oregon, USA

    This is my thoughts. I'm a minimalist by nature but I own what I need. I've read some ULers blogs saying they don't carry this or that because they can just borrow it when they need it. I'll never get that logic nor will I loan any of my gear to someone that does that by choice. Being wet, cold, or hungry is a good motivator to get people to maybe add an ounce or two for something that they actually need. There's a balance to be struck and this guy(and some ULers) have missed it.

    And before anyone jumps on me I will, of course, help somebody that actually needs it.

    #1832403
    Chris Arnold
    Member

    @christopheractual

    Locale: Oregon, USA

    Oops. Still trying to get the hang of the software. This quote by Clay is what I wanted to add to my previous post.

    "I like his idea, but it doesn't seem like he is interested in self contained minimalism. I suspect, without a sleeping bag, pad or shelter, he has to either eat out every day and stay in a Holiday Inn Express, or mooch off of other people. I've met people like that over the years and although the idea is quaint, the constant "hey can I sleep on your couch or use your washer or borrow your shower, catch a ride, etc.," makes their minimalism more of a at other peoples expense endeavor. Looks good on paper, till you start to really think about it."

    #1832585
    Dale Wambaugh
    BPL Member

    @dwambaugh

    Locale: Pacific Northwest

    Clay wrote, "I noticed an update. The moral of the story might be, don't take a job at a dude ranch, don't take up backpacking and never, never sell a friend a car on the nothing down, nothing a month plan, or you'll end up with the car again.:)"

    He's still living well over on the simple side of things. Getting a job on a dude ranch doesn't mean squat to getting married, buying a house and raising a couple kids!

Viewing 11 posts - 26 through 36 (of 36 total)
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